Is safe second really needed?

[Suian]

I do know of people that dive without an occy and their choice, personally I'd never do such a thing.
I see it from this perspective:
If you are 30m or 100m or 10m down and something goes wrong, you can't always rely on your buddy, buddy breathing may be a "redundant" skill, but its not that its outdated, its more that is very unreliable if you or your buddy are narced or panicing at the time.

You also can't put a price on a Human life either.

 

[Walter]

I have never had a flat tire or a dead battery in my truck. I am going to remove my spare tire and jumper cables today . Truthfully, you never need it - until you NEED it. Personally, I would keep it

The difference is you are not replacing your spare tire or jumper cables with a working alternative. He's diving with a buddy who is, like him, comfortable with buddy breathing. That is a working alternative. They don't NEED it. It's nice to have and I recommend they put their octos back on and leave them there, but they don't need them.

 

[Gombessa]

JeffG's Law: As a diving discussion grows longer, the probability of invoking DIR approaches 1.

I'm suppressing the urge to channel GI3.

Our first place loser, and beautifully random to boot! Congrats good sir!

Why is it that DIR divers cannot simply answer a question with a straightforward normal answer (I understand that this is a a rash gereralization.....sorry) and without the need to 'Channel GI3'...........

Because GI3 has all the answers. What do you call it when you row a boat? Stroke. Why's grampa seizing like that? Stroke. What function do you use in Photoshop that gives a hard outline around a selection? Stroke. Also, you lose.

I just prefer not to do my DIR rig for a simple everyday 40ft hohum dive in Catalina.

Trolling is an artform; when you try too hard, it just looks needy.

I would respectfully request that you term this a Hog rig rather than a DIR rig, because your attitude toward diving is not at all DIR.

Wow Lynne, that's almost Minnesota nice

Why would anyone think it was a DIR approach when he just stated he wasn't diving DIR?

Walter can't lose, he'll just outquote and outlast everybody. You get a pass.

everything you've typed in this thread suggests that you're about as far from DIR as a diver can possibly get. I'd recommend leaving DIR out of the discussion.

Elegant baiting, Bob. The lose count will only increase.

God, this whole thread is like talking to Hitle...damn, I lose.

 

[Rhone Man]

I don't dive with an octo when open water diving, but that is just personal preference. "Every man should be free to seek his own road to hell."

 

[Rhone Man]

You also can't put a price on a Human life either.

Not true. The American DOT values a statistical human life at $5.8 million.

The British DOT only values it at GBP 165,000 though. Oh well.

 

[DaleC]

Is not ever having carried an octo rather then deciding to remove it also considered selfish or do I get grandfathered into the octo era because I started diving in the pre-octo era.

Captain,
I like your posts and the way you dive so I'm not going to go there with you. There's a difference between the way you and the OP approach it in my eyes (from the wording of his post). I would look forward to diving with you anytime, and gaining from your experience.

I'm all for independance, experimentation, stepping off the beaten path etc... most of my role models have this trait and I engage it it quite a bit myself. However, I have one simple rule that I try to follow:

If I'm going to do something off the wall I'm the one that takes the hit - not some unsuspecting other guy.

I believe a thinking diver can accomplish their personal goals and consider the safety of others. If someone sets the other guy up for a hit they get a thumbs down in my book.

 

[DailyLunatic]

So here is the true question can anyone give me a valid reason why I should carry a "octo" on open water dives? And further more a situation where buddy breathing would not work, but an "octo" would. Please justify your reasoning and back it up with a story if possible. Or if you agree, leave a "Hell Yeah". QUOTE]
Hmmm... Why would I want to have a backup for my Life Support System... hmmm...

 

[rstofer]

The reality is that in a true emergency are you going to be willing to take your regulator out of your mouth the give it someone else, now with buddy breathing your partner has to give back the regulator, if they are panicked then who knows if you will get it back.

We were taught that when donating your primary (before octos), you kept your hand on the regulator under your buddy's hand. If your OOA buddy didn't give you the regulator, you took it back. With excess force, if necessary. Never, ever, let go of the regulator!

I want to dive with my double hose regulator. This poses a problem with buddy breathing in that my buddy (my wife) has absolutely no interest in trying to breathe from a DH much less buddy breathe. So, I have an octo on a short hose clipped to my upper right D-ring. As it lays, I can breathe from it. My buddy can get up close and personal to grab a breathe and then we can unclip it. It's not as neat as a long hose solution but, in the context of DH, it's about as good as it's going to get.

Richard

 

[Peter Guy]

Why have an Octo when diving OW -- well, here's a story from a long ago time involving my Dad and his wife/buddy.

In the late 60's my Dad heard about some guys who had put a 2nd second stage on their regulator thus giving them a spare. He thought this was an interesting idea and he and the LDS owner figured out how to put together an "octopus" for my Dad and Mel (LDS owner). One day Dad and wife were out diving (hunting?) when wife started sucking hard and then she reached to pull down her J and guess what -- it was already down! She swam over to him, grabbed that new-fangled (why do you have THAT when you can easily buddy breathe?) contraption -- problem FOR BOTH OF THEM easily solved.

Were they taught to buddy breathe? Of course -- that was the only option generally accepted. Did they learn that using an "Octopus safe second" was a lot simpler and less stressful than BB? You bet.

BTW, within the week my step-mother had an "Octopus safe second" on her reg too!

(Note, this was in 1971? and they are both still pretty hale and hearty in their late 80's early 90's -- I should be so lucky!)

 

[pittyyofool]

JeffG's Law:

Trolling is an artform; when you try too hard, it just looks needy.

Hhahahahahaha LOL. You hit that nail on the head. You are a wise fish and did not fall for the bait, but some others... well they say you never catch the smart fish.

TsandM: I will do as you request and not refer to it as DIR and use HOG form now on, or until I change my ways and never question authority. This is to limit confusion, too the obvious I AM NOWHERE CLOSE TO A DIR MINDSET. I have never been to a GUE class. I just use a HOG like rig for my wreck diving, because it is sensible, practical, and a well designed unit for non-recreational situations.