100% Free flow at 135Ft and 41F water

[DA Aquamaster]

I think it underscores the reality that deep diving is deceptively easy.

It is not overly hard to do as long as everything goes right, its when things do not go as planned is when proper training and configuration mean the difference between aborting the dive in a normal and controlled manner with no real degree of excitement or relying on blind luck and hoping for the best while on the verge of panic.

 

[openmindOW]

Thank you for sharing your event with this Board. I am gald to her that you are okay.

In cold water, free flows are possible. I have seen this happen befor.

What kind of 1st stage did you have?

Were you wearing a a drysuit?

The h-valve suggestion is a good one. On deep, cold dives, it's not a bad idea to have a free-flow plan.

 

[MasterGoa]

Hi all and thanks for the words of advice.

I will try to answer each's posts as best I can...

ScubaMoose:
Yes, I did mix them up... Unfortunate, because the Forest City is an amaizing
wreck, I did get to enjoy it however, even if only for 3 minutes...

Shoredivr:
Oh yeah, it is already on the way... I called my LDS as soon as I was back
in Tobermory!

Stairman:
I am considering a pony. I am actually quite comfortable
to take off and on my BCD at depth, however I noticed that
with a 5/4 and a 5 on top, the weight / boyency difference
was quite large. If I was too drop the BCD, the reg would just poping out of
my mouth... So I think a pony would be a better solution for those
deep dives.

TSandM:
You tell the truth! And believe me, you are not speaking to a deaf man...
The main thing is that, I had NEVER experienced a free flow. I dove a 15ft pool
at 36F with ice sickles floating to have a controlled environment to test both
myself and my gear. But as the EMT explained, I was getting 3 times the air.

As for buddies, I cannot blame them as the plan was to follow 1st buddy which
knew the wreck like the back of his hand. I never expected for a boiler diameter
to bring such distance between myself and help...

Absolutely true about control. In retrospect, as soon as water entered my lungs,
I switched to fight or flight and that was it. I was still able to stay lucid in terms
of not holding my breath and on my back at the surface, but my logical
sense wad running at minimum... I was told to practice free flow by holding
the purge button down solid on my reg, you can bet I will spends many tanks
doing exactly that... And yes, that clear, crisp water make everything look
a few paddles away... Great points all around.

Sporket:
You and me both my friend, you and me both! I come out of this unscathed, but full
of questions which will be answered!

String:
I hear ya. I will certainly start by making sure my regs are configured exactly for what
I am doing with them...

ianr33:
The principle is the same as free flow. If a hose sweats air at the surface, at depth,
3 times the air in contained in each bubble... So by going deep, every possible
air problem is more severe by 3 times... It is not the sole problem, but helped
make the situation worst...

DA Aquamaster:
Fortunately, I was aware that buoyancy control and breathing added up so I always
used the inflater with lungs while holding my breath.
And yes, deep looked really easy especially with the vis here...
It is a yes/no situation in regards to my SeaCure mouth piece. Having snug
made freeflow hard, but it never popped out of my mouth, so it is win lose.
But fear not, breathing on freeflow is next on my list of things to master.

nereas:
Yes, I am lucky. My servicing is done annually, it was 14 months since the last
overhaul, I was matching my regs with my bottles. Since I have ease and practiced
a lot of underwater BCD removals, I will consider both H-Valves and ponies. But
I am leaning to a pony just for access. In the end, I came out OK because I did some
things right, even though I did things wrong that put me into that mess. The doctor
and paramedic both say that my excellent physical condition helped a lot, so I will
continue to enjoy the outdoors as one activity makes you better at the other...

openmindOW:
That is a good idea and yes, I will have a free flow plan. I had a plan
for everything else that I could imagine, I tried having a free flow plan, but
was unable to have a free flow before today. My reg is an RS-240 from Tusa.

Though I do feel safer at 3000ft than -135ft

 

[Ayisha]

I think it underscores the reality that deep diving is deceptively easy.

Yes, especially in Tobermory. It is crystal clear with lots of light, even at 130 feet, but it is extremely cold - 38F - low 40's all summer.

The Forest City and Arabia are advanced dives that require experience with extreme cold and depth and should be done with a redundant gas source, definitely. There have been many deaths over the years on both the Forest City and Arabia, and many more near-deaths. One of the shops scrutinized certs and log books and watched divers on their charters on other wrecks before allowing them to join a charter for either of these two.

I use a pony bottle, which many may not see as adequate enough, but I use it strictly for redundancy, and it's easy and hardly noticeable but provides me peace of mind. Of course, doubles would be much better, but overkill for petite little me.

 

[MasterGoa]

Hi Ayisha!

I know what you mean, the light and vis is calming and builds confidence
but the cold slaps you quick if you are not careful.

I also saw what you are talking about, but one shop asks for logs
and stuff, the other watches you carefully for many dives before hand.

The thing is, I had done many dives with them, and even did two dives
with one 80cuft tank. Did 65 min on the Scoville and 48 minutes
on the Newago, I am a very calm diver. I also pride myself as being a good example and always waits and asks what my buddy wants to do.
I also NEVER stress a person for ending the dive. This is why I was
allowed to dive the Forest City.

I will look into a pony, however, which reg to I put on?

MG

 

[ianr33]

ianr33:
The principle is the same as free flow. If a hose sweats air at the surface, at depth,
3 times the air in contained in each bubble... So by going deep, every possible
air problem is more severe by 3 times... It is not the sole problem, but helped
make the situation worst...

Actually the air flow from a HP hose will not increase with depth. if anything it will get less. The HP hose will have the tank pressure in it,that will not change with depth. the differential pressure between the hose and ambient will decrease as depth increases.

Even if you take the spg off it takes 20 minutes (going from memory here) to empty an Al 80, a freeflow from a second stage can empty a tank in a little over 1 minute.
I still think the HP leak is irrelevant.

Glad you are O.K . Doubles or a large pony would be an excellent idea at that depth and temperature.

This was a very interesting thread
http://thedecostop.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5296

 

[Web Monkey]

As for buddies, I cannot blame them as the plan was to follow 1st buddy which
knew the wreck like the back of his hand. I never expected for a boiler diameter
to bring such distance between myself and help...

FWIW, although bolting for the surface wasn't good, sharing air with your buddy may or may not have been better, depending on their equipment.

At that temperature and depth, grabbing your buddy's octo is very likely to start their reg free-flowing unless it's a cold-water reg.

Also, unless they had good gas planning or were just lucky, there's no reason to think that they actually had enough air to get you both to the surface from 137'. You could easily have killed yourself doing what you did, and if you shared air, you could have killed both you and your buddy.

Sorry to sound like the voice of doom, but 137' and < 40 degrees isn't a place that tolerates any mistakes.

Terry

 

[Web Monkey]

calm diver. I also pride myself as being a good example and always waits and asks what my buddy wants to do.
I also NEVER stress a person for ending the dive. This is why I was
allowed to dive the Forest City.

I will look into a pony, however, which reg to I put on?

Honestly, if you plan on doing any similar dives, I'd look into doubles, cold-water regulators and deco training.

Terry

 

[TSandM]

What Web Monkey said.

 

[shoredivr]

The Forest City and Arabia are advanced dives that require experience with extreme cold and depth and should be done with a redundant gas source, definitely. There have been many deaths over the years on both the Forest City and Arabia, and many more near-deaths. One of the shops scrutinized certs and log books and watched divers on their charters on other wrecks before allowing them to join a charter for either of these two.

In addition, the captains on the Toby charter operator I use ask everyone if they have a plan for freeflows, especially on these deeper wrecks. (I'd also include the Niagara II, the King, the San Jacinto, and the Scoville in terms of depth and cold).

Of course, doubles would be much better, but overkill for petite little me.

That's what I used to think, too....