YMCA, this may be the way to go!

[JT2]

Although I am not one of those folks who likes to get involved in a which agency is best argument, I must say that I saw something the other night that might of changed my mind. I was at the local indoor pool with a buddy of mine who was recently certified through PADI acouple of weeks ago helping him put his new equipment together and getting it sorted out, while at the same time there was a YMCA BOW class going on. I watched the class on and off through the evening and I must say I was quite impressed, I even walked over and introduced myself to the instructor and started asking questions about their BOW class, he gave me one of their training books and I took it home and looked it over, and must say that it is the most thorough open water class training that I have ever seen. I am still a firm believer that the quality of the instructor is the most important factor, but I think that all open water classes should some of the things that the YMCA class does, and I think that anyone who masters the YMCA open water class probably equal to a PADI or NAUI AOW and maybe even beyond them in sill learned and training. I know that there are PADI, NAUI, and SSI instructors that go above and beyond what is called for in order to certify someone, and give a much higher level of training then is called for in the text, but I am just surprised at how much more thorough the YMCA program is. Is this just my observation, or can anyone else back this up?

 

[MikeFerrara]

I haven't seen the materials but I'm sure they have a good program. One problem might be that don't have much of a presence in many area. I also know for a fact that they have their share of lousy instructors. I am first interested in seeing the agencies ensure that the intent of the standards are met and second addressing changes in standards. Nothing will ever be improved if they don't make sure the instructors can dive well and there are bunches that can't.

 

[Walter]

JT2,

I agree, there are real differences. What you have not considered is everyone doesn't want such a comprehensive class. This is why YMCA will never be the largest agency, most folks want to finish as quickly and as cheaply as possible.

Mike,

I am sure there are instructors in every agency who should be weeded out. YMCA is no exception. Based on my experience, I believe poor Y instructors are rare. I do not consider myself an average SCUBA instructor, but within the Y program I probably am fairly average.

 

[JT2]

. I am first interested in seeing the agencies ensure that the intent of the standards are met and second addressing changes in standards. Nothing will ever be improved if they don't make sure the instructors can dive well and there are bunches that can't

Mike, I agree but how are they going to do this, or maybe my question should be, how can they do this in your professional opinion? I have read many of your posts and I personally think that your students are extremely fortunate individuals. I have seen a lot of instructors that are bad divers who teach for both PADI and NAUI, and I have seen a few that are excellent divers and great instructors with both organizations, and one thing that I have seen as a common similarity amoung the great instructors is that they are willing to not sign off on someone just because they paid their money, but instead offer them extra time with a divemaster or AI, or sometimes the instructor themselves to hone their skills and try again, and these instructors also will not teach weekend classes. One of the things that I liked about the YMCA training is that yes, it is far more indepth and difficult if you will, to complete their classes, and that alone seems to weed out the type of people who are not willing to really learn properly. After watching this class I asked three other local instructors what they thought about it and I was shocked at their answers. First off I found out that two of them are certified YMCA instructors but they do not teach the class through the Y because it is difficult to get enough people together who are wiling to go through that kind of training for entry level diving and therefor they can't make as much money, but they both agreed it was a far better class.

 

[Rick Murchison]

My original cert was with YMCA back in '71. The course has changed a lot since then... some things for the better (I don't think they make you do push-ups with a '72 on your back or turn off your air on every training dive anymore) and some things that I think should still be there aren't (they aren't in anybody's OW course anymore). But the YMCA course was thorough and still is.
I cannot speak for every SSI facility, but our course is every bit as thorough as the YMCA course (in some ways even more so - SSI requires one more open water dive than YMCA) - and we miss some students who're bargain-hunting because of it. And I must plug SSI's new OW text that's coming out in January here - it's the best I've seen from any agency.
In the end it's mainly the instructor, but the structure does differ from agency to agency and is worth at least a little consideration.
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This past weekend I had an OW class at Vortex. As we were finishing our platform work, getting into a horizontal hover and preparing to start our free swim, we were struck with the fact that we were in a bubble of clear water, and that the rest of the spring was a mud cloud. There were shops from all over and several agencies there; I was mighty proud of my students, and they felt mighty good about their training when they looked around and saw what "the rest of the world" was doing.
Rick

 

[DiverBuoy]

Like how many confined/open water dives? Length of overall class? What AOW type things are covered in the BOW?

 

[Rick Murchison]

DiverBuoy once bubbled...
Like how many confined/open water dives? Length of overall class? What AOW type things are covered in the BOW?

Here's a handy-dandy chart to start with.
http://www.newdiver.com/learntodive/trainagency/chart.shtml
Rick

 

[WreckWriter]

Yea, and there's probably about 12 active YMCA instructors left in the world......

If you plan on pursuing your training beyond o/w make sure other agencies still accept it.

 

[DiverBuoy]

Rick Murchison once bubbled...

Here's a handy-dandy chart to start with.

Cool chart.

 

[Walter]

Rick,

Most agencies require 4 dives for OW certification. SSI requires 5, NAUI requires 5 (one of which may be a skin dive), YMCA requires 5 (one of which must be a skin dive).

WreckWriter,

"there's probably about 12 active YMCA instructors left in the world"

You know that isn't true.

You also know YMCA certifications are as widely accepted as any.

DiverBuoy,

Go to http://diverlink.com/newdiver/agencycomparison.htm to answer most of your questions.

As for AOW skills covered in the YMCA OW class, most of the extra skills are never made up by some agencies in their Advanced class or elsewhere.