Lets not forget boys and girls that the only reason for teaching OW is to sell equipment. People want cheap classes so they must buy some equipment so the shop can make money. If you don't want to buy the equipment you'll pay more for the class. Either way, the point is the class really costs more than what you're quoted (see my post above).
Was I ripped off?
- Thread starter kpleynes
- Start date
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Most students had to wear wet suits in the pool for our last few classes. We don't own the pool and have no control over the temperature. The pools that are used mostly for swimming laps and swim teams around here are pretty cold.
The outdoor pools we use in the summer aren't heated at all and it seems that we get cold nights whenever there's a class. The last class in fact I wore a full 2 piece 1 /4 inch suit because I was blue by the end of the previous nght.
I let students use my suits in the pool and that was a huge mistake that cost me a fortune. Of course opening a dive shop in the firstplace was a huge mistake that cost me a fortune. LOL. The pool put a lot of wear and tear on them in a hurry.
The outdoor pools we use in the summer aren't heated at all and it seems that we get cold nights whenever there's a class. The last class in fact I wore a full 2 piece 1 /4 inch suit because I was blue by the end of the previous nght.
I let students use my suits in the pool and that was a huge mistake that cost me a fortune. Of course opening a dive shop in the firstplace was a huge mistake that cost me a fortune. LOL. The pool put a lot of wear and tear on them in a hurry.
Well, ok Mike, I'll buy that..
However, it seems to me that that is a business decision that the dive shop is making, and that that shouldn't pushed onto the consumer as a moral obligation.
The shop owner chooses to offer a class essentially at (or below) cost hoping to make a profit on equipment sales. That may or may not work out in his best interest, and hopefully it generally does.
If a student is given, buys online, inherits, or even buys from the competition all his gear, one would hope that the shop would be graceful enough to offer the same quality of instruction that they offer everyone else, since that's what they agree to do when they take the customers $160 (or $600, or whatever they charged for the discounted class).
I totally agree that the shop should have every opportunity to sell the new customer equipment, and that they should take that opportunity.
What I object to is the "requirement" to purchase additional equipment that the student is not told about. The line "all you need for the pool is your swimsuit" appears to have been a lie from the customers perspective in this case when they were told that they needed to buy a wetsuit.
In this case, I think the student was charged a fair price, but that the shop needs to be up front with the student about the cost of certification if buying a wetsuit is a requirement. Especially as that wetsuit is not something that can be used at local dive sites, etc. and a second wetsuit will likely be required within the month.
- Atticus
However, it seems to me that that is a business decision that the dive shop is making, and that that shouldn't pushed onto the consumer as a moral obligation.
The shop owner chooses to offer a class essentially at (or below) cost hoping to make a profit on equipment sales. That may or may not work out in his best interest, and hopefully it generally does.
If a student is given, buys online, inherits, or even buys from the competition all his gear, one would hope that the shop would be graceful enough to offer the same quality of instruction that they offer everyone else, since that's what they agree to do when they take the customers $160 (or $600, or whatever they charged for the discounted class).
I totally agree that the shop should have every opportunity to sell the new customer equipment, and that they should take that opportunity.
What I object to is the "requirement" to purchase additional equipment that the student is not told about. The line "all you need for the pool is your swimsuit" appears to have been a lie from the customers perspective in this case when they were told that they needed to buy a wetsuit.
In this case, I think the student was charged a fair price, but that the shop needs to be up front with the student about the cost of certification if buying a wetsuit is a requirement. Especially as that wetsuit is not something that can be used at local dive sites, etc. and a second wetsuit will likely be required within the month.
- Atticus
cdiver2
Contributor
I aggree with you 100% but if a shop do's not tell me everything up front how can I trust them in the future I can not and will not.
You know this sort of thing realy gets up my nose, a lot of people geting into scuba know nothing at all about it ( you could probabley sell them a snorkel with a table tennis ball in the top :mean: ) and they go to a lds looking for a professional and they dont always get one, What is this world comeing to
.
You know this sort of thing realy gets up my nose, a lot of people geting into scuba know nothing at all about it ( you could probabley sell them a snorkel with a table tennis ball in the top :mean: ) and they go to a lds looking for a professional and they dont always get one, What is this world comeing to
.
Mike - perhaps the answer would have been to suggest that a wetsuit would make the student more comfortable and that they can rent one for a reasonable fee - all this when they first sign up for a class?
I know it doesn't always work that way, but if a shop can come up with policies that don't lead to customers posting questions like this one on scubaboard it seems like they're ahead. Just my 2c.
I'm sorry to hear that you're out of the dive shop business and that it didn't work out better for you. As someone who's done it yourself (and not just associated with someone elses shop) you've got a lot more experience than most of us.
- Atticus
I don't think the fair price of the suit is really the issue here. So what it was a fair price. It was incorrect gear. So now as long as you sell products at fair prices then sell all your new divers stuff they don't need...........you gave them a fair price now didn't you. If your prospective customer is not going to use it then they spent those funds on useless gear and now they are going to have to spend even more dollars to obtain the proper gear for their diving. Assuming that their customers are going to need a 3mm suit in the very near future is rediculous. How many divers in the NE do you think never dive anywhere else. Many I am sure. So their 3mm is 5 years old and still hanging in the closet.
Thanks for all the comments.
I looked over the internet and I think I could have saved 50$ buying these two items.
While I did not really lose anything, I just felt betrayed because during the first meeting, they told us that all we needed were the snorkel, mask, booties, fins and weight belt. Then this dive manager comes along telling me that I HAD to purchase a wet suit because the pool was very cold and a bathing suit won't do (although they did tell us that we should bring a bathing suit) and that we needed a mesh bag because we wouldn't want to have all our stuff lying around everywhere.
Anyway, at least, I hope I made great rapport with the dive manager
I looked over the internet and I think I could have saved 50$ buying these two items.
While I did not really lose anything, I just felt betrayed because during the first meeting, they told us that all we needed were the snorkel, mask, booties, fins and weight belt. Then this dive manager comes along telling me that I HAD to purchase a wet suit because the pool was very cold and a bathing suit won't do (although they did tell us that we should bring a bathing suit) and that we needed a mesh bag because we wouldn't want to have all our stuff lying around everywhere.
Anyway, at least, I hope I made great rapport with the dive manager
Don Burke
Contributor
Considering you got to try on the wetsuit before you forked over the money, I'd say you did okay on price. Whether you actually need that wetsuit is another issue.
You were taken for a bit of a ride on the mesh bag.
You were taken for a bit of a ride on the mesh bag.
You will need a 3mm suit if ever you plan to dive warmer waters and the price is fair, but better yet it fits you well. However, if you dont plan to dive warm waters and dive only here in the East Coast, get a refund or apply the credit towards a 7mm as NE waters are cold. (lol - least she didnt convince you to buy a hood, gloves, and boots also!) I think the instructors intention was actually done in good faith becuase even if pool conditions, you can get cold.
A bag is a bag - mesh or otherwise. For me the only good thing about having a mesh bag after diving in warm sw is dunking the entire bag, gear and all in the rinse tub When diving in NE waters (as you will soon see for yourself) even one oversize mesh bag will not fit all the stuff you need esp if diving dry.
A bag is a bag - mesh or otherwise. For me the only good thing about having a mesh bag after diving in warm sw is dunking the entire bag, gear and all in the rinse tub
When diving in NE waters (as you will soon see for yourself) even one oversize mesh bag will not fit all the stuff you need esp if diving dry.
Atticus not disagreeing here but to add a possible reason for above comment.
During the first night of my class I do a complete briefing of what the student needs, might like, and what they don't need for the class. I also cover what they should have paid for and make sure there are no suprises before the student gets locked into a money sucking position.
As for the first night in the pool All they need is a swim suit because they will be doing a swim test and float/tread test that can be effectived by even a 3mm shorty. I really need to be able to judge the students watermanship and personal comfort levels. After that most of the "water work" is actually short. If they show up with an exposure suit I will ask them to leave it off until I notify them it is ok to wear. That way we can discuss how they felt in the water temp and chose the appropriate level of protection for each student.
Don't know if that is what was going on here but it is one possibility!
Hallmac
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