Video from a Training Dive with John Chatterton

[Scuba-74]

Should you sign up for it before you have gotten all you could get out of the run-of-the-mill 3-letter acronym training?

That is a good question. I don't know. I can see benefit in getting a lot of training and "mileage" under your belt elsewhere and then taking his class to refine your skills and supplement your experience with his feedback/pointers, and I also see benefit in taking some of his classes early on, assuming I have met the prerequisites.

In practice, due to where I live and dive (Northeast) and where he teaches (Florida), when I finally decide to go technical route, I most likely will solicit recommendations for a good local TDI instructor. I wish I could afford J.C. for all my training, but that's just not in the cards .

 

[Protondecay123]

You’re putting words in my mouth. I have never made a comment about what I personally think of his teaching. I can if you’d like, but I don’t think it would benefit this conversation at all.

I’m just pointing out your argument is a false equivalency. But for what it’s worth, and this is not specific to this situation, teaching poor practices out of “style” doesn’t mean an instructor is good. It doesn’t mean someone teaching best practices is a good instructor. In the same vein that someone who has great accomplishments outside of an academic environment doesn’t mean they are a good teacher, nor does being a good teacher mean you would be capable of achieving the same accomplishments as anyone else.

Whether a Teacher is good or not is the purview of the students of the teacher. Not other teachers. The arguments that Chatterton's teaching style is some how negligent or (w)reckless appear to be more based on envy and jealousy here. Dear God, someone here wants everyone who disagrees over this somewhat minor point to sign an Oath?

 

[rjack321]

Agreed! There's a bit too much chest thumping going on in here. Go do the dives that Chatterton has done. Then come back and show us your video.

I've done some similar dives. Not the Doria, but the west coast equivalent, although I've heard people who have done both say the Doria is easier than the SS Governor. But so what? I knew how to shoot an SMB without needing to kneel years before I got to that point. We also laid line on that dive, not because we were penetrating anything but because we needed a reference to the start point/up/down line.

Here's the video from 2009.

Do I have your approval to comment now?

 

[cerich]

Whether a Teacher is good or not is the purview of the students of the teacher. Not other teachers. The arguments that Chatterton's teaching style is some how negligent or (w)reckless appear to be more based on envy and jealousy here. Dear God, someone here wants everyone who disagrees over this somewhat minor point to sign an Oath?

We also have standards to use to judge the teacher.

Based on what I saw on the video and my knowledge... Well, I am under two different contractual requirements to report.

 

[abnfrog]

im late to the party couldn't see the video , what standards did he allegedly break ?

 

[cerich]

im late to the party couldn't see the video , what standards did he allegedly break ?

That is for his respective agency to determine. Based on the video there was enough for me to have concerns based on my knowledge and professional responsibilities.

 

[abnfrog]

hey im in agreement if someone broke standards and you saw it you have no alternate other than to report it or you are in breech

 

[BoltSnap]

I used the term "propaganda" as "tongue-in-cheek" not realizing that some good folks will take as I was insulting their idol and these happy and delightful people will get all excited about it (not that I give a rat about it). I also think that these sweet people would have gotten all bent out of shape anyways even if I had used any other term that was less dramatic, e.g., marketing, salesmanship, advertising, etc.

Now, after reading all of the comments of the faithful and believers, I think I should have used the term, "Brainwashing" for the "hero worshiping" crowd.

I am questioning and wondering if the instructor for the course were somebody else other than JC and who was less known or even an unknown person, would the fun loving good folks finding excuses for JC had the same reaction and would have worked just as hard to find this unknown instructor excuses too. I am certain if it were somebody else who wasn't a diving celebrity or luminary as is JC, these same happy folks would have sliced, diced, disemboweled and skinned this instructor alive on cyberspace and probably would have issued an international advisory against this instructor.

What is extremely dangerous here is the rationalization and "explaining away" of very poor "instructing" in certain parts of the course related to very critical and fundamental skills. I believe that an instructor for a course should NEVER ignore poor basic skills just because he is busy with the more advanced skills. Just like it is TOTALLY inexcusable for an instructor teaching an underwater photography class to ignore his students' poor buoyancy control and trashing the reef while taking their "awesome" photos of the subjects, it is more so for an "Advanced Wreck" diving course. I can't imagine me taking on students in an advanced or any type of upper level program and continuing on with the "advanced" skills with the students if the students haven't mastered the fundamental basic skills first. I would stop the "advanced" course and work with the students on their basic skills first. In fact, I require a skill "assessment and evaluation" session in the class and pool for upper level training for students who weren't my students in prior courses or for my students who haven't been diving in a while or took their courses with me a long time prior. It will never be attributed to me that I certified a student in a specialty or advanced course while his basic skills are lacking especially their buoyancy. BUT, I ain't no dive luminary or dive idol, I am just a crazy dive instructor teaching diving in a crazy and totally screwed up part of the wonderful, happy and joyful world, sunny Libya

 

[rddvet]

Whether a Teacher is good or not is the purview of the students of the teacher. Not other teachers. The arguments that Chatterton's teaching style is some how negligent or (w)reckless appear to be more based on envy and jealousy here. Dear God, someone here wants everyone who disagrees over this somewhat minor point to sign an Oath?

No one said he was negligent. He's simply allowing people to have subpar basic skills and pass. It's absolutely not only up to the instructors students to decide if he/she is good or not. Many of them don't know any better. I know many people that think their sh-tty instructor is scuba jesus.

 

[Protondecay123]

No one said he was negligent. He's simply allowing people to have subpar basic skills and pass. It's absolutely not only up to the instructors students to decide if he/she is good or not. Many of them don't know any better. I know many people that think their sh-tty instructor is scuba jesus.

Really? You see a 1 hour video from a 4 day class and think you have a good enough perception of the entire class to make a statement like that? You know nothing about the other 3 days and 23 hours and can condemn the entire training session like that? Wow. Sounds like a lot more emotion there rather than actually knowing what transpired during the whole course.