Vr3

[padiscubapro]

MechDiver once bubbled...


My instructor and one guy in my trimix class have the Explorer and used them on some of our dives. I was not impressed and would not spend the money on one, even with the offered $400 off. The upload/download link is a piece of junk, the "dive history" is a fairly useless text file, and the planning software wasn't great either.

Phil

The HSE version of the softweare is better than the ABYSS version.

If it wasn't in the last month it didn't have RGBM it only had Buhlman.. Its great for multi level dives and if you plan it right you can always fall back on tables..
The d/l is an actual dump of the dive profile.. time, depth mix number ect.. its all you need (I find its better for record keeping than those that present it in only a graphic format), if you want to graph, it its simple if you have excel, just cut and paste into excel and you got the whole profile.. The software is good for doing fast mix updates and building square profile based bailoiut tables.. (its not meant to be a stand alone dive planner) set your mixes, give it a depth and time it will build tables for depth less than and greathjer than your target with a large range of times.. d/l the software from their web site.. the latest beta is pretty nice, and will give you the overall run times for RGBM but not all the stops (only the computer is allowed by agreement), Bruce wants people to license his code for PC programs.

The areas that the computer is stong in is A) its very easy to program without the use of another computer, and it has a very large readable screen.. Some people love the buttons (cold water divers) others hate it (usually warm water divers). The older version did not do deep stops but the asymetric on/offgassing does create stops deeper than straight buhlman (which is also an option within the computer).

Right now its the ONLY computer that does true RGBM don't take my word for it just Ask Bruce W. who created RGBM.

There also is a recall for all computers that were received prior to mid september(both HSE and Abyss).. the user will get a new case and a free software upgrade to the latest non RGBM version, if the person wants RGBM there is a $50 upgrade fee along with another 1 year warranty.
Right now the Abyss versions are still non RGBM but can also be upgraded for $50.
ALso the newer units (and upgraded units) have had a tremendous increase in battery life, its now well over 100 hours.

I had one of the earliest units shipped and put several hundred dives on them with only a few minor complaints, each was addressed in free upgrades I received(and my customers), none was serious and all were quickly fixed. Most of the problems dealt with CCR mode which didn't have as much early on testing as the OC portion did.

If the VR3 got away from the Indiglo display they are using I would recommend it more strongly.. But indiglo displays have a documented problem.. they have a LIMITED life and the brightness/contrass loss is easily measurable even after only a year..

My "new model" VR3 is just about 1 year old and I already notice the display has dimmed.

 

[MechDiver]

lucid once bubbled...
Mechdiver,

You stated that you wouldn't waste your money on the Explorer. Could you elaborate on the reasons why? I am interested in what you have to say as long as you have facts to back it up.
I am not that interested in the Uplink software. I have that on my computer now and have never used it. Maybe once I start diving more complex dives it will become usefull. I am not challenging you I just want more info =]

Thanks

ps= Are there older models of the explorer? If so is it possible that your trainer and friend had that?

See also padiscubapro's comments as they are relevant.

The units we had were new and HSE versions, but they did not have the RGBM yet. Both computers locked up the first dive with ERR and would not unlock for 24 hours. Also, neither worked the way the manuals said they were supposed to, and really didn't do anything to further the dive.

Granted, they are very readable and appear to be very well make, except for the link.

My biggest objection is the Explorer just does not give me $1000 worth of functionality over tables, a slate, and B/T. To be fair, neither does the VR3.

Phil

 

[lucid]

Does anyone know if this locking problem is being addressed by the Manufacturer? Or has it already been fixed?

 

[padiscubapro]

in all likelyhood the computer did what it is supposed to do! Your tables were probably different than the computer.. If you are going to generate tables you either should use its table generator on the PC software or find which CF factor matches most closely to your tables.. If you used the default cf=9, these tables are very concervative and is probably what cauysed your Err since you were running a more agressive table.

I find most people don't read the manual carefully enough and don't understand how the Cf factors work.. The models that the explorer uses is an asymetric model most table generation software does not do this so you really have to generate a few profiles to see how to set the computer.

cf 9 on the hse version (latest)has an offgassing time thats 135% of ongassing time(plus other factors), the abyss version is 150% of ongassing time. There is a typo in the manual that after all the descriptions of CF factors and how the work, state the opposite in a later paragraph, but it still should have been understood by the decription of the algs..

Directly from the manual!

Broken Decompression - 'Err'
If you surface with decompression remaining, you have 10 minutes to return to the decompression stop
depth and complete the decompression requirement. In the event decompression time is remaining, the
HS Explorer will go into broken decompression mode and the cryptic "Err" will appear in the TTF/SI
location. The HS Explorer now requires 24 hours to 'clear' the broken decompression mode. During this 24
hour period it will function as a bottom timer and depth gauge only. No decompression information is
displayed. The gauge information is for emergency conditions only.

as for the manuals, on occasion the newest software has been ahead of the manual.. its usually best to check the web page for the lastest.. right now the newest manual doesn't reflect the RGBM update yet. There was a period where additional functionality was added with the gas switches and PO2 setpoints that didn't make it immediately into the manual. But the detailed procedures worked well enough..

ABYSS was sending out a real outdated manual for a long time (their computers also boot up HSE since thats who made the computers) The only way to tell which one it is is by the label on the back of the computer , and the sticker on the front is different..
the oem version has a sticker HSexplorer.

 

[AquaTec]

I dive with two VR3's
i can not compare it to the others mentioned so I won't
I can tell you how i like it and how i use it.

I also believe there is nothing that comes close.

1st I have had them about 9 month and they have about 100 dives on them none less than 200 feet and as deep as 404 feet
Two other dive buddies i dive with also have two each. so we are diving with six VR3's a lot

I have the small current style, which there seems to be two versions of.
the first version is a light aluminum looking color and the second is the dark metal color. I am not speaking of the software here

Now the light color one deffenitly has a different type of button and the darker type is an improvement on the way the buttons work. the darker version the button have a feeling of clicking in and the 1st version the buttons push in very softly.

we as a group have experienced the following problems.
1 - on my very first dive after buying one. it stopped working while i was in deco. - I returned it and it was replaced with a brand new one

2 - on the other one i bought durring its fifth dive, on the way down it stopped working, shut off as if you removed the battery, after i hit about 250 it just turned back on and started the dive then, so run time was 3 minutes behind, and all the defalt settings were there. the computer rebooted. luckly i had the second and completed the dive. - the problem had been experienced by one of my buddies and it was discovered that the threads to the battery were not perfect so the battery lost contact with the cover. this was easy to fix, and has worked file ever since

3 - I can't think of any other problems except for one was dropped and as a result a button doesn't work. but that is a result of damage

4 - on thing is the IR link does not work with XP, but i hear there is a solution, I just need to send an email and find out.

Those are the only problems and they happened shortly after they were new. the problems were delt with and they have worked well ever since.

NOW THE ADVANTAGES
1 - Ten gasses changable and programable underwater.
2 - Helium
3 - Hetox decompression calculations
4 - NEVER LOCKS OUT, no matter what you do it will provide you with a deco procedure, if you really mess up and a deco profile does not match an algritham, it will provide you a "best guess"
5 - CNS tracking, this is a huge advantage for extreme decompression dives
6 - you will be out of the water much faster than most other divers
7 - you can change the conservativity of the profile
8 - you can run sample dive profiles on the computer

Recomendations
1 - this is a computer designed for those pushing the limits of technical diving, most computers are designed for those doing recreational dives or maybe touching on tech diving.
2 - dive it several times as your back up method prior to depending on it
3 - it is very dependable
4 - buy it from Phenoix
6 - buy two and have one as a redundent computer, cause you do not want to go to tables after doing a dive on this unit.
7 - don't use it for a hammer, but they are pretty durrable

some software notes
1 - I bought the IR link and ProPlanner directly from Phenoix and it was cheap, maybe 150.00...i cant really remember so that means it must have been cheap
2 - The newest version is the 2.0 and it is downloadable from your computer.

final analysis
1 - this computer will change the way you do trimix dives
forget about depth and bottom time and start thinking about time to the surface. keeping our discution strictly to decompression planning, you simple plan for how long you want to do deco, say for instance you plan for two hours of deco. you dive up and down, all around and you just make sure you arive at your first deco stop when the time to surface says two hours.
so there is some new thinking for you. through some 10/50 in your tank and dive away...you must first change the way you think.
2 - there may be some out there hat have had a few problems with them, but i would say that is a one time glich, probably from lack of quality control during production. this will improve and they are backing them up quite well, once the defficet has been resolved there have been no problems


well thats all i can think of about them right now, if something else comes to mind i will add it

 

[MechDiver]

AquaTec once bubbled...
I dive with two VR3's

final analysis
1 - this computer will change the way you do trimix dives
forget about depth and bottom time and start thinking about time to the surface. keeping our discution strictly to decompression planning, you simple plan for how long you want to do deco, say for instance you plan for two hours of deco. you dive up and down, all around and you just make sure you arive at your first deco stop when the time to surface says two hours.
so there is some new thinking for you. through some 10/50 in your tank and dive away...you must first change the way you think.
2 - there may be some out there hat have had a few problems with them, but i would say that is a one time glich, probably from lack of quality control during production. this will improve and they are backing them up quite well, once the defficet has been resolved there have been no problems

Great post AquaTec. Thank you. From reading the manual, I agree with your "final analysis" and wish I had more options to try one of these things. But, not being able to deal direct with the UK, and now, with a grossly inflated price hike by OMS, it just isn't worth $2500 to find out.

Phil

 

[lucid]

I just called OMS and the VR3 msrp is now $1900+. How the heck can a company justify raising the price of a computer that has had a lot of problems since it first came out? Completely rediculous.

/me makes mental note to by backup bottom timer and stick to tables for a while =]

 

[WreckWriter]

lucid once bubbled...
I just called OMS and the VR3 msrp is now $1900+. How the heck can a company justify raising the price of a computer that has had a lot of problems since it first came out? Completely rediculous.

/me makes mental note to by backup bottom timer and stick to tables for a while =]

/me, huh? An old IRC vet I see!

Try these guys for VR3: http://www.1877scubausa.com/

I THINK they get theirs straight from UK. I got mine there and there was no mention of OMS on box, manual, or unit.

Tom

 

[lucid]

-

I check them out. Tom, did you have any problems getting warranty work done since you purchased it from an online source?

-Nate

 

[WreckWriter]

No problem. Delta-P never even asked where I bought it.