What's wrong with trash in the oceans??

[jd950]

When I first saw the title of this thread I thought it was going to be about me and some of my friends and I was glad someone was on my side.

 

[LekicINC]

From Allison's original post and all the responses, I don't think that anyone is advocating dumping materials and objects into the ocean to provide nice habitats for marine animals. Rather, I interpret the spirit of the OP as, when diving if one comes across a piece of man-made object that is already there, take a closer look - there maybe some cool critter to be found there. Whether or not the diver chooses to pick up that man-made object to "clean up" the ocean is another matter and, well... there are already some responses in this thread which provide suggestions on that.

Ahh, exactly what I was trying to say, but much more articulate and easy to understand.

Hmm.. I was under the impression that muck diving was about the sediment. Surely those creatures are not dependent on human refuse for their survival. The way you describe it, it sounds like watching bears at a town dump. I hope this is not a universal description of muck diving.
Trash in the water is pretty serious stuff and I believe that it can alter the natural habitats if it encourages species that thrive on our trash to dominate over the indigenous species.

Yes, muck diving does depend a lot on the sediment, and my post made it sound like without trash, there is no muck diving. That was wrong. Please see 60feets post, and really IceIce's response for what I think muck diving is (as you can see there are many opinions on what it is). Also, my info page has the definition I came up with.

I can buy that. However, I am always concerned about those who will rationalize that throwing a bottle (or engine) overboard is a good thing because some fish will use it for shelter. In Bonaire, in one spot, they are putting down big hollow concrete balls to help rebuild reefs that were damaged some years ago. I did see an octopus that used a pipe for shelter, but I don't think he would have been homeless without it.

Perhaps not, but perhaps we took away his home, so we are trying to give it another one. I am not agreeing with either side, just playing devils advocate :devil_2:

Maybe in the true muck areas, the bottles, etc actually allow different species to dominate where they wouldn't even be. What does this do to an ecology that we know little to nothing about?

A good point. I.E. dogs are evolved from wolves that had a mutation in the fear gene and would approach human settlements. I think this is an interesting debate, as we have seen the way humans can alter the ecosystem and destroy the ecological equillibrium. Does this same way of thinking apply for larger man made objects (i.e. wrecks, planes)? Or, again, are we simply restoring the balance that we destroyed in the first place. This sort of hit me when I was doing research for my muck-diving.com page and found that a lot of the pictures I was seeing, may also be found in a mangrove. The "muck" environment almost imitates the mangroves in one of their functions: providing refuge from the predatory pressures of the coral reefs. In fact, you see a lot of muck diving sites, where mangroves might thrive as well. I AM NOT saying trash replaces mangroves. I AM ALSO NOT saying the diversity seen in muck dives is because humans destroy mangroves, simply making an observation.

Also, Bob...AMAZING pictures. Remind me why I love blennys so much!

Lastly, thank you for the kind words on my website, its a work in progress but its been a lot of fun. A lot more of Allisons pictures will be featured soon in the "species" section. I think a lot of her photos embody muck diving. Another thank you to her for letting me use them.


Matt