What is the most logical place to put an Octopus?

[Pbdiver84]

I was taught primary donate. The necklace concept looks interesting, but I’ve also seen a diver get caught on their necklace… so for now I’m staying with an octo magnetically attached to my hip.

 

[MyBuddy]

I was taught primary donate. The necklace concept looks interesting, but I’ve also seen a diver get caught on their necklace… so for now I’m staying with an octo magnetically attached to my hip.

I’d like to hear more details about where and how they got hung up by their reg necklace.

 

[BlueTrin]

I thought I had sufficiently couched my post. But this is the internet.
I didn’t intend to imply that alternate donate was a hard and fast rule amongst the agencies. Though it would be amusing to see an agency include the phrase “pie hole” in their course literature. I suppose I should have said the majority of OW students are taught that if someone is out of gas you donate your octo….

Clearly from the rest of my post, I don’t subscribe to the thought that’s it’s the only way to dive. But for the people that are just going to rent gear when they go to the quarry or dive on holiday, the primary and Octo setup is what they’re likely to find and that’s what they’re likely to be taught.

Edit…


There’s a ton of options for securing octos some being more reliable than others. Definitely a plus in the necklace column. IF I ever went the independent instructor route, it would be something I’d have to give a lot of consideration.

He is clarifying that it is a choice from the instructors, not from the agencies and replied in the subsequent reply to clarify.

It’s probably because instructors are just perpetuating the way they were taught and probably find it easier to teach alternate donate rather than primary donate?

 

[VikingDives]

I’d like to hear more details about where and how they got hung up by their reg necklace.

You can make a mess of things if you put your long hose on before your short hose. That's the reason for the modified s-drill at the surface.

 

[MyBuddy]

You can make a mess of things if you put your long hose on before your short hose. That's the reason for the modified s-drill at the surface.

Of that I am aware.

But in my interpretation of what I read that @Pbdiver84 was stating that the diver was somehow entangled by the necklace catching on something. “…a diver get caught on their necklace…” vs “a diver’s primary reg get caught …” or “a diver’s hose get caught…”

 

[FishWatcher747]

Well I appreciate the discussion.

Let us say our goal in initial instruction, OW, is to turn out the safest holiday diver we can so that they don't get into trouble while they decide how they will pursue the sport of diving.

I was not even trying to start a discussion of primary or secondary donate but those are interesting discussions.

Let us say for teaching secondary donate why would it matter for the OOA person whether they take the octopus from the abdominal triangle or off a necklace?

For this person with the necklaced second it is safer if they have a freeflow or other failure of the primary or the primary gets knocked out of their mouth for some reason to have the secondary on a necklace. No searching for a regulator.

 

[scrane]

I was taught primary donate with the understanding they'd give it back pretty quick.

 

[boulderjohn]

Let us say for teaching secondary donate why would it matter for the OOA person whether they take the octopus from the abdominal triangle or off a necklace?

The OOA person does not take an alternate from a necklace. If the alternate is on a necklace, the OOA diver takes the primary and the donor uses the one on the necklace.

The point of it being on the necklace is that it is always right there and available to the donor--it won't come loose on its own, as the regulator in a conventional setup does. That means it is not available to the OOA diver.

 

[Belzelbub]

Open water teaches that if someone is out of gas you donate your octo and your primary stays in your pie hole.

No. Not really. I have two OW certs (PADI, YMCA). I have also attended two OW courses with my daughters (SSI). Out of all those, only the PADI instructor taught Octo donate. The others taught mostly primary donate, but also explained that some may be using Octo donate.

 

[BlueTrin]

Well I appreciate the discussion.

Let us say our goal in initial instruction, OW, is to turn out the safest holiday diver we can so that they don't get into trouble while they decide how they will pursue the sport of diving.

I was not even trying to start a discussion of primary or secondary donate but those are interesting discussions.

Let us say for teaching secondary donate why would it matter for the OOA person whether they take the octopus from the abdominal triangle or off a necklace?

For this person with the necklaced second it is safer if they have a freeflow or other failure of the primary or the primary gets knocked out of their mouth for some reason to have the secondary on a necklace. No searching for a regulator.

It matters when someone has put necklace last, and didn’t do a modified a drill before to jump or at the surface.

Then once you pull the reg, it’s stuck by the necklace.

You’d be surprised by the number of times I catch this on people who either haven’t dived recently or don’t dive enough to reinforce the habit. (last time I corrected someone was literally last Saturday and he was about to go in the water without deploying the long hose after he got interrupted, fixed his kit and put the necklace last.

You may be able to sort this out under water quickly and/or be disciplined enough to ALWAYS do the modified s-drill before to get wet … but not everyone does.

I am only providing an example of counter argument. I think for people who have a minimum of discipline, it is safer to use a long hose if trained and if they are able to communicate with a buddy who is not familiar with the config during buddy check.