Certification Requirements to Dive

[Muisit]

I've logged 300 dives or so over the last few years with over 150 of those dives between 110ft and 120ft. I dive with a lot of friends on their boats offshore and have only been on 30 chartered dives of the 300. I always have the most experienced diver on the trip sign my log book, many times he/she is a Dive Master, and sometimes an instructor rating. As far as Cert Cards, I only have my Open Water Certification and got my Nitrox just to get my LP120s filled.

Will most places take the logbook with signatures and diver/masterdiver numbers as a substitute for Advanced Open Water certification? I called a dive shop in the Carolinas today about a trip while my Fiance and I are visiting. I called to inquire about a wreck dive in 80ft of water, which required an AOW Cert. My fiance does have her Advanced Open Water but has logged only about 50 dives and is much less experienced than myself. Despite my experience level and my Fiance as a dive buddy, they told me I would have to either take their Advanced Open Water Class the day before the trip or pay $50 extra on my trip to have an extra dive master "babysit" us on the dive since BOTH of us did not have an advanced open water certification.

Is this the normal with dive shops? I thought this was a ridiculous attempt to just suck some cash out of my pocket. I'd much rather spend $50 in the dive shop for something I can use than pay $50 for something I certainly don't need on a simple 80ft wreck dive on a big charter boat.

 

[Grover48]

Unfortunately rules are rules. The rules state you must have an AOW card to do the dive. Same as a rule that says you must have a cert card to get an air fill.

It is time to get your AOW card or change your dive itinerary to someone who will let you both dive with the certifications you have. IMHO, the AOW card will give your SO a few more dives and expose her to the physical properties deeper diving and navigation in the process.

 

[Garrobo]

You got it $right$.

 

[tstormdiver]

The sad thing is there are some shops in which an AOW card means more than experience. Just as you explain, some are denied the chance to dive, even though the experience may be there in the log book (although log book recording is "on your honor"), they will accept someone with an AOW card who only has a total of 9 dives & none of them without an instructor. Anyone see a potential problem with this? Yes, the AOW diver may be quite ready to do the dive in question,... but then again.... Of course a diver should know their limitations, but then, sometimes you don't know what you don't know.

I see both sides of the argument- You may have the experience to do the dive,... but the shop doesn't have "proof" that you have it,... as log book info *can* be faked.

Then again, with some divers, I can't see where just having an AOW card means that a diver has the experience either.......


From a liability standpoint,.. what is a shop to do? By a diver having an AOW card, it means they *should* potentially have the abilities to do it, as signed off by the issuing instructor.

Sounds like you've pretty much been given the shop's policy on the subject,.... I'd say the choices are to go with their policies or find another operation that will accept your log book as proof of your experience.

 

[ccx2]

I think it's a Liability issue for the shop,your supposed to have the card and if something happened the shop would maybe be in bad situation.
I would pay the 50 for the babysitter and have a good time, and I think if the babysitter is an instructor the dive would count toward your AOW card...I think.
At 50 buck the shop or the instructor aren't making anything much are they?
Have fun.

 

[Muisit]

Yeah, just a weird situation, such as this one. My fiance is much much less experienced and wouldn't be comfortable diving without me. She dove twice last summer, while I dove 48 times. She would probably need me to oversee her hooking her gear up, yet she's qualified for the dive, and I am not. I just thought that seeing instructor #s and signatures on 120ft dives would validate a diver's experience level. I'm sure it is more the insurance companies and lawyers to blame, rather than the dive shop. Frustrates the heck out of me, but she certainly is getting a kick out of it, ha ha.

 

[MegToothMark]

I'm going to have to say experience definitely trumps the AOW card. No matter how good your instructor is, and how many cards you have in your book, nothing takes away the dive anxiety of being down 110ft+, other than experience. Legalities in America....gotta love them!

 

[DennisS]

I got my AOW after 30 years of diving. It was a pretty lame course, swim through some hula hoops, go down to 100 ft and do a multiplication problem, swim along the bottom in 15 ft at night. I now have the magic card that the dive boat operators want to see.

It was a pre req for rescue so it wasn't totally useless

 

[oly5050user]

An advance card shows training beyond ow level.thats it,does not mean person is an "advanced diver".Navigation is a important skill conducted during any advance certification course that many people put minimum effort into. Being able to conduct a dive in limited vis waters ,swim around for 45 minutes and be able to relocate an ascent line is a skill that divers should have, and many do not.Makes the dive safer and avoids having any long surface swims. Most charters require the advance card for certain dives.Many require if an ow diver wants to do the dive they have to dive with a pro "escourt". I do not see any issue with it as a log book can easily be falsified.Better safe than sorry..That said if a diver demonstrates superior abilities beyond ow level to the pro during the first dive then usually any subsequent dives can be done with their advance certified buddy and there would be no need for a pro escourt to accompant them. I agree that card can mean squat, but liabilities exist and its always a case of "CYA"..(cover your ass..)

 

[fnfalman]

I'd say find another dive charter.

I got a divemaster on a boat telling me that she thinks a diver fresh out of OW and AOW are "certified" to dive to 100' but an OW diver with tons of dives shouldn't do it because the mere OW diver didn't have the "proper training".

Consider the "training" that goes in AOW, I laugh whenever these professionals try to tell me that it's suppose to mean something.

Yeah, the charter could use the "liability" line, but really it's about $$$$$$. You're on a dive boat, and you've already signed a liability waiver. Their asses are covered.