OOA after only a few minutes with a full tank at 17m

[NAUI Wowie]

I use the right hand rule: Point your thumb in the direction you want the valve (Handle/Stem/plug and seat assembly) to move. Then curl your fingers. The direction your fingers point as curled is the direction the handle needs to move when turned. You must use the right hand, but it works no matter your orientation to the valve.

Of course this also assumes a standard threading on the valve (or screw or bolt etc) and that you understand you want to move the plug and seat assembly out of the valve body.

Works when you can't see the valve or when you look at it from a different perspective.

Did you just describe opening and closing a valve?

Im not joking

 

[aviator8]

Im in the 6 percent where some idiot crewmember turned off my tank likely thinking I had just finished a dive where I was actually about to jump in. Ship Conception, location channel islands CA, time a year ago maybe closer to a year and a half as it was april.

If you do buddy checks and your buddy discovers a problem they tell you, then you fix it. At least that's how I do it. Why is this any different for a DM? If they find and issue they should vocally tell you before changing anything, then you both agree on the fix. Problem solved. DM's should not make any changes to a persons gear without vocally expressing what they are doing.

 

[JackD342]

last year, truth aquatics, channel islands california. The Conception. I just finished readying my tank etc and stood up to go to bag and get defog and turned around and saw a crewmember fiddling with my knob. went back and sure enough i had opened it fully he had closed it completely. I was still relatively new at less than 25 dives and if id not seen him do it I may have walked off the deck into the water. its about an 8 foot drop id guess.

this happens all the time all over the world. people are dumb and they think they are being smart or helpful. I had only been gone a few seconds. Thats all it takes. Would I have checked again if I hadnt seen it? Id like to think so but I was also new....

Was the boat at the site, or was it enroute? I have been on more than one boat where the crew does not want any valves open and pressurized systems while the boat is underway, so they turn off gear after it gas been setup early on. Yeah, they could ask the divers to turn it off, but that is probably like herding cats to get full compliance.

 

[NAUI Wowie]

If you do buddy checks and your buddy discovers a problem they tell you, then you fix it. At least that's how I do it. Why is this any different for a DM? If they find and issue they should vocally tell you before changing anything, then you both agree on the fix. Problem solved. DM's should not make any changes to a persons gear without vocally expressing what they are doing.

there arent always buddys.... I was on a liveaboard with no set dives. sometimes you jump with one person sometimes there are three of you. no DMs in california. We dont use them at all here. You are on your own and most of the time no one wants to check others gear in those types of dives. even two tank single day dives. In CA you are pretty much self sufficient. Ive even had two divers surface without me in zero viz in monterey.

buddy checks and DMs are non existant. and even on tropical dives like in the philippines and im the only diver on the boat....the DM never checked my gear there. or group dives at pescador last year at coron philippines with 15 divers splashing and they assign 2 to 4 divers to follow each DM....same ....no one checked anyone.....

what you believe to be standard isnt really standard practice. Im all for buddy checks but I rarely see it anywhere. also in mexico last year on a 3 tank dive with 3 of us and a DM. no checks....

 

[NAUI Wowie]

Was the boat at the site, or was it enroute? I have been on more than one boat where the crew does not want any valves open and pressurized systems while the boat is underway, so they turn off gear after it gas been setup early on. Yeah, they could ask the divers to turn it off, but that is probably like herding cats to get full compliance.

anchored. liveaboard. no one is allowed to gear up until ship is anchored and el capitan gives the okey dokey

 

[The Chairman]

they will not change their teaching methods even after I explained and provided proof that CMAS no longer teaches the 1/2 turn back

After thirty years, maybe they see this as a non-issue, just as many of us see it.

That's of course a good slogan,

This is a perfect place for it, n'est pas? An infamous cave diver recently went on a rant about unnecessary cookies being used in a cave. If they make sense to you, then please use them. It's your dive and your life. Way too often little crap gets passed on as being far more important than it is. I crack my valve back after I turn it on... they act like I should be writing my obituary all ready.

 

[aviator8]

there arent always buddys.... I was on a liveaboard with no set dives. sometimes you jump with one person sometimes there are three of you. no DMs in california. We dont use them at all here. You are on your own and most of the time no one wants to check others gear in those types of dives. even two tank single day dives. In CA you are pretty much self sufficient. Ive even had two divers surface without me in zero viz in monterey.

buddy checks and DMs are non existant. and even on tropical dives like in the philippines and im the only diver on the boat....the DM never checked my gear there. or group dives at pescador last year at coron philippines with 15 divers splashing and they assign 2 to 4 divers to follow each DM....same ....no one checked anyone.....

what you believe to be standard isnt really standard practice. Im all for buddy checks but I rarely see it anywhere. also in mexico last year on a 3 tank dive with 3 of us and a DM. no checks....

I get your points, many people don't do them and many times there are no checks other than what you do yourself. I have been with a DM or instabuddy before where they are not interested in buddy checks. I double check myself and do a visual check on them and move on. When I dive with my normal buddy we do it. I was just basically just saying that if you do a buddy check as an example and you see something you say something. DM's and dive ops should follow this basic practice. If they want to do these checks, they should speak up if they feel the need to change something. My comments were not really directed at you, I was speaking in general as the quote you replied to earlier seemed to be making an argument that statistically speaking incidents of DM's turning off valves are low so whats the issue they probably catch and correct more than they close. While I don't disagree with that I do have an issue with how it is done. It can be done safer. Nobody should change anyone's gear without first telling you and having you agree.

 

[Storker]

n'est pas

"n'est ce pas".

Just sayin'.

 

[NAUI Wowie]

I get your points, many people don't do them and many times there are no checks other than what you do yourself. I have been with a DM or instabuddy before where they are not interested in buddy checks. I double check myself and do a visual check on them and move on. When I dive with my normal buddy we do it. I was just basically just saying that if you do a buddy check as an example and you see something you say something. DM's and dive ops should follow this basic practice. If they want to do these checks, they should speak up if they feel the need to change something. My comments were not really directed at you, I was speaking in general as the quote you replied to earlier seemed to be making an argument that statistically speaking incidents of DM's turning off valves are low so whats the issue they probably catch and correct more than they close. While I don't disagree with that I do have an issue with how it is done. It can be done safer. Nobody should change anyone's gear without first telling you and having you agree.

You couldve just said " I agree"

 

[Bob DBF]

there arent always buddys....

If you are solo diving, why the worry about buddy checks?

I was on a liveaboard with no set dives. sometimes you jump with one person sometimes there are three of you.

Are these buddy dives or solo? If I'm doing a buddy dive, I insist on a buddy check and dive plan. No check, I'd rather go solo anyway.

no DMs in california. We dont use them at all here.

For those that haven't been here, there are DMs in California, but the ones on the dive boats are not dive guides, and do not get in the water untill there is a problem. One can arrange to hire a dive guide before a trip if necessary. The DMs on the dive boats I know are more than happy to help with a buddy check or give any assistance or advice they can before you splash.

what you believe to be standard isnt really standard practice.

What others do is irrevelent, what you do, and enforce as standard practice on your dives is what counts.


Bob