Spare Air - Sorry!

[RalphPorter]

Appreciate all your thoughts guys - the theme is certainly recurring! it's kind of dissapointing in a way because it looks like such a neat solution but if it's not a solution then neat stands for little. What do we think about the testimonials from people who claim it's saved their life etc..

 

[UaVaj]

Appreciate all your thoughts guys - the theme is certainly recurring! it's kind of dissapointing in a way because it looks like such a neat solution but if it's not a solution then neat stands for little. What do we think about the testimonials from people who claim it's saved their life etc..

Sad as this may sound. There is an ass for every seat. Even false hope.

The only thing a spare air is good for is: an ascend from 33' or less without a safety stop. Then again. If you are at 33' or less - chances are you can do a CESA.

You mention "60ft is the floor with occasional deeper detour to see that thing of interest." 60ft can easily become 90ft or 120ft due to thing of interest.

Either stay close (very close) to your buddy or get the correct bail-out bottle.


More food for thought.
http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ba...-bail-out-bottle-size-advance-open-water.html



Bottomline is: Get the right gear capable of handling the task/emergency.

 

[DevonDiver]

I've attached a handy little 'Spare Air' calculation spreadsheet that I got from someone on the board. It's quite eye opening.

When entering your SAC... remember that in a real emergency, your air consumption (accelerated SAC) is likely to be anywhere between 2 - 8 times as much as your non-stressed SAC.

If your heart is racing (OOA...no buddy! thump thump thump) it might be wise to assume somewhere arounf 75-100lpm...

 

[Belmont]

Whatever you get, plan and execute your dives as if you didn't have an exterior redundant air source.

Your best bet is on your own back gas. Watch it's level as if your life depended on it.

If you cultivate that habit you will never have to use a redundant air source in the type of recreational diving you are doing.

Carry one for your peace of mind but don't ever include it in your gas plan.

 

[txapacheguy]

Here is a 13cf pony for sale... http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/cl...ands/362601-13-cf-pony-w-tank-mount-75-a.html

Add a reasonably priced used regulator (or spare that you have laying around) and you have a nice redundant air supply that should give you a little time at 60' to sort out a problem, and then make a safe ascent and maybe even a safety stop...

I just bought one 19cf pony from an ad here on the board shipped with new hydro and vis for less than $100 total, and ordered another one from my LDS. I have less invested in both tanks than a spare air costs, and have enough regs laying around to outfit both... I expect that my days of diving past 30' or 40' or so without a fully redundant air supply are mostly over. Now if I could just get a chance to go out and get all my new toys wet for a little while...

 

[triggerman365]

I did all the SB research and then got a 19 cu ft pony. I really like it and have less than $250 into it with the bottle, reg. and mounts. Another bonus is that it is enough negative that I don't need any lead.

 

[RalphPorter]

Carry one for your peace of mind but don't ever include it in your gas plan.

Absolutely clear - we're always on the surface with over 50 bar and that's the way we'll always dive.

During the threads I noted one comment about not wombling around on the bottom trying to locate your buddy in an OOA situation, if hypothetically you're at 60' and find yourself with an equipment failure, and you have the option of a spare air / small pony to get safely to your buddy and oriented for a controlled ascent are we actually saying that we'd ignore that option and CESA is the way to go anyway. I understand completely that a close buddy is the way to go and in no way am I planning an alternaive for that, unless your eyes are transfixed on your Buddy all the time (maybe not as interesting as the wild life!) you're going to end up a few meters apart from time to time.

 

[String]

If you think you need a redundant air source then get a proper one, a pony of 3l should suffice. A spare air offers no increase in safety and is often just dangerous as people push more with that false feeling of security.
For the crazy price of a spare air for not a lot more you can get a 3l pony setup and reg which IS a viable method of getting out of trouble as opposed to something that gives you 2-3 breaths of gas and a likely rapid ascent to the surface.

That said, ive never seen one on the UK. Are the valves even EN certified and legal here?

 

[DevonDiver]

My pattern of thought comes from military training. Keep your options simple. More than one option requires problem solving. The need for problem solving in an emergency will dramatically slow your response. K.I.S.S.

No air... look around... buddy not aware.... buddy a few meters distant and still finning away...depth 18m.... CESA....go!

or

No air... look around... buddy not aware.... buddy a few meters distant and still finning away.... do I CESA? Do I use Spare Air to get to them.... ponder for a few seconds.... need air NOW... deploy spare air.... look around for buddy again.... buddy now lost in bad viz.....think I know where they should be.....fin in their direction.... still can't see buddy....hmmm..... maybe better to get to the surface now....hmmmm....one last look around.... eeekkkk.... spare air is expended..... what shall I do...... fin towards surface.... really oxygen starved now..... fin faster.....where is my buddy?....... where is the surface?...... eeekkk.....gotta breath now..........


Do not underestimate how the requirement to problem solve will detract from your reaction speed when you are highly stressed during an incident. Divers are trained to have a set reaction to set problems. They are trained that way for a reason. The military do the same. It works. It is based on sound logic and experience.

Spare Air is nothing more than a CESA bottle. Not a true redundant air source. A couple of seconds screwing around on the bottom before initiating your ascent will waste down your Spare Air.

You theory on using Spare Air seems to rely on absolutely the best possible circumstances (other than the initial OOA problem). Add some bad viz, current, underwater terrain, buoyancy issues, panic and confusion to the recipe and your hypothetical scenario will play out very differently.

Out-of-air.....buddy not immediately available.... CESA. It's that simple. Get to the surface...get to that unlimited air supply....get buoyant.... then there's plenty of opportunity to discuss and debate what went wrong.

Divers die every year because they fail to adhere to their core training and the drills that are taught to them on entry level courses. If every diver stuck to their training and reacted as per that training, then a lot of deaths would be avoided.

If in doubt, spend some time browsing the 'Annual Accident Report' which is available as PDF download from the BSAC website. It's sobering...and as real as it gets.

 

[DevonDiver]

f hypothetically you're at 60' and find yourself with an equipment failure, and you have the option of a spare air / small pony to get safely to your buddy

hmmm...the same 'hypothetical' scenario could be used as a justification to invest in a mini-DPV (dive scooter).

It would make just as much sense as a Spare Air...