12 boys lost in flooded Thai cave

[Lorenzoid]

There are about a billion different points of contention, and as much misinformation going out as election time in the US.

Here are some things to consider.. . .

The sentiment is what I took away from an interview with Anmar Mirza I listened to yesterday. So much speculation by everyone from OW divers to cave diving experts, but not even the experts here should be second-guessing the experts actually on the scene with firsthand knowledge.

 

[SailorJoe]

Boy the rescue effort has really ramped up. They are planning on bringing in many more pumps, which are powered by electricity of course. Then I read this:

"At 2.55pm Friday, emergency crews rushed to the cave after reports that at least two rescue workers have been electrocuted by an electrical wire inside the cave. Information is scant as the electrocution just happened but we have had reports that the power has now been temporarily turned off."

Ref: Chiang Mai CityNews - LIVE Updates: Teenager Football Team Trapped in Thai Cave

Let's hope no rescue workers get zapped and killed by all the electricity under water. I hope these pumps are safe. Lots of other efforts gong on as well including scanning for potential sites to drill a rescue hole. If they can triangulate on their location and drill a rescue hole that would be the holy grail.

 

[Dan]

Boy the rescue effort has really ramped up. They are planning on bringing in many more pumps, which are powered by electricity of course. Then I read this:

"At 2.55pm Friday, emergency crews rushed to the cave after reports that at least two rescue workers have been electrocuted by an electrical wire inside the cave. Information is scant as the electrocution just happened but we have had reports that the power has now been temporarily turned off."

Ref: Chiang Mai CityNews - LIVE Updates: Teenager Football Team Trapped in Thai Cave

Let's hope no rescue workers get zapped and killed by all the electricity under water. I hope these pumps are safe. Lots of other efforts gong on as well including scanning for potential sites to drill a rescue hole. If they can triangulate on their location and drill a rescue hole that would be the holy grail.

You need to read through the whole news & verify the message. Further down the page, there is also this message:
“At 4.30pm Friday, Chiang Rai Governor Naronsak Osottanakorn denied reports that a number of rescue workers were electrocuted in the cave, but has claimed that only one rescue volunteer simply fainted inside the cave and was taken to hospital as a precaution. He said that the man was from Ubon Ratchathani and is in a safe condition.”

 

[SailorJoe]

And now they're considering waiting until the monsoon is over (up to 4 months). With the medics, food & water on hand why not hunker down, play cards and wait it out? I have a feeling by then they will have drilled a hole and pulled them out. Considering all the water & potential electrical hazards that may be the best option.

 

[SailorJoe]

You need to read through the whole news & verify the message. Further down the page, there is also this message:
“At 4.30pm Friday, Chiang Rai Governor Naronsak Osottanakorn denied reports that a number of rescue workers were electrocuted in the cave, but has claimed that only one rescue volunteer simply fainted inside the cave and was taken to hospital as a precaution. He said that the man was from Ubon Ratchathani and is in a safe condition.”

Ok I missed that. With all that electricity down there though that definitely raised a wild card on being electrocuted. Considering the scope of the operation and many unknowns the environment is ripe for an accident to occur at any moment.

Now they're considering waiting until the monsoon season winds down.

 

[boulderjohn]

Waiting for the monsoon season to end has always been an option, but it is certainly not an excellent one. It is not like spending the time in a downtown apartment. Living in that environment is not without its own risks. If anyone develops a serious health need during that time, help will not be available.

There really are no good choices, so the rescuers have to look at each of the bad choices and decide which is the least horrible.

 

[MikeyIdea]

The Thai word for scubadiving is nam dam, literally translated black water.
The majority of the Thai people cannot swim, it's not taught in school. Diving is for the majority a horrifying activity, as expressed in their own language.

I have been told by a moderator that my response to Miyaru's post was too impolite and that I should edit it. When doing this, I deliberately keep the parts which are true and especially the part about the Thai idiom that fits so well with what Miyaru without knowing wrote on the subject of Thailand. I delete the last sentence of my post, it was unnecessary. if ScubaBoard moderators don't like the truth, they can ban me and delete my post

Thai's have a saying which translates to: People who don't know speak easily, it fits perfectly on you because of what you wrote about Thailand in your post

The word dam, ดำ, has more than one meaning. It can mean black when used as an adjective and it literally means "stay under water" when used as a verb, which is why it is translated to dive. And scuba diving is not nam dam as you write but dam nam. And scuba diving in English is two words, not one as you wrote

You are right about that the majority of the Thai people can't swim and that it's not taught in school

You wrote: quote <Diving is for the majority a horrifying activity, as expressed in their own language>
It's wrong of course. Most Thai's who don't know how to swim really want to learn and to dive would be an enormous experience. What's horrifying is that beach and water activity will make their skins darker

 

[Jack Hammer]

There is also the possibility of more sustained rains flooding the dry area they are in. There are a lot of factors at play. There are likely going to be some difficult choices to make with known and unknown risks involved. Whatever they decide, I'm sure it'll be based on the current and/or expected conditions. I'm sure there is a lot more going on we don't hear about. I'll support whatever decision they make.

 

[MikeyIdea]

I wonder if any of you have noticed when reading these reports, that it seems that the option favoured by the Navy is to teach the boys to dive and lead them out. As if it was the most obvious solution. But when the real cave divers are interviewed, such as from the UK or Australia or US cave divers, they think teaching them to scuba should be the absolute last resort, which we as divers understand why. Looks like the Navy doesn’t truly understand how dangerous that option really is. If you look at pics of all the Thai divers they are not in cave gear setup, but recreational gear setup. I don’t know how Thai Navy divers get trained but I’m drawing my own conclusions about their cave diving abilities/knowledge. I hope the Navy listens to the cave divers.

One of the first things the military commander of the operation said when the group was found was that - It may take four months before the group can come out. The leader of the whole operation is Chiang Rai governor Narongsak Osottanakorn, he turned out to be quite an organiser and very competent by the way, he also navigated the very same cave all the way to the end already 25 years ago, during the dry season. And he's got 4! bachelor degrees and a master degree from the US

It is said that he will remain the operational leader until the kids are out but that will at one point only be on paper, politics will or already has taken over

 

[SailorJoe]

There is also the possibility of more sustained rains flooding the dry area they are in. There are a lot of factors at play. There are likely going to be some difficult choices to make with known and unknown risks involved. Whatever they decide, I'm sure it'll be based on the current and/or expected conditions. I'm sure there is a lot more going on we don't hear about. I'll support whatever decision they make.

Agreed Jack. Very dynamic situation with multiple possibilities. When they get an opportunity...they will seize it. The latest startment as of today is reassuring that whatever route they take it will be safe:

"Thursday 5th July 2018
The BBC deliver a special report on the situation at the cave claiming that they have talked to people within the diving teams who say that although teaching the boys basic diving skills and bringing them out soon is feasible, they believe it is too risky at this point and is safer to keep them inside the cave for up to four or five months until the monsoon is over and they can be extracted safely, above water.

The Chiang Mai governor says that they must be 100% confident that the method they choose to get them out of the cave is safe."

Ref new link with latest info: Chiang Mai CityNews - Rescue Updates: Teenager Football Team Found Alive in Cave