Weight and trim problems

[mod8521]

I have a few questions regarding proper weighting and trim. I am a new diver with only 9 dives. My new wetsuit and tank I dove today I am having trouble with. Mostly at the end of the dive. At the end of my dive I was definitely in a head down position. Having trouble staying down and not floating up feet first. What is the best way to correct this trim problem? Should I strap my bcd higher up on my tank? Or move weight around? As far as gear I am diving a mares pro tec bcd it has integrated weight pockets it also has two trim pockets sew in up around shoulder blade level. I am using a 7mil xs scuba farmer jon/jacket 2 pc suit, 5mil hood, and 3mil gloves. Tank is a faber lp 108cu ft. I was using 32lbs of lead. I am a big guy at 320lbs. On my first dive today I did a weight check after the dive with 500psi and I seemed to float at eye level but would end up laying face up in the water. tank seems to want to pull me down tank first somewhat if that makes sense. Am I still to lite at 32 lbs? At the end of the dive I have to kick to stay down if I ascend above 4 feet. I also seem to have to get down to 8-10 feet to descend steadily. If am light how much should I add? 32lbs of lead seems like allot already. For reference when taking my cert with a steel lp 85 cuft in a 1mil 10lbs was good. 18lbs with a 1mil layered with a 3/2mil and 2mil hood

 

[tracydr]

What did you change from your previous set-up?

 

[mod8521]

I changed from a steel 85 to a steel 108. Was a 3/2 mill with a 1 mil layered and 2 mil hood. Now 7 mil farmer jon and jacket 5 mil hood 3 mil gloves. Was at 18lbs before with the steel 85 and thinner suit.

 

[mathauck0814]

10% of your body weight sounds light if you're in 14mm of neoprene on your abdomen.

 

[TSandM]

Ending up tank-down is very common, when you are diving big steels which are fairly negative. If your BC doesn't cinch down REALLY snug around you, it will allow the tank to slop a little on your back, and if the tank gets off-center, you will turn turtle unless you use your fins to right yourself.

A formal weight check, if done properly, doesn't lie -- Instead of doing it vertical at the surface, I prefer, where possible, to do it in water I can stand up in, and do it prone. (That removes any influence of moving fins on the result.) Unfortunately, given the exposure protection you are using and your weight, I suspect 32 pounds may well be in the ballpark, and you may actually need a couple more. We put most of our students, in similar gear to yours, in 22 to 28 pounds of lead, and I have yet to have a student your size. The amount of ballast required is one of the big reasons why folks who dive where I do, in fairly cold water, start adapting their gear to try to minimize total gear weight. For example, switching to a steel backplate can drop as much as three pounds off the total. Doesn't sound like much, but every little bit helps!

It is not uncommon for people wearing thick neoprene to be leg/feet light, either. You can try heavier fins, or ankle weights if you need them.

 

[Scott]

What is the best way to correct this trim problem? Should I strap my bcd higher up on my tank? Or move weight around? As far as gear I am diving a mares pro tec bcd it has integrated weight pockets it also has two trim pockets sew in up around shoulder blade level. I am using a 7mil xs scuba farmer jon/jacket 2 pc suit, 5mil hood, and 3mil gloves. Tank is a faber lp 108cu ft. I was using 32lbs of lead. I am a big guy at 320lbs.

Both lowering the cylinder and or moving weight around will work. If you lower the cylinder make sure you can still reach the cylinder valve. How much weight or percentage of total weight are you placing in the trim pocket?
What fins are you using? Different fins may help, but that is an added cost.

 

[NAM001]

Clearly you can see the effect of wet suit thickness and the lead required to comp for it.

First. when you do hte 500# weight check do it at 20 ft where you will be soing your safety stop. you should beneutral or just slightly heavy. I am guessing that you will end up with closure to 40# of lead to do this.

If money is not an issue i would say get a dry suit. That will fix a lot. it may even cut your weight by 1/4 or more.
Next loose weight. not being mean but to be blunt fat takes a lot of space and that space floats and when it does youneed a lot of lead to comp for it. I am 6' and 250 and am working to do the same so we are n the same boat. You boat is just bigger.I am using a tls350 and need 19# with the undergarment on. now to show how touvhy this is i have a 100 undergatment that need 19# and my 300 needs 40# one is 2 times as thick as the other . The more acreage you have the more volumn 1/4" of foam consumes.you are in ohil i assume so the 7mil is 14 mil in the core and 7 on the rest. 14 mil is over 1/2 " of foam. Now assuming that you need a 7mm fj. Then you have no doubtedly found you you get real heavy about 30-40 ft., That suit looses 3/4 of its lift around 80 ft.80-90 at 100 0r so. Now you are possibly 25 or more heavy. So you comp with the bc and then you go from 80-60 and find your self really light and you vent to beat the band. Ultimately using a large amount of air in your tank for bouyancy control. Now the shell dry suit on the other hand doesnt do this. it doesnt shrink wiht depth. it gives you a suit squeeze to let you know to feed it air, just a smidge, and life is good you go up and it auto vents life is good. so remidees for the 14mm is a dry suit or plan b say a harveys 3mm suit with a lavacore underit. same warmth at say 4-5mm.
As far as being head down i dont understad this as you have all the lift on your core 14mm. Try bending your knees, that will shorten the leverage lifting your feet. Perhaps moving your tank down will help. One more thought are you ok till you look down and then you become head heave adn feet light. If so than your air in the bladder is moving towards you feet and shifting your trim. a back inflate bouyancy devince will correct this so long as you do not oversize the wing. you dont need more than 30-35 of dwing lift at the most. if your jacket has say 50# of lift then the air could be moving the the large volums area of the waist thus lifting your feet.

I have a few questions regarding proper weighting and trim. I am a new diver with only 9 dives. My new wetsuit and tank I dove today I am having trouble with. Mostly at the end of the dive. At the end of my dive I was definitely in a head down position. Having trouble staying down and not floating up feet first. What is the best way to correct this trim problem? Should I strap my bcd higher up on my tank? Or move weight around? As far as gear I am diving a mares pro tec bcd it has integrated weight pockets it also has two trim pockets sew in up around shoulder blade level. I am using a 7mil xs scuba farmer jon/jacket 2 pc suit, 5mil hood, and 3mil gloves. Tank is a faber lp 108cu ft. I was using 32lbs of lead. I am a big guy at 320lbs. On my first dive today I did a weight check after the dive with 500psi and I seemed to float at eye level but would end up laying face up in the water. tank seems to want to pull me down tank first somewhat if that makes sense. Am I still to lite at 32 lbs? At the end of the dive I have to kick to stay down if I ascend above 4 feet. I also seem to have to get down to 8-10 feet to descend steadily. If am light how much should I add? 32lbs of lead seems like allot already. For reference when taking my cert with a steel lp 85 cuft in a 1mil 10lbs was good. 18lbs with a 1mil layered with a 3/2mil and 2mil hood

 

[mod8521]

Thanks for all the responses so far.
TsandM
Long story short I was talked out of a Bp/w. I really wish I would have stuck to my gut feeling and bought one any way. I will probably next year.

Scott
I am using Mares Wave fins.

Kws
I am currently tapped out on dive gear for now. In less than 6 weeks I am 3000 plus in gear. I do plan on a dry suit but not in the budget as of now. I am working on losing weight. I do have a 3/2 and a 1 mill suit. I was cold at depth with it. I may try it out again next weekend as I was not using gloves or a hood. My bcd is a back inflate with a 50lb wing. I was told by my lds that I needed a bcd because 35 was pushing it. My bcd does have bungee straps built in to control air movement(I know bungees on a wing is frowned upon. I purchased before I knew about it).

I was getting pretty creative with packing in the 32lbs of lead I did. Really my only options are to either cast some weights to exact size of my weight pockets then drill holes into the blocks to get the weight exactLy to lbs I need or put on a weight belt. I would venture to guess using both intergrated and a belt is a no no. Sounds like asking for problems in a emergency having 3 items to release? I can take of the intergraded weight pockets and use a belt if needed(I do not use the pockets so no reason to have it unless I am using the integrated weight holders). I removed the integrated weight panels and the bcd seems more comfortable.

Sorry I did not specify but I am talking about fresh water. Temps below thermocline currently 59f. Two other local quarries I haven't dove yet(hopefully soon) are said to be colder.

 

[LowDrag]

I was told by my lds that I needed a bcd because 35 was pushing it. My bcd does have bungee straps built in to control air movement(I know bungees on a wing is frowned upon. I purchased before I knew about it).

Sounds to me like they 1) don't know squat about a wing and 2) wanted to sell you an expensive BC. OBTW...bungee's on a wing are not frowned upon that I have heard. Some of the top manufacturers of wings have bungee's on some of their systems.

I would venture to guess using both intergrated and a belt is a no no. Sounds like asking for problems in a emergency having 3 items to release?

There is nothing wrong with using a weight belt to go along with your integrated weight system. This allows you to drop a portion of your weight getting you positive without making you shoot to the surface like a cork.

I can take of the intergraded weight pockets and use a belt if needed(I do not use the pockets so no reason to have it unless I am using the integrated weight holders). I removed the integrated weight panels and the bcd seems more comfortable.

That sounds counter productive to me. The weight pockets are there to help you balance your weight so that you can get your rim and buoyancy set where you want it. That also makes me wonder how you carry 32 lbs without weight pockets? Unless you are using just a belt currently?

 

[mod8521]

That sounds counter productive to me. The weight pockets are there to help you balance your weight so that you can get your rim and buoyancy set where you want it. That also makes me wonder how you carry 32 lbs without weight pockets? Unless you are using just a belt currently?

Just to clear up my post about the pockets. I am talking about my bcd pockets for misc things. Not the inergraded weeks ght pockets. Mares says max capacity is 30lbs weight. I was able to fit 32. The bcd is 3 pcs harness wing and weight/gear pockets that are completely removable.

Yes the lds I purchased my gear from did not do my any favors. I have since switched shops. Just wish I would have found out before I bought all my gear.