3 Divers lost on the Spiegel Grove

[Big Toes]

I'd just like to say a little something here. condolences for the family and friends are nice, but I come from the skydiving community; been doing it almost as long as i've been diving. I've had 10+ friends die from impacting the ground at high speeds over the last 15 years, and as much as i hate it i've got to tell you there's a procedure for it: figure out why it happened, make it public and move on. there's a lot of introspection, conjecture, and guessing on this thread and I think that everyone's wishes for the dead are great, but IMHO let's just wait until the final findings come out, figure out what happened, and move on. everyone on this list will be a better diver by learning what happened to these guys without a bunch of guessing about what happened. but is has to be fact, so let's stop the hype.

 

[stevetim]

Accidents happen, people learn from them, and hopefully avoid identical situations in the future.

This makes me wonder only one thing about the whole incident. The diver that made it out with ample air to surface; I can only wonder why the other divers chose not to follow him, and how much courage and faith it must have taken for him to actually leave the group in search of an exit in such a situation.

 

[Big Toes]

Accidents happen, people learn from them, and hopefully avoid identical situations in the future.

This makes me wonder only one thing about the whole incident. The diver that made it out with ample air to surface; I can only wonder why the other divers chose not to follow him, and how much courage and faith it must have taken for him to actually leave the group in search of an exit in such a situation.

Again, wait for the accident anaysis. you make suppositions but you don't really know happened. wait for the analysis!

 

[matts1w]

A dive reel and a single al80 on their back and the boat operator let them get off the boat? It does'nt seem to me that the boat operator used very good judgement if this is true.
If they brought a dive reel with them then they had obvious plans to penetrate and the boat operator should have seen that reel and a single tank and said no way, the reel stays or you do. I feel this has the makings of an easily preventable accident with fault in many areas or a combination of fault and bad luck.

I carry a reel when I dive in places like the Grove, and one can be certain I have ZERO plans to penetrate. The current around Key Largo can go from zero to ripping during the course of a dive, so one needs a reel to shoot a surface marker buoy or lift bag if he/she errs and is blown off the wreck. The reef and SMB make a nice place to hang during stops and, more importantly, allows the diver to be seen by other boat traffic.

 

[Missdirected]

I'd just like to say a little something here. condolences for the family and friends are nice, but I come from the skydiving community; been doing it almost as long as i've been diving. I've had 10+ friends die from impacting the ground at high speeds over the last 15 years, and as much as i hate it i've got to tell you there's a procedure for it: figure out why it happened, make it public and move on. there's a lot of introspection, conjecture, and guessing on this thread and I think that everyone's wishes for the dead are great, but IMHO let's just wait until the final findings come out, figure out what happened, and move on. everyone on this list will be a better diver by learning what happened to these guys without a bunch of guessing about what happened. but is has to be fact, so let's stop the hype.

If you have read the thread then you would have saw the many replies to the very same statement you are making. There is also a TOS for this thread you may be interested in reading. It allows for all that has been said here as some do not consider it all hype. What do you think many are thinking when they read or post here? I believe enough are thinking of safety. Safety, safety, safety. Additionally there is a separate memorial thread.

 

[mjsylver]

Posted in the Miami-Herald as of Monday.
http://www.miamiherald.com/505/story/45782.html

The autopsy showed drowning by seawater. Monroe county is tying up loose ends, according to their PIO.

 

[IXΘYΣ]

A dive reel and a single al80 on their back and the boat operator let them get off the boat? It does'nt seem to me that the boat operator used very good judgement if this is true.
If they brought a dive reel with them then they had obvious plans to penetrate and the boat operator should have seen that reel and a single tank and said no way, the reel stays or you do. I feel this has the makings of an easily preventable accident with fault in many areas or a combination of fault and bad luck.

To the families, I offer my condolances and the knowledge that if I had to die, I can't think of a more beautiful place than in the waters off Key Largo.

In the first place, what I carry with me to dive isn't any of the boat operator's business, unless it's illegal.
In the second place, the combination of a dive reel and a single 80 is common, and there is no "obvious plan to penetrate" anything inherent in it. I dive that combination whenever I dive a single 80. I dive a dive reel and whatever tank's available, because my reel is part of my standard equipment. So is a lift bag. Does that mean I have obvious plans to penetrate anything? Nope.
Some reel uses around wrecks:
1. Exploring the sand off the structure, especially when there's some current, to make sure I don't get disoriented and unable to find the wreck and ascent line.
2. Laying a transect for my personal survey.
3. Laying a nav aid line in low visibility.
4. Shooting a bag for ascent and as a marker for pickup should I get blown off the wreck.
Reels are very useful in open water. I highly recommend you invest in one and start using it. You'll quickly find that it enhances your diving in ways you never dreamed of, like marking your exit point on a reef for a shore dive in Bonaire.
And lastly, there's nothing beautiful about death in a silt cloud deep in the bowels of a ship.

 

[hlsooner]

Every time I have dove the Grove, I have carried a reel, light, and a 30 cu ft. redundant air source. Some might see these as tools for a penetration. Yet I have no intentions of penetrating the Grove, and in ten dives on the wreck, I have not even done the upper deck swimthroughs where you can see daylight on the other side. These are merely safety tools for a deep wreck, where currents can be strong.

I fear that after this accident, many of us are going to be harassed by Key Largo dive operators for carrying what are important safety tools simply because the captains are super paranoid of liability from people penetrating the wreck.

However any operator who attempts to prevent me from diving with reels, lights, extra gas, etc. will, in addition to losing my business, also receive lots of free publicity on ScubaBoard.

 

[matts1w]

I fear that after this accident, many of us are going to be harassed by Key Largo dive operators for carrying what are important safety tools simply because the captains are super paranoid of liability from people penetrating the wreck.

I will bet you dollars to doughnuts you have nothing to fear.

 

[hlsooner]

I really hope you are right!

I will bet you dollars to doughnuts you have nothing to fear.