Advanced Technology

[descent]

... The only thing I can extarct from what you posted is that you appear to be familiar with systems that interface to multiple power systems (mains and UPS alternator/battery). ...

Yes, that's true. Sorry for the cryptic terms. The point I was trying to make was not about stationary power sources.

The CCR diver's breathing loop is cleverly driven by human muscle power, and warmed (even more cleverly) by the warmth of exhaled air as well as the scrubber reaction. Humans also have robust protection against chilly breathing gas built right into their face.

I don't believe the human body can handle cool blood as easily, nor do I think you would want the diver's cardiac muscle tissue powering the entire ECP loop.

How then could we drive a system like the one you describe?

... If you posted complete gibberish in swahili I probably would have understood it better ...

Again, sorry for the jargon.

Before hitting submit, I deleted a bunch of additional details about the Boeing 787 Dreamliner because I assumed that everyone here was already familiar with their unhappy safety record. You saw the shorter version. Perhaps the longer one would have been even less intelligible.

Diving to 1500 fsw on ECP and returning in good health would require a significant energy source. The diver's body needs to be continuously warmed, possibly for hours on end; ditto the saline diluent; the O2 must be preheated before injection; and the apheresis loop itself, which is essentially a huge heat sink, must be kept at blood warmth the entire time.

Power for these environmental needs could come in the traditional way -- down a long, heavy umbilicus from a DC generator on the support vessel -- or via a short umbilicus connected to a large, stationary power brick on the sea floor. Both of those options require some kind of winch or hoist. Both options also rob the diver or his support vessel of a great degree of independent movement, and we want our diver to be an unshackled solo explorer.

My point was that power supplies able to do this kind of work safely are far too heavy for a person to lift, and the portable ones that might work with this design are able to store so much energy that carriers like FedEx and UPS make us package and ship them as if they were explosives. They can (and do) catch fire or explode in storage, in transit or during use.

If a lithium-ion array is too complicated or unsafe for a deep diving application, the only other technology I can think of that would fit the bill would be a radioisotope thermoelectric generator (RTG). The radioactive decay produces continuous heat reliably for many years. They are tough. It is quite a challenge to make one stop working. For underwater use, you could even leave some of the lead shielding off to make the unit lighter, but you would want to put it back on near the surface.

 

[EFX]

If the risk/benefit ratio becomes acceptable for a scientist(s) to do research they will always prefer the freedom and flexibility that comes with TLV/ECP over ROV/submersible/EXO options because of the direct involvement with the environment. Think of everything you can do as a scuba diver on a shallow reef. Now, imagine that there is no scuba. Do you really think that observing the reef from a video captured by an ROV you can learn the same as actually diving on the reef using scuba? Until you get untethered divers down to extreme depths without the cumbersome expensive technology of today there will be things we will never learn. In fact, we've been able to learn quite a lot about the Mars environment from the rovers but it's not enough. That is why a manned mission is planned despite the high risk and cost.

---------- Post added September 26th, 2014 at 10:52 AM ----------

Diving to 1500 fsw on ECP and returning in good health would require a significant energy source. The diver's body needs to be continuously warmed, possibly for hours on end; ditto the saline diluent; the O2 must be preheated before injection; and the apheresis loop itself, which is essentially a huge heat sink, must be kept at blood warmth the entire time.

I don't think the diver's body needs to be warmed seperate from warming the blood or PFC. The diver that went to almost 900 feet in South Africa's Bushman's hole spent over 10 hours in the water on a rebreather doing deco. His body heat was insulated by a dry suit and undergarments.

Power for these environmental needs could come in the traditional way -- down a long, heavy umbilicus from a DC generator on the support vessel -- or via a short umbilicus connected to a large, stationary power brick on the sea floor. Both of those options require some kind of winch or hoist. Both options also rob the diver or his support vessel of a great degree of independent movement, and we want our diver to be an unshackled solo explorer.

My point was that power supplies able to do this kind of work safely are far too heavy for a person to lift, and the portable ones that might work with this design are able to store so much energy that carriers like FedEx and UPS make us package and ship them as if they were explosives. They can (and do) catch fire or explode in storage, in transit or during use.

We can speculate until hell freezes over and never know. That is why I asked for the power requirements in a previous post regarding TLV. When we know the power needed we can select a suitable power source.