What level diver and what type of BC?

[tarponchik]

Honestly, I do not understand this obsession with gear. BCs IMHO are the least individual of all diving gear: just pick your size and dive. I dove in many rental BCs before I got my own, and could not tell one from another. $250, $750--they are all the same. More pockets means extra weight and extra crap you are likely to put there (and eventually lose it). I never tried wings but I strongly suspect I won't be able to tell the difference either. No offence to anyone, but my strong suspision is that people are just trying to be different. Some wear Mohawks, some dive with wings.

Don't know if this is true for tech diving, though.

 

[shogan]

Hum thank you for this response. I am that recreational diver and don't see me getting into any of things that you state predicate a bp/w. I was getting pulled into the bp/w but kept asking myself why when there is a glut of good quality but yet low price bc's of all styles on the market both new and used. I'm going to take this time of market glut of bc's and buy one. If later I decide I need a backplate I might try it.

I agree with Nemrod, in 40 years, I started with double hose, plate with no floatation, and have used almost every combination that has come along.

From reading the posts on Scubaboard, there are more new divers using BP&W for appearance than for need. This survey shows a large percentage of BP&W users, but in freshwater diving in 4 states in the midwest, and Mexico Caribbean, it is rare to see a BP, except for a few advanced divers. . . which they are using them because it serves their needs.

I'm not against BP&W, I've used them for double and triple tank configurations where I had long bottom times, usually working. I've used back inflate and jacket styles since they were introduced in the mid 70's. There are complaints from some users of jackets, If they don't get a proper fit, that's true. There are many brands, and some of the imports and some of the cheaper jackets don't fit properly. Like all diving equipment, to get a good fit, you must dive with it to try the fit.

BP&W is the best piece of equipment, if you are diving multiple tanks or diving a drysuit, or working in a rough working dive that will destroy "normal" dive gear. All of these are beyond most divers experience.

Having taught, and watched over divers for many years, we all want to help the beginners. Most of these new divers won't stay with diving to become "advanced" and pushing them to use "advanced" gear will shorten the time they'll remain diving. If you can advise someone who shows interest in advanced diving, go ahead and recommend what you use. But look at the gear, most manufacturers make, what most dive shops sell, and realize that those are the configurations best for most beginning divers. BP&W are a small fraction of the floatation market, usually "home" made or small company manufactured.

A huge percentage of divers will only dive on vacation, only dive single tanks, only dive in mild temperatures, not go deep, not dive wrecks, not dive under ice, not dive caves. . . If you're a diver that does all of these things, or some of them, choose what you need for your diving profile. But don't push a beginner into looking "Pro" before they need to begin advanced training.

 

[DCBC]

I use jacket, back inflate, BP/W or none, depending upon the diving situation.

 

[DaleC]

I didn't see empty bleach bottle tied to a string on the list anywhere.

 

[Sas]

I agree with Nemrod, in 40 years, I started with double hose, plate with no floatation, and have used almost every combination that has come along.

From reading the posts on Scubaboard, there are more new divers using BP&W for appearance than for need. This survey shows a large percentage of BP&W users, but in freshwater diving in 4 states in the midwest, and Mexico Caribbean, it is rare to see a BP, except for a few advanced divers. . . which they are using them because it serves their needs.

I'm not against BP&W, I've used them for double and triple tank configurations where I had long bottom times, usually working. I've used back inflate and jacket styles since they were introduced in the mid 70's. There are complaints from some users of jackets, If they don't get a proper fit, that's true. There are many brands, and some of the imports and some of the cheaper jackets don't fit properly. Like all diving equipment, to get a good fit, you must dive with it to try the fit.

BP&W is the best piece of equipment, if you are diving multiple tanks or diving a drysuit, or working in a rough working dive that will destroy "normal" dive gear. All of these are beyond most divers experience.

Having taught, and watched over divers for many years, we all want to help the beginners. Most of these new divers won't stay with diving to become "advanced" and pushing them to use "advanced" gear will shorten the time they'll remain diving. If you can advise someone who shows interest in advanced diving, go ahead and recommend what you use. But look at the gear, most manufacturers make, what most dive shops sell, and realize that those are the configurations best for most beginning divers. BP&W are a small fraction of the floatation market, usually "home" made or small company manufactured.

A huge percentage of divers will only dive on vacation, only dive single tanks, only dive in mild temperatures, not go deep, not dive wrecks, not dive under ice, not dive caves. . . If you're a diver that does all of these things, or some of them, choose what you need for your diving profile. But don't push a beginner into looking "Pro" before they need to begin advanced training.

BP/W isn't an advanced piece of gear at all, and people who keep assuming it is only for advanced diving are wrong. It's cheap (my brand new doubles BP/W setup cost 270USD for a doubles wing and AL backplate + harness), lots of people have them locally new and experienced divers alike (and most stores stock them, some exclusively unless you request another type of BC), and it is more modular than most other styles of BC and it can be adjusted very easily.

I mean, I think some people don't like to wear them but your post is wrong when you say it is only for fancy pants diving and:

if you are diving multiple tanks or diving a drysuit, or working in a rough working dive that will destroy "normal" dive gear. All of these are beyond most divers experience.

And your incorrect assumptions have been taken on board by a new diver here:

Hum thank you for this response. I am that recreational diver and don't see me getting into any of things that you state predicate a bp/w. I was getting pulled into the bp/w but kept asking myself why when there is a glut of good quality but yet low price bc's of all styles on the market both new and used. I'm going to take this time of market glut of bc's and buy one. If later I decide I need a backplate I might try it.

If it hadn't been for that I wouldn't have commented.

Shogan, don't listen to mudhole (or me when I say I think BP/W is the best setup ). Try various BCs out including a BP/W if you have the chance before you pay any money, and make up your own mind. No sense in having a cheap bit of gear from a BC glut if it isn't comfortable.

 

[Hepcat62]

Your area is probably a little different than where I'm from. Here (SF Bay Area) I don't know of one shop that will have anything to do with BP/W rigs.

Huh? I live on the peninsula (Redwood Shores), and there are at least two successful shops within 20 minutes of me that always keep Halcyon setups in-stock. One of the shops carries other brands of BP/W as well. One is a more tech-focused shop, and the other is a very recreational shop which also offers some "tech" gear for sale.

As an aside, I'm a recent BP/W convert (bought at the aforementioned recreational shop) and I'm definitely not a tech-diver of any sort (yet). I believe that Halcyon has created something with their new Cinch/Infinity setup that is a totally valid and highly recommendable system for new recreational divers, especially in the cold MoCal and NorCal waters.

 

[hg frogman]

This poll is representative of Scubaboard posters. Many of them are fans of BP/Ws. No need of a poll to notice that.

Look at most tropical (or even temperate) dive scenes (for example Red Sea) and you'll see something different, notably amongst dive professionals. Though BP/Ws are a bit less marginal now.

And finally, as many others have said, the same diver will dive with different gear depending on the type of dive he or she plans.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Huh? I live on the peninsula (Redwood Shores), and there are at least two successful shops within 20 minutes of me that always keep Halcyon setups in-stock. One of the shops carries other brands of BP/W as well. One is a more tech-focused shop, and the other is a very recreational shop which also offers some "tech" gear for sale.

As an aside, I'm a recent BP/W convert (bought at the aforementioned recreational shop) and I'm definitely not a tech-diver of any sort (yet). I believe that Halcyon has created something with their new Cinch/Infinity setup that is a totally valid and highly recommendable system for new recreational divers, especially in the cold MoCal and NorCal waters.

Come up to the North Bay and try and find one shop that carries a BP/W system or much less even knows what one is.
There's a shop in Sausalito, Bamboo in Marin, Pinnacles in Novato, pinnacles in Santa Rosa, Bamboo in RP, Bodega Bay pro dive, Petaluma Sport And Dive, Subsurface Progression in Fort Bragg, not one of them have anything close.

 

[MaxBottomtime]

Of course, you could easily order a new Freedom Plate from Scubatoys and get a 10% discount when you mention Scubaboard.
Freedom Backplate reviews and discounts, ScubaToys

 

[shoredivr]

I never tried wings but I strongly suspect I won't be able to tell the difference either. No offence to anyone, but my strong suspision is that people are just trying to be different. [...]
Don't know if this is true for tech diving, though.

When I stared diving a drysuit, I couldn't stand the squeeze factor that a vest style BC had. Also, it made finding and using the suit inflator more difficult. I tried a Transpac and found it to be easy and useful for the diving I do up here.

With a backplate, there is not a lot of stuff obscuring your torso. It is different. C'mon up here to the Great Lakes, you can try out a Transpac or an OMS plate and see for yourself.

And for tech diving, you can tell the difference right away: a vest style BC has way less versatility and usefullness than a harness. You can use different sizes of wings if you need, while with a vest style BC you've only got one size of bladder.