A question on BP/W single tank mounting

[scrane]

Well, I talked to a really nice gentleman at Piranha who apologized for the mistake, issued me a prepaid USPS label for the return, and sent out the proper Wing via Priority Mail, all within an hour this morning. Even with the complication I should have the new Wing in hand two days before the BP and Harness are due to arrive.

 

[Bierstadt]

The idea is to dive with a wing no larger than what you need. If you only need 23 pounds of buoyancy or less than you most certainly don't want a 32 pound wing, not if you have the option. I look forward to hearing how your system goes together; I have heard that some manufacturer's wings don't fit well on some others plates. I would hope if that was the case for your setup someone would have pointed it out, though, so I expect yours will be just fine. (I went DSS, buy once, cry once. But I was sure I wanted a BP/W. If I wasn't, I would have went with your approach.)

 

[ams511]

The idea is to dive with a wing no larger than what you need. If you only need 23 pounds of buoyancy or less than you most certainly don't want a 32 pound wing, not if you have the option. I look forward to hearing how your system goes together; I have heard that some manufacturer's wings don't fit well on some others plates. I would hope if that was the case for your setup someone would have pointed it out, though, so I expect yours will be just fine. (I went DSS, buy once, cry once. But I was sure I wanted a BP/W. If I wasn't, I would have went with your approach.)

Two things: First, unless you do the same type of diving you either need multiple wings or one that satisfies all your diving needs. There is not a big difference in the way a streamlined larger wing would feel. Although some would say it makes all the difference in the world.

Second I do not recommend the approach Scrane took for someone new to BP&W. Both Diver's Supply and DGX sell wing packages in the same price range as he was looking. Hog wings confuse me because sometimes I see photos showing they have long slots other times I see photos they have shorter slots. I am not sure if they are long or short. There has been different versions of this wing. If the slots are long there should not be an issue with fit.

 

[Bierstadt]

Two things: First, unless you do the same type of diving you either need multiple wings or one that satisfies all your diving needs. There is not a big difference in the way a streamlined larger wing would feel. Although some would say it makes all the difference in the world.

Second I do not recommend the approach Scrane took for someone new to BP&W. Both Diver's Supply and DGX sell wing packages in the same price range as he was looking. Hog wings confuse me because sometimes I see photos showing they have long slots other times I see photos they have shorter slots. I am not sure if they are long or short. There has been different versions of this wing. If the slots are long there should not be an issue with fit.

I think we said the same thing but emphasized different parts.

 

[scrane]

I think the newer versions have the long slots, at least the 32# wing I received today did. It also had three pairs of mounting holes.
Although I was shipped the wrong size wing, the Hog wing seemed nicely constructed of good materials. There are two built in (plastic?) rods embedded in the material as tank guides.
I will be using this setup in warm water w/ single aluminum tank exclusively. I appreciate that the 23# wing would have limitations in other kinds of diving.
I also understand that mixing and matching different manufacturers' components might not provide optimum results. There is no question that the DSS system that Ron mentioned is a bargain from a well respected manufacturer, but the Hog wing seems to be of good quality, the Hog harness, like others is a length of webbing with simple stainless components, and the OMS plate looks like a safe bet. What the heck... it was cheap!
Anyways, once I get everything put together I'll report back on assembly and if I live through it: my first underwater experience with a BP/W.
Again, I appreciate everyone's input!

 

[scrane]

Well, I got everything, put it all together, and went to the pool!
First of all, the quality of the components was very good. I was a little disappointed that the bladder for the 23# wing was a little oversized. Probably designed for the 32#er. I also added an OMS soft single tank adapter that added very little weight or height, but holds the tank very securely. I don't know if it adds any rigidity over the small rails built into the Hog wing, but at worst it seems harmless.
At the pool everything fit very well. The BP/W was less comfortable out of the water, but no big deal. It was very easy to put on and take off due to its wide open design. In fresh water (discounting the heavy chlorination) with 3mm shorty wetsuit the combo was slightly negative (maybe 4#) with 2000# in the tank compared to my bcd which required about 6# to be neutral. The 23# wing put me a little face forward but high on the surface. Nice not to hassle with weights. Underwater everything was stable, maybe a little light in the rear, so I ordered a couple of trim pouches. Hoping to add 2# x 2 on the lower cam band to achieve good trim and buoyancy in salt water.
Practically speaking, the BP/W didn't make a big difference over my old bcd as far as maintaining neutrality, trim or stability. No tipping left to right. No venting problems. No air compartmentalizing. For me this is good news. I never had a problem with the bcd in this regard.

So, the BP/W experiment is so far a success. Benefits of the BP/W over the bcd include:
1) Less bulk. Simple.
2) More open, easier to put on and take off. Only adjustment is waste strap. Free movement.
3) No weight belt.
4) No compromises over bcd for neutrality and trim. Will probably be better after trim weights and fine tuning.
5) Comfort: no squeeze, no chafing.
6) Got to buy something new.
Benefit of a jacket over the BP/W: none that I can think of outside of pockets/storage capacity.

Thanks to everyone for their help!

 

[ronscuba]

Are you using a crotch strap ? If not, that will help with the face forward on the surface.

 

[ams511]

Underwater everything was stable, maybe a little light in the rear, so I ordered a couple of trim pouches. Hoping to add 2# x 2 on the lower cam band to achieve good trim and buoyancy in salt water.

If you are using a buoyant fin you might want to try less buoyant fins. This may be enough to level you out without the added weight. See if your LDS had a set of Jet or Rocket fins for you to try or the more modern Hollis F1.

 

[scrane]

I've been using and like the standard Force Fins for the kind of diving I've been doing. I really don't know what their buoyancy characteristics are. I think I'll be needing a few pounds anyways just to be neutral in salt water. For me in salt water I generally use 12# with the old bcd, so 4# is nothing and should be easily tucked away. I'm glad I got the steel BP. I generally pack my larger items in a carry on bag with about the tee tee shirts and a couple of pair of shorts plus a personal item consisting of regulator, computer, GoPro and breakables so I don't really worry about air luggage weight. In fact this year I'll be checking my bag to Roatan in October and plan to duct tape a folding camp chair to the bag!
I did use the crotch strap and didn't feel myself sinking down in the harness, so I think I'm all right there. Also, a few pounds weight on the bottom band might pull me more vertical.
I was surprised at the pool how easily I adapted to the BP/W. Initially I felt a little off balance but I think it was due to air in the outer skin of the Wing before it bubbled out. I think that 4# will be just the ticket for buoyancy and trim.
Also, in addition to the benefits above:

7) Looks cool.

 

[JohnnyC]

Where's your tank position in relation to the cam bands/wing. If the tank is sitting too high that'll throw you forward. Quite a few people who go to a BP/W without someone experienced helping them set it up end up with the tank too high and pitch forward.