Why do computers rot the brain?

[mth71]

I've read many, many posts on this board from divers (I assume most of them DIR, which, although I'm still a newbie, like the philosophy of) that dive computers rot the brain. Well yeah, anything that allows us to be lazier can't be as good for us as doing the thing ourselves. Driving to a dive site probably rots our legs, too. There are lots of things we do that don't allow us to get the "exercise" we need, but that's not to say they're all bad. Anyway, my question is, why do these people think that dive computers are so bad? We use computers because they can make many more decisions than we can, and if applied to a decompression algorithm, for example, which takes into account more factors than we humans can process, and if that allows for a (potentially) safer dive, then why are they so bad? I've not used a computer yet in my 5 OW dives, but from what I know about them (granted, it's about the only thing I know about them), they allow for a longer and safer dive because they account for changes in depth, time at each depth, temperature, and probably other factors (like breathing rate). It is impossible for us to make those calculations mentally. Again, I don't know enough to know how these non-computer divers do things, but what makes their diving without a computer i)safer, ii)superior, iii)DIR ? I am more than willing to listen to the explanations as long as there are legitimate answers, but seeing all the benefits of computers, I can't understand why they are looked down upon. Then again, I wouldn't ever want to live in an Aamish community without the niceities of life, either (no offense to the Aamish, it's their way of life, not mine). Believe me, if I can forego the cost of an $800 computer, I'm all for it, but I need to know why I would want to do so. I do appreciate all replies, from those who've never dived with a computer, those who dive exclusively with one, from those who do both, or maybe (and especially) converts who used to but now "see the light" (as I read elsewhere on this board). Thank you all for trying to help a new diver understand a different perspective of the sport.

Mark

 

[Walter]

Computers don't rot the brain.

Computers allow you to increase your bottom time over what tables allow. This is not safer. If you have the same profile, but more bottom time (everything else being equal) you've decreased your safety factor with regard to decompression status. I do not think computers are dangerous, I use them and have since shortly after the Edge came out in the '80's. It is a mistake to think they are safer. The one area in which computers can allow you to have a safer dive is ascent rates.

 

[Uncle Pug]

Your question in the body of your text is what I will answer:

Anyway, my question is, why do these people think that dive computers are so bad?

First understand that while there is a modicum of hyperbole in the phrase "computers rot your brain" the metaphor should be clear.... computers do not help your thinking process... they circumvent it.

Now to your question: Why do I (as a representative example of those who do not use a computer) think that dive computers are so bad?

Well I think that it is very important for divers to have situational awareness.

That involves two things: 1) the situation 2) awareness

Let's take them one at a time.

1) the situation (just those items germane to the topic of computer obviated thinking): depth, time, running profile of the dive, max. depth, total time, time left, gas supply, rate of gas use, gas time left, buddy's time/depth/profile/gas situation as well, temperature, effect of temperature on the dive.

2) awareness (again just those items germane): cognitively having these situational elements of the dive in mind. As my brain gets used to paying attention and thinking I will know what my spg is reading at anytime during the dive before looking at it. I will know my time by looking at my spg. I will have a good idea of what my buddies spg reads at anytime during the dive. I will know how much time we have left and where we are in relation to the NDL.

These are just a few items... but I want to keep this as short as possible yet try to give you a good answer.

If you are using a computer it is unlikely that you will ever become situationally aware of these elements of the dive. And if your computer fails (and they do) you will not know where you stand.

 

[Uncle Pug]

Walter once bubbled...
The one area in which computers can allow you to have a safer dive is ascent rates.

Computers do not allow you to have a safer ascent rate.

This has been discussed before and you can do a search on ascents to get more information (the details.)

Using computers as ascent monitors is IMO one of the worse things you can do if you want slow safe ascents. Watching a computer robs you of the visual & physical cues (situational awareness) that will give you the ability to absolutely control your ascent.

Being dialed in to the visual & physical cues that make slow safe ascents automatic is very important when things start to go wrong on a dive. Computer watchers will not have developed the sensory skills to manage their situation even if the computer itself doesn't fail.

You can ask anyone from the board that has been diving with me what kind of ascents I do without a computer.

 

[Uncle Pug]

If you do use one... better have two... or even three or four..
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=169951#post169951

 

[MikeS]

I started diving with an Air Integrated computer (Cobra) and have only dived with a computer. A computer is just a tool; it cannot rot your brain. A computer dramatically reduces the chances of human computational error. Additionally, it can perform calculations exceedingly fast and accurate resulting in the ability to calculate nitrogen loading as if your dive was a massively multilevel dive, which can result in more dive time and accurate decompression information in an emergency. It also reduces task loading; I can look at one place and get my air pressure, current depth, deepest depth of the dive, elapsed dive time, remaining NDL time at current depth, and estimated air time at the current consumption rate.

What tends to give computers a bad name is divers that assume the computer can think for you, it can’t, all it can do is provide you with information, you must interpret the information and act accordingly.

Hey Uncle Pug, do you still use a slide rule?

Mike

 

[nickjb]

They are good for multiple dives over several days. If you did a liveaboard using tables you'd be doing huge amounts of deco by the end of the trip. Computers can continuously track your actual depth and give you accurate deco/nodeco times.

They are not an excuse to forget everything you learnt in OW training or to not plan your dive properly.

You still need a brain to use a computer

 

[dcostanza]

Mth71

The only thing I can add to the very insightful answers given are..... that the Amish do use computers, DVD players, cell phones,etc..

How do I know this you ask??? My in-laws live smack dab in the middle of "Amishville" ... Grabill, Indiana. They aren't Amish, only have a bunch of them for neighbors. As a matter of fact, one Amish family that is close (friendly) to my in-laws has a New Ford Expedition they store in the in-laws pole barns. They are always having my in-laws run them in to town to rent DVD's. They don't like to portray this side of their "belief" to the general public.

Their buggy's (the one's the teenagers "drive" )even have expensive stereo systems and neon light packages... the funniest thing you will ever see!!!

I now return you to the regularly scheduled, informative posts...

Best Regards
Don Costanza

 

[zboss]

Uncle Pug once bubbled...

Computers do not allow you to have a safer ascent rate.....
You can ask anyone from the board that has been diving with me what kind of ascents I do without a computer.

Pug... it surprises me that you are not less adverse to using a computer during your diving, after-all you are a moderator on a computer board.

I would respectfully point out that people efficiently learn in many different manners - it all depends on the person. For example - some learn well in school, other learn well in practical applications, while others learn best in a group or as an individual.

While I agree that from a safety standpoint it is useful to dive using just an SPG, a watch, and Tables, I find that using a computer to reinforce my knowledge is a good thing... having the details of a dive allows me to review the dive and make comparisons to what I would have dived when using a table. The computer acts as feedback so when I feel pressure changes or thermoclines, etc... I can refer to my dive computer and verify that what I know is being confirmed by an independant authority... the PHD's and Engineers whom designed my computer and it's algorithms.

There will ALWAYS be computer failures - however I would be interested in finding out what piece of dive equipment fails most... I suspect that the list would contain a great many references to parts that appear in a "save a dive kit". What happens if your fins falls off while fighting a current? You end the dive; the same thing with a failed computer... you end the dive.

If I were doing decompression dives I might feel different but I don't and know that if I ascend safely after a computer failure, make a safety stop, and complete my dive without further incident there is a 99.999% chance that I will be fine. Also - it has been my experience in the water and out that most accidents are not attributable to just a single-point-of-failure... for example a driver who is driving fast, is drunk, AND the road is wet.

 

[Walter]

Pug,

While I agree with many of your points, the first clue many divers have that their ascent rate is too fast is the rapid ascent warning on their computers. Computers have given many divers a wake up call to slow down. While better training would have prevented the problem in the first place, we aren't likely to get better train for the majority of divers.