Nitrox - 1.40 or 1.60 PO2?

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Funnily enough, I just received in the post today my TDI Advanced Nitrox Manual, and admittedly I only flicked through it over lunch, it seems to imply that planning on the basis of 1.6 ATA is standard, and implying lower partial pressures are more conservative.

I'll read the manual more carefully in due course, but that certainly jumped out at me having monitored this thread through today.
 
In O2 therapy they take you up because the O2 is the point....

Correct. When doctors give oxygen therapy, it is because we have determined that a patient has or may have low oxygen levels in the blood. Tissues need oxygen to survive, so we increase the levels as high as 100%. If necessary, we even deliver it under pressure.

In recreational diving, oxygen is not usually the point. That is, when we use gases with higher percentages of oxygen (Nitrox), it is not because we want to breathe more oxygen. It is because we want to breathe less nitrogen. (I know you know this, PB, but just saying this to complete the point here.)

Even when we suspect DCS, we advise giving 100% O2 not because the patient needs more oxygen, but because there is less nitrogen in the inhaled air. This increases the nitrogen differential between the inhaled air and the gases in the lungs , helping the patient to eliminate nitrogen.
 
Correct. When doctors give oxygen therapy, it is because we have determined that a patient has or may have low oxygen levels in the blood. Tissues need oxygen to survive, so we increase the levels as high as 100%. If necessary, we even deliver it under pressure.
Isn't hyperbaric oxygen therapy more often for cases where the the blood O2 levels are fine, but that there is some sort of circulatory or tissue damage problem that is making it so that not enough blood is reaching the tissue in question ?

I was under the impression that one of the reasons for HBOT was to supplement or replace the blood/hemoglobin O2 transport mechanism with other mechanisms such as the oxygen dissolved in plasma, and the reason for pressure was to increase the amount of dissolved O2 up to useful levels.

(yeah, this is a bit of hijack from the original question, but that one has been beat to death)
 
Does anyone have a link to any literature regarding the use of Nitrox and certain medications like beta blockers, calcium channel blockers, blood thinners, etc?

Richard
 
Funnily enough, I just received in the post today my TDI Advanced Nitrox Manual, and admittedly I only flicked through it over lunch, it seems to imply that planning on the basis of 1.6 ATA is standard, and implying lower partial pressures are more conservative.

I'll read the manual more carefully in due course, but that certainly jumped out at me having monitored this thread through today.

As I read it - the TDI standard is that 1.6 PO2 is the MOD; but should only be used in a resting/decompression portion of a dive. Also to be considered is that 1.6 PO2 has a "CNS CLOCK" time limit of 45 minutes for a single dive, and 150 minutes daily. Which, if you're doing a long decompression portion, or a long dive segment at that PO2 will get eaten up quickly.
 
In post #49 I replied to String, talking about CO2 retainers in the sense that doctors usually talk about them. These are people with chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD) who have disrupted breathing-control mechanisms.

Subsequent posts and articles cited in this thread made me realize that people were talking about CO2 retention in more than one context. This included questions about CO2 in the light of altered breathing patterns among divers (skip-breathing and breath-holding). Duh!

The OP inquired about what level people use as their cut-offs for O2 exposure when diving with Nitrox. It seems, though, that this has generated significant interest in gases in general and how they inter-relate while diving.

I am not a technical diver, and I'm still riding the learning curve as to how some of the things I learned in medical training relate to diving. Nevertheless, since people are tossing out hypotheses, let me clarify and expand upon my earlier remarks with respect to CO2 retention, for whatever it is worth.

In Physiology 101 we all learned that the purpose of breathing is primarily to (1) take in oxygen which all tissues need to survive, and (2) to get rid of CO2 which is a by-product of normal metabolism. Keeping the CO2 in check is also important in helping to regulate blood pH balance.

In Diving 101 we learned that the air we breathe is mostly composed of nitrogen, a bystander which may or may not be so innocent when consumed in increasing quantities.

Now, ventilation (breathing) is basically the process which moves all these gases in and out of our lungs. Cells in our brains and the tiny little sacs in our lungs monitor all these gases and work together to facilitate the exchange of the gases to and from the blood.

Although breathing itself seems simple: breathe in, breathe out, repeat -- its control is actually quite complicated. There are many reflexes, feedback loops, and control systems that match gas exchange with metabolic needs. The respiratory system is primarily regulated by the brainstem which monitors CO2-induced pH changes in the blood. Breathing is also controlled by the level of O2 in the blood, but to a much lesser degree. In normal people, CO2 is the predominant controller of the drive to breath, and this is regulated by both neural and chemical sensors that attempt to maintain CO2 levels within a very tight range.

While the metabolic rate influences CO2 production, the most influential factor which affects CO2 levels is ventilation. Increased ventilation enhances the elimination of CO2, leading to lower blood levels. Conversely, decreased ventilation impairs the elimination of CO2, leading to higher blood levels. In medicine, we talk about hyperventilation as a way to "blow off CO2," and when we see high blood CO2 levels, we look to see whether the cause is decreased ventilation.

Things that decrease ventilation are (1) slower breathing rate and (2) increasing dead space. (Dead space is space where air moves back and forth, but where gas exchange does not take place.)

In divers, slow breathing may be promoted by diving at depth, but it is usually intentional.

Increased dead space among divers can occur when the distance between the mouth and inhaled air is lengthened (such as with a snorkel or old-style back-mounted regulator). Dead space can also be "created" by shallow breathing which moves air back and forth within the bronchial tubes but not enough beyond them to get adequate air exchange.

Does the level of CO2 affect one's sensitivity to nitrogen or oxygen toxicity? Maybe. Increasing CO2 lowers blood pH (makes it more acidic) which, in turn, can cause all kinds of problems at the cellular level.

Here's the problem in a nutshell as I see it: Diving is not normal. We were not made to live under water. When we force the issue by creating devices that allow us to spend time in a world that is unnatural to us, bad things can happen. We may think we have thought about all the things that can go wrong, but there is much that we do not know and much that we do not understand. Even if we did, I think the processes going on simultaneously are so complicated and intricate that trying to control them all would be like those people who try to spin more and more plates on sticks. It can get to be just too much.

It is nice that smart (and, I suppose, a few dumb) people get curious and figure out ways to extend the boundaries. As for me, I'm content to stay within the limits of what all those human guinea pigs have found works.

Still, one of the neatest things about diving is the challenge of figuring out how the physics and the physiology mesh. That's why I, too, love discussions like this thread where everybody chips in.

I'll say one thing: The more I read on this board, the more I realize how much I do not know about diving, medicine, and life. So I appreciate all the contributors who take the time to share their knowledge and experience with relative newcomers like me.
 
Could you use some other mix, like Heliox to accomplish the same thing?

If you mean by "the same thing" to lower nitrogen exposure, Yes.

Again, I'm no tech diver, but as I understand it, the reason for adding a third gas, such as helium, is to lower the amount of nitrogen AND oxygen by adding yet another inert gas.
 

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