The Guardian

[Gary D.]

We always say to train the way you are going to dive. But we all know that no matter how hard we train it is still training and the real world is still going to be different. It might be close but it is still different.

Kevin Costner made a great statement in the Guardian. He said; “There is a gap between training and what really happens out there. My intention is to narrow that gap”. That’s a great statement that I will be passing on to the rest of my team. If you have seen the movie you'll know why he said it. If you don't go see it.

Throughout my Navy Diving days I went to a lot of schools. I must have had 25+ instructors if you totaled them all up. I had two very early on that were the meanest a-holes on this planet and we all wanted to sit and watch their butts drown.

When I looked back after training those two instructors are the only names I remember. I miss those two and once it was all said and done they were the best instructors I’ve ever been around. You either cut it or you went somewhere else. There was no compromise.

People like the hand holding, popularity contest winning instructors but imho they are the one’s that just want to pass you on and don’t have that survival instinct to pass on.

The other thing he said in the movie that I thought was great was; "Limitations without understanding will get you killed”. So very true.

Gary D.

 

[BladesRobinson]

Gary,

Your point is well noted but when we "train the way we are going to dive" we need to make certain that those participating have the skills to conduct the training safely and that the person in charge of the training has done a proper "risk/benefit" assessment.

In the past ten years, 50% of the public safety diving "line of duty deaths" have been in the TRAINING MODE!

I can't help but think that some of these senseless deaths may be attributed to some clueless person saying ... "fellas, we're gonna train like it's the real thing."

With this mindset, what we're "really gonna do" is double the potential for an accident! The high number of PSD fatalities in the "training mode" prove this point.

When Kevin Costner said, “There is a gap between training and what really happens out there. My intention is to narrow that gap” ... he was NOT talking about killing the people he was training or having them come "close to death."

Gary, you and I know the difference ... but some of the newer PSDs in this forum may take these words literally and get themselves or a team mate killed; or both (that happened with officers McClung and Monette).

When I say I am going to "train the way I am going to dive" the important fact is I keep the "v" in "dive."

The way I dive is with a scuba tank strapped to my back, a regulator in my mouth (or a FFM) and underwater. Anytime I can accomplish those three things, I am training. If I want to add to my training, I can do so with the assurances that the safety systems are in place to reasonably prevent an injury.

When Kevin Costner was training his students to deal with hypothermia, he did so in a pool. The scene where the students were flown offshore and left in the water was NOT the first in-water exercise and these students had months of training, every day, to build up to that level of competency. A team that only trains 6, 12 or 36 times a year is no where near the level competence that was portrayed in the GUARDIAN movie where the actors portrayed a "survival swim."

I know there is value of diving in open water and along silty bottoms with poor visibility, but before I throw my team members into these conditions I am assured (to a reasonable degree) that there are no hazards that can not be overcome safely by the diver/team. Additionally, the skills have been rehearsed in a controlled environment; a swimming pool or open water site that mimics "pool like conditions."

The bottom line is that there are MANY opportunities for GOOD training in a pool and training should not have the same inherent hazards as "the real thing."

Let's all work hard to keep the "v" in "diving" ....

Blades



NOTE:
PSD fatality statistics for the past ten years...
50% in the "training mode"
35% in the "recovery mode"
15% in the "rescue mode"

In other words, using the statistics provided, if a PSD is going to die, they are 1.43 times more likely to die during "training" than during a real "recovery" operation and they are 3.33 times more likely to die during "training" than during a real "rescue" operation. NONE of the training fatalities took place in a pool. Fifty percent of the training dives were under the direct supervision of "recreational" scuba instructors and the other fifty percent supervised by well intentioned team leaders with no formal instruction in conducting public safety diver training. Those supervising PSD training dives are directly responsible for making certain that the dives are conducted safely and we should all strive to do better.

 

[Gary D.]

I could not agree with you more. What you posted is exactly why I stress the need formal PSD training. Those statements were not meant to encourage new, uncomfortable, non or poorly trained divers to intensify their training.

When we get rough on the team it is in a pool. We are much milder in open water and work in very clear, shallow water next to a dock where we can see the divers from above. Once we are away of those conditions it is one on one training at a very slow pace. Speed comes with comfort and time.

I don’t think PSD training should be affiliated with an LDS. I also have strong feelings about recreational dive instructors that are not current PSD instructors teaching PSD classes. There are some unusual or out of the main stream so called PSD classes out there and one has to be careful on what they choose. There are also a few non Emergency Service Related organizations that will certify any diver as a PSD if you have the cash.

Another thing I see is Military Divers, especially Navy Divers trying to teach PSD. People need to realize that PSD is in a world all to its own and not related to much more than trying to take the “V” out of Dive. Military Divers still need to get trained as a PSD before doing this work. Something everyone needs to remember is that SEALS are Navy combat troops that went through some very tough training. They are not PSD’s. The rest of the Military Divers are basically either Research or Commercial Divers of sorts and are not PSD’s either.

In 1976 I was recruited to the Sheriff’s office because of my diving background. When I came aboard it was whoa, this is all new to me and the learning process started which has never ended. It was more for me than the rest of the team. I did come out of the commercial side of the Navy Diving programs with Gemini and Apollo recovery, Ships Swimmer, Rescue Swimmer, BOOM goodies and a host of other in water related training. BUT on the outside this only added to my comfort level in the water and had nothing to do with PSD. Being in the Military dealing with Military rescues, recoveries repairs or whatever is light years away from dealing with civilians and the civilian way of life.

Use your head when comes to training and do it right. I know there is the mindset out there that thinks they can totally duplicate or exceed in training what an actual operation is going to dish up. It’s not going to happen.

As LEO’s we train to deal with people shooting at us. We train and train and train more to get proficient at it. We even shoot at each other with much less than lethal rounds which makes for some very intense training. BUT when the “Fly’s hit the Westinghouse” and those rounds are from someone else and contain lead it is much different. Different enough you may not admit to crapping your britches. Hopefully you revert to your training and act properly so you increase your chances of going home on your feet.

The same goes for diving. You need to train and the more the better but it needs to be proper training. Our tough pool training isn’t directed at what a PSD actually does in regards to searching, rescue and recovery. It is geared towards diver skills. I have no doubt that most, not all yet because we have some FNG’s, can handle almost anything that can get thrown at them on an operation.

We don’t do the old UDT roll in or high speed pick ups. We don’t do the Mike Nelson flip off a boat nor should anyone else because there is no reason to go to those extremes in this business.

Get so good at knowing your equipment and your skills that it is second nature. You should know your gear so well that you can hold an intense conversation and get suited up without any errors in very short times. The same goes for basic skills on the bottom, they should be second nature.

As far as Men of Honor and the Guardian go those are MILITARY training movies. Without being there a civilian will never reach nor should they try to reach those levels. Not only are they unrealistic for civilians it’s very dangerous training that belongs in the Military.

Do not get in over your head during training. There is a time and a place for everything and Risk VS Benefit applies to training just as it does on any other operation.

Enough ranting.

Gary D.

 

[BladesRobinson]

Gary ... You and I are usually in total agreement and that is apparent in these posts. The facts speak for themselves and your narrative only clarifies why you are one of the professionals whom I respect. Thanks brother for being one of the "good guys" why shares my concern for the well being of fellow public safety divers.

 

[limbo]

Gary and Blades,

Interesting read and it makes total sense to me.

Keep up the good work!

 

[The Chad]

Just saw that movie and really liked it. Hope everyone can catch it

 

[sparkyjames]

Gary D and Blades.

Thanks for posting this you guys both are a lot of help to me as a newer PSD team member , I think you guys would like our team leader

he has a saying I think you two would like he tells us we are going to pratice this untill you are sick of pratceing it then we willl pratice it some more.

I am realy enjoying being on the team, I can also see how in just the few short months i have been with the team
I now have a differant aproch to my just diving for fun with my usal dive budies.

I may not post on here to offten but i do read each and every thread trying to soak up as much infermation as I can.

Thanks to both of you for being so williing to share your esperience with us FNG
( a title I im proudto have for now )

I will train like I dive and I will do so in a way that is safe as not to place my team members or the public or my self at undue risk.

Sparky

 

[BladesRobinson]

Gary, what were the names of the two instructors you remember? I plan to be in Panama City in September and can do some research.

Sparky ... are you still around???

 

[diving for food]

For too many years I have seen some of the best scuba instructor try to cross over to the PSD area and are get well-intended personal injured or worst. I am glad to see this kind of discussion taking place.

 

[RoonDawg]

Gary and Blades,

I have been "lurking" on this board for awhile, and finally joined a few months ago. I am a fairly new Sheriff's Diver on a team from central Florida. I must say that you guys stand for all that I desire to be eventually. Thank you for all of the wisdom you guys have put out over the years, and thanks for your dedication to the job(s).

Rich Rooney