what's the current recommendation of p&s camera (with uw housing)?

[s.s.seafan]

Hi,

I read the sticky about underwater cameras (which is very helpful), and I think a p&s camera with underwater housing, built-in flash, and ability to shoot RAW (with a hack or otherwise) would be ideal for me to get started. But it seems the posts were a little outdated in terms of current offerings on the market, like the Canon a570, A720 (with a hack for RAW shooting) would be ideal for me (I'm as little biased towards Canon as my DSLRs are all Canon, but I'm open to any brand), but it's not available any more. What's the current model of that series? (I'm a littel confused with so many models from Canon) Are there still ways to make the current model to shoot RAW?

Of course the Canon G-11 with housing would meet my needs, but that costs ($675+)more than double the A570 option that folks so highly recommended.

thanks,

Jason

 

[Peter Guy]

You might be interested in this article from Backscatter:

Best Low Cost and Automatic Only Cameras: Camera + Housing Price Range: $179 - $599
Me, I just bought an E-PL1 w/housing - a "super" Point -n- Shoot that I hope to get in the water this weekend.

 

[jbb]

Hi,

I read the sticky about underwater cameras (which is very helpful), and I think a p&s camera with underwater housing, built-in flash, and ability to shoot RAW (with a hack or otherwise) would be ideal for me to get started. But it seems the posts were a little outdated in terms of current offerings on the market, like the Canon a570, A720 (with a hack for RAW shooting) would be ideal for me (I'm as little biased towards Canon as my DSLRs are all Canon, but I'm open to any brand), but it's not available any more. What's the current model of that series? (I'm a littel confused with so many models from Canon) Are there still ways to make the current model to shoot RAW?

Of course the Canon G-11 with housing would meet my needs, but that costs ($675+)more than double the A570 option that folks so highly recommended.

I'd recommend the Canon s90 as it shoots RAW and if you get the canon uw housing you could work with the camera flash without getting a strobe. The G11 really needs a strobe in whatever housing you get although I have seen some good macro results with the canon housing and a little jerry built reflector for close work. In my reading of the posts it appears the s90 is better suited to take advantage of wide angle wet lenses than is the g11. The s90 is easy to slip into the pocket on land too. I have both cameras.

By the time you have exhausted the capabilities of the s90 there may be more choices in the four thirds market for both cameras, lenses and underwater housings.

 

[slowhands]

I'd recommend the Canon s90 as it shoot RAW and if you get the canon uw housing you could work with the camera flash without getting a strobe. The G11 really needs a strobe in whatever housing you get although I have seen some good macro results with the canon housing and a little jerry built reflector for close work. In my reading of the posts it appears the s90 is better suited to take advantage of wide angle wet lenses than is the g11. The s90 is easy to slip into the pocket on land too. I have both cameras.

By the time you have exhausted the capabilities of the s90 there may be more choices in the four thirds market for both cameras, lenses and underwater housings.

I agree resoundingly. The little S90 is outstanding for UW photography in the budget price range. The Canon Housing WP-DC35 for it is fairly compact and inexpensive too. Hard to beat for size and price combined with excellent performance.

The bigger close relative of the S90 is the G11. It has the same sensor and same processor, but a different lens that focuses closer, a very sturdy build quality, an optical viewfinder, a 2x larger battery. The Canon WP DC34 housing for it is compact and inexpensive too. This is about $100 more expensive as a system, but feels sturdier.

I don't think you can go wrong with either one. Try both cameras out in a store to see what wows you.

This camera market is fast moving. Both the S90 and G11 will be probably discontinued within a year. A recommendation today will out of date in months; then you should be looking at the next generation of cameras.

NOTE: There is also a new tier of the digital camera market, above the price range of these small compact cameras, but below the DSLRs. These cameras have bigger sensors but no mirror, which makes for better image performance, smaller size than a DSLR, but higher cost than the small compact cameras like the S90. Olympus and Panasonic have already released several models of their "micro 4/3 family" with bigger sensors and interchangeable lenses; they have almost the performance of digital SLRs but smaller size than them. Sony is about to release a different, competing family of cameras with bigger sensors and interchangeable lenses, called NEX. Interesting stuff, huh? Lots of changes coming...

Again, these are bigger, better, but more expensive than the s90/G11 class of small compact cameras. For most of us, today the s90 or G11 will give perfectly fine performance versus price. But there will be more new small compact cameras coming out tomorrow, so you should check what's new when you decide to buy.

When I look at new cameras, the best seem so good it's hard to pick. I hate buyer's remorse, when I realize later I should have bought something else. I need a process to help me select the best. So I made one. I listed the features I Must Have and features that are Nice to Have. My list is below, but make your own list based on your preferences. Pick the cameras that have your Must Have features to test drive.

MUST HAVE FEATURES:

Manual exposure control
Ability to do custom white balance
Ability to store RAW images (but only if you have the software and know how to process them!)
Close focus capability - macro mode
Wide angle lens: 28mm (35mm eq) is good, 24 is better
Fast lens, ie wide aperture: F2.8 is good, F2.0 is better
Fast focusing
Large Display
HD video
Good UW Housings available
Ability to use big, fast SDHC Memory
Ability to interface with external strobes
Ability to add auxiliary lenses for close up and wider angle
​

NICE TO HAVE FEATURES:

Better image quality, always
Smaller Size
Lower Cost
Longer battery life
Easy operation while wearing dive gloves
1080 HD Video
GPS?
automatic underwater white balance that really works - nothing today works well
(or: Translucent Lens cap that helps manual white balance)
Double O-rings on housing door to prevent leaks
Water absorbent mechanism to prevent fogging or worse
Convenient, secure locking door latches
Sturdy door hinge
Double glass on Housing Lens Port so no fogging
Strobe convertible to emergency beacon
Bluetooth/wifi download of photos to archive or laptop
​

The Must Have list is my minimum for a new underwater camera and housing today, and I'd like some of the Nice to Have features too. I'm sure you can think of many other things in YOUR Must Have and Nice to Have Categories. The idea is have a process for selecting a new camera based on YOUR preferences, or else risk buyer's remorse.

As I was thinking about the really great cameras available now, it struck me how much digital cameras have improved in a short span of time. We can expect them to continue to evolve in similar areas, such as better sensors, faster processors, and other improvements on existing technology. Just for fun some I dreamed up some other useful but radical features that seem like fantasy today, but I'd like to use each of these crazy features in my next underwater camera system.

FANTASY NEW FEATURES

Communication with dive computer so photos are tagged with dive info
Bluetooth/wifi controlled strobe, so no cable to camera but full control - this I really want!
Air bag that inflates if the camera sinks below safety depth (I know two divers who lost rigs)
Fish encyclopedia in camera that recognizes fish and other lifeforms and tags image with species ID (plugin ebook?)
Camera display on Dive Mask, controlled by remote on wrist -- a heads up display​

In my lifetime so many things I never imagined have been invented and changed our lives (such as digital cameras, laptop computers, cell phones, ebooks and...). It would not surprise me to see some ideas that seem far fetched today become real products in the future and change the way we do underwater photography.

 

[jbb]

If you gave more information about what you want to do with the camera and images it would help members on the board give you better information. How much diving do you do? Do you dive locally close to home or only on trips? Are you going to take the camera on all your dives? Cold or warm dives? Do you think you might get a strobe later? I would research Nemrod's posts regarding the s90 and the FIX uw case to see some of the possibilities and costs. I personaly like canon p&s cameras as I've had one since I got an old s400 years ago, I'm used to the menu and it seems better than other makes. The key with the s90 and g11 are the manual setting modes and custom modes available. I sure hope they get into the 4/3 market soon.

 

[s.s.seafan]

I'd recommend the Canon s90 as it shoots RAW and if you get the canon uw housing you could work with the camera flash without getting a strobe. The G11 really needs a strobe in whatever housing you get although I have seen some good macro results with the canon housing and a little jerry built reflector for close work.

Thanks for your replies, it helps a lot. After reading here and searching on the board, I'm thinking of getting either Canon s90 or G11, like many others. I'll get the Canon UW housing because of its lower cost. I'm still debating between the two cameras. Neither of them have HD video, right? And could you comment more on the need of external strobe for G11? I may get a strobe later, but now I'll start with using the built-in flash. If there is a consensus that G11 would require external flash from the get-go, it would push me to s90.

 

[HerraduraDivers]

I am extremly pleased with my G11.
I belive that there is no better P&S on the market in this moment.
The Canon housing works well, the Ikelite will be better and the top are the Patima or Fisheye FIX aluminium housings.

The S90 is basically the same camera without the external controls and for this a much smaller size.
The picture quality is the same, the only diference is handling, size and price.

Chris

 

[Nemrod]

The S90 does have external controls. The front control ring and rear control rings are the primary camera/human interface on the S90. The G11 does not have the front control ring and thus has to rely upon other input methods.

The front control ring is very important to the S90 function as it can handle f stop, Exposure compensation, ISO, WB, zoom ratio etc. The operating mode that is assigned to the front ring by the user depends upon what exposure mode the camera is set to. Pressing the top button on the S90 cycles the front ring functions rapidly if you need another function other than the one currently set. It is very easy and it allows the photographer to directly control f stop and shutter speed in Manual mode via direct input rotary knobs (front and rear control rings) on the FIX90 housing. It could not be easier than this.

N

 

[Straegen]

I am curious to see the new IXUS 300 HS from Canon. SS body, vastly improved low light performance for a P&S, histogram, 720p movie mode with slow-mo and very fast for a P&S with the requisite manual controls. Cheaper than the S90 but smaller sensor I believe.

Might have to wait a bit for a housing though.

 

[Jax]

Thanks for your replies, it helps a lot. After reading here and searching on the board, I'm thinking of getting either Canon s90 or G11, like many others. I'll get the Canon UW housing because of its lower cost. I'm still debating between the two cameras. Neither of them have HD video, right? And could you comment more on the need of external strobe for G11? I may get a strobe later, but now I'll start with using the built-in flash. If there is a consensus that G11 would require external flash from the get-go, it would push me to s90.

Hey, seafan; I went online to fredmiranda.com, and picked up the Canon G10 for $300. Gorgeous camera, great shape, and even with extra batteries and the Canon Housing, the whole rig came in at less than $500.

Just a thought from a wise shopper. or terminal cheapskate.