TSA got you down?

[Mike Boswell]

I clicked on the link and almost had an epileptic seizure.......

I know. I wish more people cared.

Darn, you are master of NOT answering the questions. He asked you what would be your limit for going through security checkpoint at the airport. What would you find unreasonable.

I said it depends. "It depends" is an answer. In fact, "It depends" is the only honest answer to all non-trivial questions.

New PADI Specialty?

I would almost welcome another PADI bashing thread. Here, let me help with some original new ideas:

"Only a card". "Only a piece of paper". "Dumbed-down". "Put another Dollar In". "Not as good as NAUI". "Yada Yada Yada"

.....Bring it on!

The specific situation at hand is airline security. how much more specific do you want? We are talking about being treated WORSE than a criminal because we want to get on an airplane. See I believe the government has crossed the line. Actually I think they crossed the line some time ago, but this is really way cross the line. You (as in everyone who thinks these invasive scans should be legal) don't. So I want to know what would be the minimum in your mind that the government could do to cross that line of too much? If you cannot answer that question, then we have lost our 4th amendment, and this is no longer America.

I certainly don't want to be responsible for losing the 4th Amendment or America, so I will endeavor to just give you a more straightforward answer. Machine scanners don't bother me. Radar doesn't bother me. I have been wanded, frisked, and patted down in airports: It didn't bother me. But more invasive than that would be too much for me.

Wait 'til you're my age and you need to get a colonoscopy, kid. You have no idea....

I'm one of the lucky ones; I don't believe TSA has conspired to sexually molest me. (Perhaps due to low self esteem?) In any event, ignorance is, most certainly, bliss. They wanna take my pic; good luck to 'em and their strong stomachs. My wife and girlfriends think MY screenings are a hoot. I don't know if the (TSA's, not mine) equipment is unproven; you obviously have insider knowledge and may be right. Or wrong. In any case I'm focusing my energies on more important issues like who will win on DWTS, what color sox to wear tomorrow and whether to set the washer on HOT or WARM.

That's the spirit.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

If your plane even goes through American airspace without landing in the States (which some domestic Canadian flights do, say flying from southwestern Ontario to the Prairies, you would fly over Michigan, etc) the American government demands the personal information of passengers, which is at the present contrary to Canadian law.

If you fly from Toronto to the States, you will go through US customs and immigration right there in Canada. Through a legal agreement between the two countries, this area of the Pearson International Airport is considered to be American soil. So you go through American security etc right there in Canada. It was originally intended to speed things up flying into the States, you'd be pre-cleared. Well, since Sept 11, 2001, most US airports put you through customs and immigration if you are from a foreign destination as a matter of course, so it means you are going through US customs and immigration twice if you fly through Pearson. Which is why I avoid this airport when flying to the States. Once through the process in a single flight is quite enough.

Look at the bright side ... at least US government didn't send you to Syria for "interrogation" ... like they did to this Canadian citizen ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I have been wanded, frisked, and patted down in airports: It didn't bother me. But more invasive than that would be too much for me.

Lowell George saw it comin' ...


I been warped by the rain, driven by the snow
I'm drunk and dirty don't ya know, and I'm still, willin'
Out on the road late at night, Seen my pretty Alice in every head light
Alice, Dallas Alice

I've been kicked by the wind, robbed by the sleet
Had my head stoved in, but I'm still on my feet and I'm still... willin'
Now I smuggled some smokes and folks from Mexico
Baked by the sun, every time I go to Mexico, and I'm still ... willin'

I've been from Tucson to Tucumcari
Tehachapi to Tonapah
Driven every kind of rig that's ever been made
Driven the back roads so I wouldn't get weighed
And if you give me: weed, whites, and wine
And you show me a sign
I'll be willin', to be movin'

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[D_B]

Look at the bright side ... at least US government didn't send you to Syria for "interrogation" ... like they did to this Canadian citizen ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I read the whole thing, and am appalled

" I now understand how fragile our human rights and freedoms are, and how easily they can be taken from us by the very same governments and institutions that have sworn to protect us "

 

[kombiguy]

I'd like to try a "gedanken" with everybody. Let us suppose, for a moment, that the government could protect you from all criminal and terrorist threats. The price for that would be that the first amendment would disappear. Would you be in favor or opposed?
Believe it or not, I'm really not trying to start a fight. I'm just curious.

 

[vladimir]

Let us suppose, for a moment, that the government could protect you from all criminal and terrorist threats. The price for that would be that the first amendment would disappear. Would you be in favor or opposed?

Who would protect us from the government? And why did you select the first amendment for your thought experiment, when the fourth is most germane?

By the way, that experiment has been in progress for a half century in Singapore. They had to give up the protections in our second, fourth, fifth, seventh, and eight amendments, in addition to the first, but they got 8% annual growth* thrown in. They seem to be happy with the deal.


*made-up statistic that's probably not too far off.

 

[parrotheaddiver]

https://www.lifelibertyetc.com/Products/TShirts/TSA-Checkpoint-TShirt

in the words of Olivia Newton John..."Let's get physical...physical"

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I still fail to see how it is the federal goverments job to provide security for private airlines. That to me is the first issue, all the other stuff is secondary.

What makes you think this has anything to do with airline security?



Welcome to the new USSR ... next up, National ID cards ... your papers, please ...

How many of you have ever read this story?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[naimis]

How many of you have ever read this story?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Don't think I ever read Animal Farm, but I'm thinking Lord of the Flies is perhaps a more apt analogy...

 

[lmorin]

......................
If you fly from Toronto to the States, you will go through US customs and immigration right there in Canada. Through a legal agreement between the two countries, this area of the Pearson International Airport is considered to be American soil. So you go through American security etc right there in Canada. It was originally intended to speed things up flying into the States, you'd be pre-cleared. Well, since Sept 11, 2001, most US airports put you through customs and immigration if you are from a foreign destination as a matter of course, so it means you are going through US customs and immigration twice if you fly through Pearson. Which is why I avoid this airport when flying to the States. Once through the process in a single flight is quite enough.

My family and I fly frequently from LGA or JFK to Toronto Pearson and return. On these trips, we have never gone through customs and immigration at either NYC airport. Only in the US controlled areas at Pearson.