First BPW - Basic Questions

[Mike126]

Awesome feedback from everyone. I think I am convinced to go with the HOG harness. Now the question is 30# or 40# wing.

Danero - if i go with a 30# wing I'll send you a note.

ams511 - I'm planning on calling Tobin this week to get an idea of wing and plate size. I do dive a 7mm locally and carry about 22#s. Looking at the lift calculator it seemed a 30# wing might work. I thought the rule of thumb was 2x the max weight you carry for lift. Based on the DSS site it does not look like the 40# wing is much bigger.

Thanks, Mike

 

[FM1520]

I have a DSS setup and the crotch strap is made of a softer material than the rest of the harness and is quite comfortable.

I have a 30 lb. wing for sale that was used once if you are interested.

I have the DSS setup as well, same as above. I have the 30# wing and it is more than enough for single tank. If you can get one used and save some $, go for it.

 

[eelnoraa]

For comfort, the key is a properly adjusted harness. Once done, you will hardly notice it even with heavy tank. I had the same doubt when I first started with BP/W, so I went with comfort harness with paddling and quick release/adjust buckels (Dive Rite transplate). Then I tried one piece basic harness, ditched the comfort harness after one dive.

 

[rhwestfall]

I did litterally the same thing as eelnoraa (though after a year of diving it). I now love my simple basic harness (I still use the other "comfort" one on plate #2 [kydex] because I can't stand tossing things away - and it is "okay"), but, with the DSS SS plate, I use the glide adapter because my damaged shoulders don't make it so easy for me to get in and out of the fixed webbing.....

One nice thing about the basic harness is that it functions without a chest strap which was always a conflict with a dry suit inflator valve.

---------- Post added September 24th, 2013 at 03:37 PM ----------

P.S. - if you are "tall", I can truly say you will appreciate the long (or x-long) plate. I never knew the cummerbund/waist belt belonged at your hips
(it was always just under my rib cage on my jacket)...

 

[Diving Dubai]

Hi. I dive an Apex WTX3 Wing which has 32lbs of lift. Although I dive in warm waters I use a Steel 15 litre tank. With a 3mm suit the SS plate overweights me slightly Diving a 5/7mm I add 2Lbs on rear tank strap pockets (I've just brought a 7mm which I'll dive in the winter here I guess that will require another 2lbs)

I'm 6'3 and weigh 85kgs and have no problem with lift on this rig.

My experiences of the transition can be found here http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/bu...perience-changing-jacket-wing-hope-helps.html

All the other questions have been answered... I recall wondering the same about comfort, trying one on fully loaded just wearign a tee shirt and thinking how comfortable it was..

Good luck on your purchase

 

[Mike126]

I had a great talk with Tobin yesterday at DSS about wing size etc. Initially, he recommended going with the 26# wing. Although, I ran some more numbers using a worst case scenario approach and here is what I came up with. This is using the lift calculator here on SB (Jan 2011 version).

Cold water dive
Head weight: -10
Tank Full: -10 (steel HP100)
Tank end of dive: -3.3
Regulator/Gauge: -2
BPW: -6.5
Camera/Other: -2.5
7mm Wetsuit: +22

This gives me a required wing lift of 21.44# and requires about 7.7# of extra weight. I would neutrally buoyant for my deco stop.


Warm water dive
Head weight: -10
Tank Full: -10 (steel HP100)
Tank end of dive: -3.3
Regulator/Gauge: -2
BPW: -6.5
Camera/Other: -2.5
No wetsuit (worse/best case)

This gives me a required wing lift of 31# and requires no extra weight. I would be 14#s negatively buoyant at my deco stop.


So if my logic is correct, I should have at least a 31# lift capacity on my wing so I don’t sink at the start of a warm water dive. Does that make sense?

I'm not sure I would notice that much difference in the larger wing.

 

[CT Sean]

I would not recommend diving with the configuration in your second example. You really don't want to be that overweighted especiaklly considering none of it is ditchable (besides the camera i guess)

 

[ams511]

Mike, Tobin has mentioned many times that a wing should be able to float your rig at the start of the dive and compensate for changes in wetsuit buoyancy during the dive. I know I am probably in the minority but I would prefer to go to the next size higher if I am on the border line regarding lift. You also need to remember that wing lift is measured with the entire wing submerged. When you are floating on the surface the wing is only partially submerged.

 

[tracydr]

Awesome feedback from everyone. I think I am convinced to go with the HOG harness. Now the question is 30# or 40# wing.

Danero - if i go with a 30# wing I'll send you a note.

ams511 - I'm planning on calling Tobin this week to get an idea of wing and plate size. I do dive a 7mm locally and carry about 22#s. Looking at the lift calculator it seemed a 30# wing might work. I thought the rule of thumb was 2x the max weight you carry for lift. Based on the DSS site it does not look like the 40# wing is much bigger.

Thanks, Mike

I use a HOG harness from DSS and love it. Its comfortable with a Lycra skin or drysuit. Since I change exposure protection, I find the "Cinch" system to make adjustments to the harness handy. Otherwise, it wouldn't be useful at all, because you adjust your harness and never touch it after that.
the crotch strap is not noticeable, to me.

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

I had a great talk with Tobin yesterday at DSS about wing size etc. Initially, he recommended going with the 26# wing. Although, I ran some more numbers using a worst case scenario approach and here is what I came up with. This is using the lift calculator here on SB (Jan 2011 version).

Cold water dive
Head weight: -10
Tank Full: -10 (steel HP100)
Tank end of dive: -3.3
Regulator/Gauge: -2
BPW: -6.5
Camera/Other: -2.5
7mm Wetsuit: +22

This gives me a required wing lift of 21.44# and requires about 7.7# of extra weight. I would neutrally buoyant for my deco stop.


Warm water dive
Head weight: -10
Tank Full: -10 (steel HP100)
Tank end of dive: -3.3
Regulator/Gauge: -2
BPW: -6.5
Camera/Other: -2.5
No wetsuit (worse/best case)

This gives me a required wing lift of 31# and requires no extra weight. I would be 14#s negatively buoyant at my deco stop.


So if my logic is correct, I should have at least a 31# lift capacity on my wing so I don’t sink at the start of a warm water dive. Does that make sense?

I'm not sure I would notice that much difference in the larger wing.

If your numbers are correct, for warm water I would suggest an aluminum backplate and AL80 tank. I believe the "head weight" thing is a little overstated (not the actual weight of a head, just the requirement to be 10 lbs. positive to float comfortably). Even removing the "head weight", you would still be significantly negative.

I would not be comfortable jumping into the water that negative without ditch-able weight.

Best wishes.