farmerstephen13
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I just recieved my PADI open water certification. A buddy tells me that I should get my advanced cert, Is that really necessary, what does advanced cert get me?
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More time in the water, and the ability to take Rescue, which is what you REALLY want.
In general terms, each progressive class increases your awareness underwater. OW is all about you. You learn how to survive underwater using the gear. If you had a good or really good instructor, you may have progressed past this but at the minimum this is where you are.
In Advanced, you learn about the environment and how it changes and how that affects you as a diver. You are not only aware of you, you are now aware that there is stuff around you (Cool... fish!)
In Rescue you learn about being aware of what others around you are doing. The cool thing about rescue isn't what it teaches, but what happens naturally. If you are focused on someone else (ie the "victim" in your rescue scenarios), you don't have time to think about what is going on with you. That means that all those little nagging things that bug you in the water now (that little bit of water sloshing around in your mask, for example), will no longer be of any importance, and they disappear. Well, the water doesn't disappear, but the problem does. You you really get to focus on what is around you, rather than what is happening to you.
And really, isn't that why you got into diving in the first place?
I personally don't consider anyone a "fully trained" open water diver until they are rescue capable.
Chris
In general terms, each progressive class increases your awareness underwater. OW is all about you. You learn how to survive underwater using the gear. If you had a good or really good instructor, you may have progressed past this but at the minimum this is where you are.
In Advanced, you learn about the environment and how it changes and how that affects you as a diver. You are not only aware of you, you are now aware that there is stuff around you (Cool... fish!)
In Rescue you learn about being aware of what others around you are doing. The cool thing about rescue isn't what it teaches, but what happens naturally. If you are focused on someone else (ie the "victim" in your rescue scenarios), you don't have time to think about what is going on with you. That means that all those little nagging things that bug you in the water now (that little bit of water sloshing around in your mask, for example), will no longer be of any importance, and they disappear. Well, the water doesn't disappear, but the problem does. You you really get to focus on what is around you, rather than what is happening to you.
And really, isn't that why you got into diving in the first place?
I personally don't consider anyone a "fully trained" open water diver until they are rescue capable.
Chris
But the advanced card is meaningless if you don't have your basic OW skills down pat. I will not allow divers fresh out of OW to take the advanced class I teach. They are simply not ready for the increased task loading, new skills, and performance requirements to pass. What I do is invite past students to come on any dive that is within their limits. Including checkouts with others. They are certified divers and not part of the class so they do not count against my ratios. What it does is give them more time for no more than the cost of the rental gear if they do not have their own. After checkouts I will gladly do a dive or two with them and give tips and pointers so that when they do come to me for AOW they have the skills they need to start the class.
You'll get out of it what you put in to it.
I wouldn't rush in to it, go do some diving and decide what kind of diving you like. Then pick your elective dives in the course to suit your aspirations. Shop around and find an instructor that is passionate about those types of dives, who will let *you* pick the electives, not choose them for you.
As an aside, AOW isn't a pre-requisite for doing a PADI Rescue course. Any second certification, with experience of deeper diving and navigation is fine. So you could, for example, do a PPB class and just get a bit of deeper diving experience under your belt and you can then enrol in the Rescue class.
AOW at this stage will essentially be some supervised diving experience, with some skills that may or not be relevant or meaningful to you right now. After a dozen or so dives doing different things, you should have a better idea of what you want from the course - and that will give you a reason to do it.
I personally believe that the Advanced Open Water Class - from PADI at least - is an add-on to the Open Water class - so it is Advanced OPEN WATER, not ADVANCED open water, if you see the difference in the emphasis. I think the name is often wrongly contstrued as an advanced diving class, when in fact it is a simple advancement of the basic introductory level course.
Where possible, I like to have my students start a PADI AOW class as soon as they are able after completing Open Water - a chance to expand on basic skills already acquired during the open water class. Further tips and techniques that it is simply not possible to fit into the 4 or 5 day standard open water course.
The semantics of mastery and four day courses have been debated at length and let's not get into that here, but I accept that any people have a different perspective on what constitutes the AOW class - at least from the PADI schools. The Navigation dive and Deep dive expand on techniques and knowledge learned in the OW class. Peak Performance Buoyancy is an invaluable dive for the inexperienced diver and I do not see these things as task loading, because the fundamentals of these skills should have been mastered - not to perfection but to a point of comfortable repetition in the Open Water Class. If a student finds that the AOW is task loading, then potentially their OW class was not up to required standards.
I am realistic - I accept that there are poorly trained instructors who poorly train divers. This should not be but it is the simple fact of life at the moment. The arguments are extensive and have been repeated here ad infinitum and ad nauseum on these forums but an instructor is also required to evaluate a student for dive skills and theory before commencing an AOW class. This might be a short pool session or a check dive, depending on the instructor and or the dive centre they work for. A student who is not ready to commence "Advanced Training" should be remediated to correct any mistakes their OW instructor may have made.
I agree that you should seek a good instructor, by word of mouth, potentially with an interview beforehand - although I have disagreed with some of the interview questions proposed by a member of this forum.
If your OW course was completed well, I think there is no problem going straight into AOW, when conducted approriately. I think it should be looked on as an adjunct to the OW class, not some kind of almighty qualification. If you are concerned about buoyancy skills and diving ability, then for sure, getting a few dives under your belt before the AOW class is a good thing.
It is not strictly essential to be AOW or even rescue certified - I have dived with many people who had an OW cert from whatever agency, have hundreds of dives and are great in the water. However, personally, I think the "complete" Open Water diver, at least from my PADI perspective, is one whao has completed OW, AOW and Rescue. This is, after all, what other agencies teach by default.
If you think you are ready, whether you have 4 dives or 400, go for it.
Cheers,
C.
Where possible, I like to have my students start a PADI AOW class as soon as they are able after completing Open Water - a chance to expand on basic skills already acquired during the open water class. Further tips and techniques that it is simply not possible to fit into the 4 or 5 day standard open water course.
The semantics of mastery and four day courses have been debated at length and let's not get into that here, but I accept that any people have a different perspective on what constitutes the AOW class - at least from the PADI schools. The Navigation dive and Deep dive expand on techniques and knowledge learned in the OW class. Peak Performance Buoyancy is an invaluable dive for the inexperienced diver and I do not see these things as task loading, because the fundamentals of these skills should have been mastered - not to perfection but to a point of comfortable repetition in the Open Water Class. If a student finds that the AOW is task loading, then potentially their OW class was not up to required standards.
I am realistic - I accept that there are poorly trained instructors who poorly train divers. This should not be but it is the simple fact of life at the moment. The arguments are extensive and have been repeated here ad infinitum and ad nauseum on these forums but an instructor is also required to evaluate a student for dive skills and theory before commencing an AOW class. This might be a short pool session or a check dive, depending on the instructor and or the dive centre they work for. A student who is not ready to commence "Advanced Training" should be remediated to correct any mistakes their OW instructor may have made.
I agree that you should seek a good instructor, by word of mouth, potentially with an interview beforehand - although I have disagreed with some of the interview questions proposed by a member of this forum.
If your OW course was completed well, I think there is no problem going straight into AOW, when conducted approriately. I think it should be looked on as an adjunct to the OW class, not some kind of almighty qualification. If you are concerned about buoyancy skills and diving ability, then for sure, getting a few dives under your belt before the AOW class is a good thing.
It is not strictly essential to be AOW or even rescue certified - I have dived with many people who had an OW cert from whatever agency, have hundreds of dives and are great in the water. However, personally, I think the "complete" Open Water diver, at least from my PADI perspective, is one whao has completed OW, AOW and Rescue. This is, after all, what other agencies teach by default.
If you think you are ready, whether you have 4 dives or 400, go for it.
Cheers,
C.
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Your advanced OW certification will allow you to dive some deeper wreck dives such as the Speigel Grove and Duane in Key Largo. Without AOW, you may be required to show evidence of recent deeper dives.
Whatever, Craig
Whatever, Craig
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The PADI Advanced Open Water course should be an immediate add on to your basic course, especially if you are diving off the California coast. As Crowly so clearly noted, "it is Advanced OPEN WATER, not ADVANCED open water." It will greatly aid you in the development of skills that you need to be able to dive independently with a buddy of similar training. After you get some dives under your belt, give some thought to the LA County Advanced Diver Course, it is ADVANCED open water not Advanced OPEN WATER, and is likely the best step that you can make toward becoming a well rounded diver.
I think that the PADI AOW is really just Part B of the OW program. It provides you with needed experience under supervision.
In my opinion, a diver is never really prepared to dive 'unsupervised' unless s/he can look after his buddy. This means an ability to perform a surface/sub-surface rescue of a concious / unconcious victim. In the PADI system, AOW is a prerequisite to the Rescue Course.
I know some find this to be a radical idea, but I guess I'm from the old school and want my buddy to be able to help me if I'm in-need (that's why I dive with one).
So my advise is that you be trained in Rescue as soon as you are able.
In any regard, it's great to hear that you are serious about your diving education and I encourage you to move forward. Safe Diving!
In my opinion, a diver is never really prepared to dive 'unsupervised' unless s/he can look after his buddy. This means an ability to perform a surface/sub-surface rescue of a concious / unconcious victim. In the PADI system, AOW is a prerequisite to the Rescue Course.
I know some find this to be a radical idea, but I guess I'm from the old school and want my buddy to be able to help me if I'm in-need (that's why I dive with one).
So my advise is that you be trained in Rescue as soon as you are able. In any regard, it's great to hear that you are serious about your diving education and I encourage you to move forward. Safe Diving!
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