cornfed
Mindless lemming
I disagree. Unless you dive with less then six pounds on your weightbelt you're not lugging around extra weight with a BP. You need the weight anyway so why not do something useful with it.
Cornfed
What is Tech diving?
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I disagree. Unless you dive with less then six pounds on your weightbelt you're not lugging around extra weight with a BP. You need the weight anyway so why not do something useful with it.
Cornfed
cornfed
Mindless lemming
Solo? When doing any of the things you mentioned your buddy is more important then in OW.
Kinda like "Rec", IMHO.
Cornfed
To begin with, the phrase "technical diving" is more marketing than anything else... however, we're stuck with it and since I teach it exclusively, I have had to be able to define it in a classroom setting. Here's my take on it.
A technical dive is one that requires thoughtful and complex planning and which is executed within well-defined parameters or limits. Breaking any of these well-defined limits (such as going a little deeper, staying a little longer) may result in serious injury or death.
Short version: A technical dive is more than, strapping on a tank and dropping over the side of the boat 'til your computer says "time to go home."
Charlie99
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Ummmmm. I don't bring my lead with me on the airplane, so my BC is lighter.
If you want a lightweight backplate/sta combo, look at Scott Koplin's travel BP / lightweight STA. 3.4 pounds of 316SS: http://www.selchie.com/travel.htm
bwerb
Hoser/English Translator, eh
This is one of the huge problems with the current dive education...the "training" is tied directly to the "gear sales" at least implicitly.
If it was truly "education" which was the important part, then it should not matter a bit what gear you teach in as long as you have the required secondary air source component etc.
I can understand all the arguments on the shop side for using what we sell but in the big picture, the lessons should be about the learning, not an advertisement for the shops latest and greatest.
Anyhow...rant over...back to the question...Tech Diving...I'd define as any diving in which a direct ascent to the surface is not possible due to overhead or decompression ceilings. I'd go one step further and add that tech diving typically employs the use of multiple cyliders. Just diving doubles is not necessarily technical but technical diving is not typically done without them.
Whirling Girl
Contributor
In some respects, this is one of those semantic issues. I think bwerb's explanation is well stated and is the common definition of "tech" diving; either overhead environment or decompression obligation.
However, this discussion tweaks a pet peeve of mine. I think that basic open water education doesn't treat the technical aspects of diving seriously enough. The same physical rules, gas laws, physiological issues and basic risks apply to every dive, shallow or deep, short or long, open or overhead.
So, given that the same rules apply on every dive, all diving is technical diving. All dives are decompression dives.
<rant> Diving is a complex and dangerous sport. I don't like how some shops and the open water course agencies try to sell it as a fun and light recreational activity for the whole family to try when they go on vacation, and distinguish it from "tech" diving. That's how people die horrible deaths and suffer terrible losses that are unecessary. No one should be diving who isn't fully aware of the risks, and has a basic working knowledge of how to minimize those risks. <end of rant>
Gah. Forgive me. I've witnessed three diving accidents in the last three months, one just this past weekend, assisted in one rescue, and a diver just drowned here last week, and it just scares me. More and more people are diving and that's a good thing, but I hate that so many people are getting hurt and I wish I could do something about it.
Margaret
However, this discussion tweaks a pet peeve of mine. I think that basic open water education doesn't treat the technical aspects of diving seriously enough. The same physical rules, gas laws, physiological issues and basic risks apply to every dive, shallow or deep, short or long, open or overhead.
So, given that the same rules apply on every dive, all diving is technical diving. All dives are decompression dives.
<rant> Diving is a complex and dangerous sport. I don't like how some shops and the open water course agencies try to sell it as a fun and light recreational activity for the whole family to try when they go on vacation, and distinguish it from "tech" diving. That's how people die horrible deaths and suffer terrible losses that are unecessary. No one should be diving who isn't fully aware of the risks, and has a basic working knowledge of how to minimize those risks. <end of rant>
Gah. Forgive me. I've witnessed three diving accidents in the last three months, one just this past weekend, assisted in one rescue, and a diver just drowned here last week, and it just scares me. More and more people are diving and that's a good thing, but I hate that so many people are getting hurt and I wish I could do something about it.
Margaret
cornfed
Mindless lemming
I think it has more to do with not distinguishing between a 30ft reef dive and dive in, say, the pacific northwest.
If you listened to a shop near me, there isn't any good diving north of the FL Keys. They certify students then sell them some nice relaxing trips in the Caribbean. These diver comeback and say, "that was fun if there is diving closer by..." They then take their AOW card (which the shop sold them to be prepared for the more challenging local dives but checked them out in a quarry) a couple miles off shore. They jump off the boat, drop 60+ ft into the cold, murky water, get blown around by the current and decide, "this sucks... I like the Caribbean. I want back on the boat, NOW!"
It's Caribbean vs the rest of the world, not rec vs tech.
Cornfed
If you listened to a shop near me, there isn't any good diving north of the FL Keys. They certify students then sell them some nice relaxing trips in the Caribbean. These diver comeback and say, "that was fun if there is diving closer by..." They then take their AOW card (which the shop sold them to be prepared for the more challenging local dives but checked them out in a quarry) a couple miles off shore. They jump off the boat, drop 60+ ft into the cold, murky water, get blown around by the current and decide, "this sucks... I like the Caribbean. I want back on the boat, NOW!"
It's Caribbean vs the rest of the world, not rec vs tech.
Cornfed
TX65
Contributor
Comment in another post:
"To begin with, the phrase "technical diving" is more marketing than anything else..."
I agree that the term is now used by manufactuers to label and sell gear that is perceived to be better. However, the term was coined to describe diving and divers who originally did diving "outside the box" defined by NAUI and PADI as recreational diving. Of course, NAUI, PADI and other organizations have in recent years expanded their "box" to include items originally labeled technical. Why? because NAUI, PADI and others are businesses just like the dive shops. When Nitrox course started appearing from groups like TDI and IANTD, it took that money away from the big organizations.
Comment in another post-
" A technical dive is one that requires thoughtful and complex planning and which is executed within well-defined parameters or limits. Breaking any of these well-defined limits (such as going a little deeper, staying a little longer) may result in serious injury or death."
Every dive should be planned and executed within the planned parameters. Even if that planning is to say, "today, we are going to dive the wacka wacka reef which has a maximum depth of 40 feet. We will begin the dive by heading to the north along western edge and return diving south along the eastern edge. We will beging the return portion after 15 minutes of bottom time and will begin our acsent after 30 minutes of bottomtime" Make a plan, execute the plan.
Should the term technical diving be abandoned? Should the term recreational diving be abandoned? NO, what the majority of scuba divers do is recreational diving which is pretty simple to understand - diving for recreational purposes...ie - for enjoyment. Technical diving is a sub group of recreational diving when it is being done for enjoyment.
If you dive for commercial purposes, then you enter the rules and regs of the USCG and OSHA which set very restricted application of SCUBA. Dont believe that, then research a group of technical divers based out of the keys (wont tell you who they are) who went out to do a salvage job and were visited by the USCG who shut them down on the spot. Why? because they were being paid for their work and were using SCUBA to do the job. As I said, the use of SCUBA is very restricted in commercial diving.
Diving is an activity that requires education and most importantly proper application of the education received. Dive outside the limits of the education received or fail to apply it, and the risk of injury or depth will increase exponentially. This is probably the biggest cause of injury or death in Scuba diving.
As a compariosn, in the commercial diving world, the rate of injury or death due to actual diving are small compared to SCUBA. Why? because the commercial diving community is very rigid when it comes to safety and limits on divers based on their education and experience.
"To begin with, the phrase "technical diving" is more marketing than anything else..."
I agree that the term is now used by manufactuers to label and sell gear that is perceived to be better. However, the term was coined to describe diving and divers who originally did diving "outside the box" defined by NAUI and PADI as recreational diving. Of course, NAUI, PADI and other organizations have in recent years expanded their "box" to include items originally labeled technical. Why? because NAUI, PADI and others are businesses just like the dive shops. When Nitrox course started appearing from groups like TDI and IANTD, it took that money away from the big organizations.
Comment in another post-
" A technical dive is one that requires thoughtful and complex planning and which is executed within well-defined parameters or limits. Breaking any of these well-defined limits (such as going a little deeper, staying a little longer) may result in serious injury or death."
Every dive should be planned and executed within the planned parameters. Even if that planning is to say, "today, we are going to dive the wacka wacka reef which has a maximum depth of 40 feet. We will begin the dive by heading to the north along western edge and return diving south along the eastern edge. We will beging the return portion after 15 minutes of bottom time and will begin our acsent after 30 minutes of bottomtime" Make a plan, execute the plan.
Should the term technical diving be abandoned? Should the term recreational diving be abandoned? NO, what the majority of scuba divers do is recreational diving which is pretty simple to understand - diving for recreational purposes...ie - for enjoyment. Technical diving is a sub group of recreational diving when it is being done for enjoyment.
If you dive for commercial purposes, then you enter the rules and regs of the USCG and OSHA which set very restricted application of SCUBA. Dont believe that, then research a group of technical divers based out of the keys (wont tell you who they are) who went out to do a salvage job and were visited by the USCG who shut them down on the spot. Why? because they were being paid for their work and were using SCUBA to do the job. As I said, the use of SCUBA is very restricted in commercial diving.
Diving is an activity that requires education and most importantly proper application of the education received. Dive outside the limits of the education received or fail to apply it, and the risk of injury or depth will increase exponentially. This is probably the biggest cause of injury or death in Scuba diving.
As a compariosn, in the commercial diving world, the rate of injury or death due to actual diving are small compared to SCUBA. Why? because the commercial diving community is very rigid when it comes to safety and limits on divers based on their education and experience.
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