Lessons Wreck Penetration

[boulderjohn]

Never ask yourself "should I go in" because the answer is usually what you want to do instead of what you should do — at least for most males with our well-known under-developed sense of self-preservation.

This illustrates my frustration with the "just say no to overhead environments" policy of most agencies. They know people are going into wrecks, and they know that in most cases there is no problem with it. I was shocked to learn in my discussions that PADI does not object to all the PADI dive operations leading dives into wrecks and coral swim-throughs because they consider those swim-throughs to be open water, not overhead environments.

That is why I wrote a course called Understanding Overhead Environments, which is fully approved by PADI. It takes divers from one extreme (swimming under the anchor line) to the other (caves and unprepared wrecks), showing the increasing risk and the corresponding needs for appropriate experience, training, and equipment. If a diver is contemplating entering a wreck, it is good to have some specific criteria on which to form a judgment.

Let's compare two possible penetrations on a wreck like the Spiegel Grove. They show two very different situations calling for two different levels of diver skill, experience, and equipment.

1. The diver looks through a doorway into a room. The room is wide open, with no possible entanglements and little silt. There is another door opposite. There is also a large opening in the hull leading to the open water and providing plenty of natural light. The diver will never be more than 15 feet from open water. The diver enters and goes to the other door. The diver looks in and sees the same thing. The diver can go through an entire series of rooms and never be far from a large, well-lighted opening to open water.
2. Go down a deck and the diver looks into a passageway. It is dark, and the diver can only see a little distance. Other doorways can be seen on each side of the passage. Where do they go? If the diver goes into one of those rooms, what will be there? If the diver comes out, will the diver remember which way leads to the exit?

 

[happy-diver]

​

Magnificent!

I hope John Chatterton has his shoe laces done up in case cerich is watching

 

[PapaRod]

Great discussion, @boulderjohn really like your scenarios, I think that’s what I get from the PADI Wreck course I just finished completing. The line is to help guide your way back on an in & out penetration, not for a swim through situations where you can see light ahead through another nearby exterior passage. One of the key points in the eLeaning I took away is never enter a passage where you and your buddy can’t swim side by side (or stacked). They did also discuss the points learned in cave diving, like having a 7’ hose on the alternate air source, and using the rule of thirds.

We are heading to Key Largo end of March to do our instructor portion with Rainbow Reef, and Spiegle Grove is on our itinerary. We will also see the Duane.

I appreciate the extensive experience of the Scuba Board members and hopefully can apply some of the good lessons that have been shared.

 

[Centrals]

Swimming side by side inside a wreck? One of the diver would not have direct access to the guide line.
It is always a single file for me inside a wreck. The lead diver is to lay the line and the other(s) keep a safe distance to avoid overcrowding.

 

[Wibble]

Swimming side by side inside a wreck? One of the diver would not have direct access to the guide line.
It is always a single file for me inside a wreck. The lead diver is to lay the line and the other(s) keep a safe distance to avoid overcrowding.

Depends upon the wreck, conditions and the type of penetration you're contemplating.

One size fits nobody

 

[Centrals]

Depends upon the wreck, conditions and the type of penetration you're contemplating.

One size fits nobody

Penetration: go inside a wreck without any references. Old line is not to be trusted, just like mountaineering.
The lead diver call the shot ie. lay the line for the other to follow. First one in and last one out and with all the line laid(no line trap).
The way I was taught and practiced.

 

[boulderjohn]

Great discussion, @boulderjohn really like your scenarios, I think that’s what I get from the PADI Wreck course I just finished completing. The line is to help guide your way back on an in & out penetration, not for a swim through situations where you can see light ahead through another nearby exterior passage. One of the key points in the eLeaning I took away is never enter a passage where you and your buddy can’t swim side by side (or stacked). They did also discuss the points learned in cave diving, like having a 7’ hose on the alternate air source, and using the rule of thirds.

We are heading to Key Largo end of March to do our instructor portion with Rainbow Reef, and Spiegle Grove is on our itinerary. We will also see the Duane.

I appreciate the extensive experience of the Scuba Board members and hopefully can apply some of the good lessons that have been shared.

Well, this post contains quite a surprise for me. I have not taught the wreck course since I had the discussions with PADI about the course content. WHen we had those discussions, there was no eLearning for the wreck course, and I did not know it had been created since then. My previous criticisms may no longer be valid.

 

[Gene]

I did a PADI wreck dive class back in 2004 off Beaufort, NC and we went out to U-352 and other area wrecks. I didn't penetrate the 352 but on the next wreck, I was tasked with drawing a rough map of the exterior and finding a good way in and running my reel. At this point, I was already an intro cave diver, so the reel work wasn't an issue.
I was so excited to swim inside this WW II wreck whose name escapes me right now, but I have it in my log book. I tied off just in open water and headed in what resembled an open cavern type area of this wreck. The instructor was behind me. I found a stairway, and started down them, making tie-offs and wraps with my line here and there. I think I went a floor or two, passing a torn button up shirt blowing in the current. Not sure what that was from as I didn't think fabric would last decades like that. I was about to go down more stairs when I felt something grab my fin. The instructor gave me the turn-around finger twirl, and we followed my line out. Back on the boat, he said he had been trying to stop me for at least a floor on the stairs, but in my excitement, I was moving, and it was tight on the stairway. Anyway, a cool wreck dive as sharks were outside the wreck when we exited.
I got cavern certified to become a better wreck diver, plus I live in cave country. But once I saw the gallery at Ginnie, I had to go on to cave, and of course I ended up doing much more cave diving than wreck just because it's easier and closer. But my love and interest in diving goes right back to watching Jacques Cousteau's Truk Lagoon episode. That totally captivated me at around age eight or nine.
PS I enjoyed watching JC's video clip of the 869 above. Still my favorite Nova episode ever!

 

[Wibble]

Submarines are hard to penetrate unless they’re split open. Their hatches are tiny, designed for skinny 20 year olds not wearing scuba kit. Now they’re over 104 years old for WW1 or 80 years old for WW2, they’re quite silted. Where they are open they’re quite encrusted with marine life.

They’re interesting to dive in that they represent the peak of technological development at that time, way more advanced than contemporaneous shipping.

Have a lot of them around the UK coast including the smaller coastal variants. There’s three volumes of "Silent Warriors — Submarine Wrecks Around The United Kingdom" listing hundreds of them.

One of the more popular dive sites is that of the British M2 submarine which carried an airplane in a waterproof hangar behind the conning tower

 

[Celt]

I only ever went into a wreck to take cargo or gear, never site seeing except for the original survey. After 5 minutes working the vis is zero. we used a high pressure water lance a lot to dig out cargo from bunker coal which is driven through everything when the ship is hit by a torpedo. a nice large entrance is made to the hold to get tools in and cargo out. A mooring is set up close to the work area and diver 1 brings the lance to the work making sure the hose and signalling line is clear to the exit and surface. When ready the standby is called and 2 pulls starts the pump. The 3 inch hose fills and water is pumped to the lance. when the valve is closed water is directed to a high pressure nozzle. the lance will immediately start to cut through hardened coal and concretion resulting in a total loss of any vis, you work on feel and the sound of the lance hitting metal. you can feel the lance slide down the length of ingots as it cuts. The pressure of the lance will fill your gloves and hood with bunker dust and drive it past the seal of your mask which will constantly flood. After 30 minutes the exhaust valves of your reg will get dirty and start to breath wet. All this will happen in total darkness. When your time is up the standby will call you on the line which you have on the lance handle and he will cut the pump. You stand the lance clear put the signalling line on your wrist and start making your way along the now limp hose back to the deco station. The cloud of bunker dust will be anything up to 60 feet into the water column depending on the drift.