CESA over Shared Air Ascent: Which is Best

[Bob Vincent]

As HALEMANO states, "Evidently there is some terminology/training breakdown here. In the PADI OW training, the order of priority when low on/out of air is; normal ascent (low but enough), alternate ascent (buddy accessible), controlled emergency swimming ascent (CESA), buddy breathing (buddy with no alternate), buoyant emergency ascent (last resort)."

Guys to me 25ft is not a real number. Why not swim up? You'll be at the surface alot sooner than messing with anything else. But every situation is different. Lets say we are at 80ft and have been there for close to 35 minutes and our buddy is 40 ft away? What do we do for a safety stop? What if your an old diver and made 100's of dives at 80ft for 40 minutes and went straight to the surface without being hit? And at 1 foot in 1 second all the way up. How many times have you practiced free ascents lets say from 120ft.?

What I'm saying training is the key here. Why run out of air in the first place? I think you know better. You have X amount of air, your buddy has X amount you are diving together remember we take turns one leads the other follows. We check each others air supply along the dive. What's up with this running out of air ...

 

[24940]

What I'm saying training is the key here. Why run out of air in the first place? I think you know better. You have X amount of air, your buddy has X amount you are diving together remember we take turns one leads the other follows. We check each others air supply along the dive. What's up with this running out of air ...

There are other reasons to share air besides running out and one of them happened three times during checkout dives this weekend. In every case, CESA would have resulted in one diver being left on the bottom with no clue as to where his "buddy" went. Fortunately, there was an attentive buddy in each case and nobody was left on the bottom to fend for themselves.

I'd also take issue with one lead, one follow method for new divers who are not using lights for passive communication.

 

[Hank658]

There are other reasons to share air besides running out and one of them happened three times during checkout dives this weekend.

Can you tell us what the specific circumstances were that led to sharing of air? Thanks. I'm just curious what would put divers in this situation besides an OOA event.

 

[raymond phule]

As taught by PADI;

1. Normal ascent
2. Alternate ascent
3. Controlled emergency ascent
4. Buddy breathing
5. Buoyant emergency ascent

I looked in my manual and this is not completely true according to my manual.

1. Normal ascent
2. Alternate ascent
3. Controlled emergency ascent, if your depth is no more than 6-9 m (or something similar)
4. Buddy breathing
5. Buoyant emergency ascent

Another thing I believe is important. You have an OOA and need to decide what to do. Lets assume 2 choices, CESA and swim to your buddy to get air. The absolutely worst scenario is that you try to get air from your buddy but this don't work out for some reason. The problem is that this takes time that could have been used in a CESA and it is also possibly that it result in panic. I believe 10-20 seconds trying to solve the problem before trying to reach the surface is a long time for most people.

 

[24940]

Can you tell us what the specific circumstances were that led to sharing of air? Thanks. I'm just curious what would put divers in this situation besides an OOA event.

Uncontrolled freeflow, leading to a frozen first stage. Water temps were about 42 and all regs were Scubapro..... In one case, the student didn't get the mouthpiece oriented properly after removal and it froze immediately. Another case, the student was just breathing hard and it froze.

They were warned about such things and were prepared to share air. No stress, just annoyance.

 

[Al Mialkovsky]

They were warned about such things and were prepared to share air. No stress, just annoyance.

It's all stress for the instructor baby You're sure they're going to be solid but until it turns ugly, who knows. At least they proved themselves under fire. They earned their cards.

Now to find out if they need some warm water training, I wonder if a certain instructor on Maui can check them out for you??????

 

[Tigerman]

It's all stress for the instructor baby You're sure they're going to be solid but until it turns ugly, who knows. At least they proved themselves under fire. They earned their cards.

Now to find out if they need some warm water training, I wonder if a certain instructor on Maui can check them out for you??????

I bet they (and the "certain instructor") would LOVE that

 

[24940]

Now to find out if they need some warm water training, I wonder if a certain instructor on Maui can check them out for you??????

Now, why would I do that? These students are under the illusion of having received solid training and I don't want to burst their bubble by subjecting them to a real instructor, with real standards, technique, knowledge, experience and a genius level IQ. Personally, my fragile ego couldn't handle the blow.

While they did an awesome job and had a great time doing it, I can't say they are ready for the rigors of tropical diving.

 

[Piccola]

As I posted earlier:I actually had a icy free flow experience last year. I was diving with a buddy in 39F degree water at 48 fsw when my regulator went into icy free flow. Being close to my buddy, we just hung on to each other and started a calm ascent. I kept my reg in my mouth but was prepared to share air if my tank emptied completely before I hit the surface. As memory serves I think we were only 23 minutes into the dive. At the surface, I tried, and was able, to put some air in my BCD as he shut off my tank. We had a bit of a surface swim to do! Was a heck of an experience but staying calm and dealing with the situation seemed to work out. Oops, I was diving with a AL80 and I think I had about 100 psi if that, its hard to remember but I think the gauge needle was just a little off the 0.My point is a freeflowing regulator at some point, fairly quickly, leads to an OOA situation.

 

[DeepSeaExplorer]

As taught by PADI;

1. Normal ascent
2. Alternate ascent
3. Controlled emergency ascent
4. Buddy breathing
5. Buoyant emergency ascent

If you read the entire thread you can possibly deduce the reasoning for this order (in PADI's eyes).

No matter the agency, buoyant ascent is the option of last resort. Last resort is when you are going to pass out before reaching an air source (buddy or surface), so you drop your weights and do not vent BC, so your non-breathing body might be resuscitated and sent to the chamber.

Please re-read the section on low on/out of air procedures in what ever OW manual you were trained with.

Despite how the training agencies define or differentiate, there's no difference between a CESA and a Buoyant ascent, since the former will likely turn into the latter. There's absolutely no guarantee that a diver will make it to the surface on a single breath hold, thus option of last resort.