Air consumption

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So... don't complicate the matter with "Need" for O2... There IS NO NEED... the body gets all the oxygen it needs. It NEEDS to expel CO2... This i the difficult part.

So an overweighted, poorly streamlined diver, swinging their arms like crazy, and inefficiently finning at top speed has the same metabolic need/demand for O2 as a streamlined, properly weighted diver, hovering motionless in the water column? (PS - you may want look into the difference between inspiration and respiration. One is mechanical, one is metabolic.)

---------- Post added March 22nd, 2015 at 08:39 PM ----------

Do not fool yourself into thinking the BMI is not a useful tool just because pro ball players do not fit into the charts, technically, they are obese and if you did a body fat percentage I bet many of them would show it. I think a healthy number is under 17% for a fit adult male.

BMI does not concern itself with what the composition of the body's mass. It's a number. Like any number it's of limited utility in and of itself. From a pure number standpoint, at 5'10" and 210lbs, THIS guy would be "obese" according to a BMI chart...

f809f57663c4a03dc1638e5f78512f50.jpg
 
BMI is not a useful tool for measuring an individual, it's a population statistic. This was clearly stated by the developer of BMI, Adolphe Quetelet and by Ansel Keyes, who popularized it in the US.
 
It is a known issue that the BMI alone is not the whole story and that it does not work with certain types of athletes. But the fact also remains that their hearts have to pump through all of that mass. The OP is not a pro ball player who makes his money abusing his body (and probably taking HGH). If you look at a lot of the pro players, they are carrying some jelly around their belly. Check with them again in an another twenty years and see how they are doing.

Do not fool yourself into thinking the BMI is not a useful tool just because pro ball players do not fit into the charts, technically, they are obese and if you did a body fat percentage I bet many of them would show it. I think a healthy number is under 17% for a fit adult male.

N

Try reading what I wrote a little more carefully. I will repeat some of the key points.

1. With an accurately measured body fat of 16%, I was nearly obese on the BMI scale.

2. According to that body fat measurement analysis I received, I would have still been overweight according to the BMI if my body fat percentage was 0%.

I am not anything close to a pro athlete, but the BMI was not remotely accurate for me.

But why take my word for it? I just did a quick Google search and found the following reputable sources saying the same thing. I would have made a list of the sites saying it was a good and accurate measure, but I couldn't find any.

How Accurate Is Body Mass Index, or BMI?
Why BMI Isn’t The Best Measure for Weight (or Health) | TIME.com
Why BMI is inaccurate and misleading Medical News Today
Top 10 Reasons Why The BMI Is Bogus : NPR
Is BMI an Accurate Measure of Obesity? - HowStuffWorks
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2877506/
http://www.thecalculatorsite.com/articles/health/alternatives-to-bmi.php
http://www.livescience.com/39097-bmi-not-accurate-health-measure.html
 
Try reading what I wrote a little more carefully. I will repeat some of the key points.

1. With an accurately measured body fat of 16%, I was nearly obese on the BMI scale.

2. According to that body fat measurement analysis I received, I would have still been overweight according to the BMI if my body fat percentage was 0%.

I am not anything close to a pro athlete, but the BMI was not remotely accurate for me.

But why take my word for it? I just did a quick Google search and found the following reputable sources saying the same thing. I would have made a list of the sites saying it was a good and accurate measure, but I couldn't find any.

How Accurate Is Body Mass Index, or BMI?
Why BMI Isn’t The Best Measure for Weight (or Health) | TIME.com
Why BMI is inaccurate and misleading Medical News Today
Top 10 Reasons Why The BMI Is Bogus : NPR
Is BMI an Accurate Measure of Obesity? - HowStuffWorks
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2877506/
http://www.thecalculatorsite.com/articles/health/alternatives-to-bmi.php
http://www.livescience.com/39097-bmi-not-accurate-health-measure.html

Please stop making sense, it doesn't have a place here on the boards.
 
So an overweighted, poorly streamlined diver, swinging their arms like crazy, and inefficiently finning at top speed has the same metabolic need/demand for O2 as a streamlined, properly weighted diver, hovering motionless in the water column? (PS - you may want look into the difference between inspiration and respiration. One is mechanical, one is metabolic.)

You are quite correct that a diver that moves more, needs more oxygen, however... this does not change the fact that the SUPPLY of oxygen will still exceed what the diver can possibly utilize. Now... stop being condecending. I am very deliberate in my wording, and I have not used inspiration in any of my replies.
What I have described is the regulation of VENTILATION, which coincidentally also is the regulating mechanism for, simply put, number of breaths per tank.

What you seem to not understand is that hemoglobins affinity to O2 is amazing. So is also the auto regulation to make sure the body(cells) get the oxygen it needs. Again, in other words. At pressure, the PPO2 for a diver breathing 21%-> is to high for the body to use excess of what is supplied. There is plenty of oxygen in the gas you are breathing! Even if your increased movement and metabolism should cause an increase in use of oxygen, the breathing gas will contain an excess of oxygen compare to what you need.

The main driving force for VENTILATION (i.e. breathing in and out... certain volume in, certain volume out) is the accumulation of CO2... The more CO2, the higher frequency of ventilation will be. Most importantly is HOW you chose to use those breaths. Shallow and fast, and you retain CO2 (There will still be enough O2 for a Loooong while). Deeper and slower migth be better.

(However, mind you... I do not say that being fitter, exercising and increasing general health is not good)

My point is, a breath is a breath. Is a certain amount. A tank divided by this amount gives the max possible breaths pr tank. The clue is to get the most breath for the buck... If you get my drift. And a big part of this is acknowledging that the limiting factor is NOT the need for O2 (Which you have in abundance in your bloodstream) but the need to eliminate CO2.
 
We are no doubt getting too far off subject, but might as well. I am sorry if you do not think the BMI is useful, I do, it is a statistical population tool useful for the vast majority of people to use for comparative purposes to gauge their weight. Again, professional athletes and body builders are not going to fit well in the chart because they are outliers. And, while we are at it, since we are way off subject. What if marathon runners got a five minute break every two miles and a 30 minutes halftime where nearly butt naked women shook their tuukuses and yelled, go Bill/Bob/Mary, go. I contend that many football players are not fit, they are fit for football, fit for lifting or whatever their entertainment specialty is but not fit for life. If the OP wants to get a lower SAC then one of the things he can do is to reduce his weight. You guys are grown ups, it is your hearts pumping through all that mass. Less of you means less of you needs to be fed O2, a heart that does not have to work as hard to pump blood and oxygen is healthier and the body will be more efficient as a result.

And you too should read what I said. Do not bother digging up some more pictures of muscle guys or pro football players. There are probably only ten pro football players who jump in a pool and swim five miles or run a marathon, they are always the exceptional and muti-talented. It is an odd thing that people have come to think distorted bodies are normal with women wishing to be boney thin but few can or should be and men wanting to bulk up but few bulk up with anything but fat so should not. Pro weight lifters and body builders and pro football players are not what a healthy person with good aerobic and general fitness look like, they are distortions for a specific purpose and in some cases a little bizarre. Here you go, note the part where he lost 100 pounds!

Former 300-Pound NFL Lineman Runs 3:56 Marathon | Runner's World & Running Times


I can google up stuff too. So, I will stay where I was, loose some weight, discuss it with a doctor or trainer what a proper weight for your specific body/person would be, concentrate on aerobic fitness with a target heart rate x some interval of time and develop a clear fitness goal and finally do some strength training and the SAC rate will come down.

Weird thing, I started do more weight/strength training, cannot seem to lose my winter fat and am stubbornly clinging to 175 pounds (okay, maybe even a few more than that:wink: ) and I want to be back at 165. Yet, I swam my fastest mile the other day and rode my fastest 25 mile bike since I broke my leg 4.5 years ago. I could just tell myself it is muscle and maybe some of it is but then I notice I have a little belly there too, so, no PBJ sandwiches for me for a while. Weight is not everything nor should it be, there is a balance in everything. Come to think of it, I think I will have a PB sandwich right now!

N
 
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RDrink25:

As is often the case, I think, responses to your sort of question cover a range of advice. Whatever you try, once you get a 'solution' that works for you, please post back to the thread later & let us know what you did and how much benefit you're seeing.

Richard.
 
It gets fustration as I dive twice a week and though it is a task loading dive I feel I should be down longer. Good news is that at least we get 100's and spare air's to use while down. On the other hand it sure is nice to swim with 4 Mantas, 4 Whale Sharks every Mon and Thur.... Even if it is for only 50min.
 
Good news is that at least we get 100's and spare air's to use while down.

And people thought that a discussion of BMI would take this thread off track?

fire-in-the-hole.jpg
 

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