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UTD Z-side mount with isolatable manifold

Discussion in 'Sidemount Diving' started by eelnoraa, Jul 29, 2013.

  1. MScorpa

    MScorpa Solo Diver

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Westminster, Maryland
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    So has this thread helped answer your questions? Sidemount divers are generally either for or against the z-system, there's really no in between. I would suggest to try diving conventional sidemount with an instructor and see how you like it, then make your own educated decision on which system suits your personal needs and abilities. Maybe practice some air sharing drills at the same time. There is no substitute for first-hand experience!
     
  2. Kevrumbo

    Kevrumbo Banned

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: South Santa Monica Bay/Los Angeles California, USA
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    Come on down to Catalina Island this Sat 07 Sept at Casino Point Avalon for a free demo dive on the Z-system:

    UTD Equipment Accessories
     
  3. GrimSleeper

    GrimSleeper Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: Ozstraya
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    Well, there's a whole stretch of my life I'll never get back.

    Here's what I learned from this thread:

    1. The Z-system, no matter how much you try to dress it up with pseudo-philosophical nonsense, appears to solve no problem that can't be solved with conventional sidemount, except that UTD apparently expect highly trained divers doing advanced dives to panic at the first hint of a problem, since always being able to donate the long hose without having to unclip it first is the only meaningful 'advantage' Kev seems to have come up with for the Z-system.

    2. KevRumbo goes to Truk a LOT, where it must really frustrate him that he has all this incredibly fancy equipment for his 'mixed diving team' being all clever on WWII wrecks, but he's surrounded by people doing mostly EXACTLY THE SAME DIVES on single Al80s. Well, last time I was there the guides wouldn't take people on single tanks into the sub, but you screwed the pooch on that one anyway, didn't you, Kev? Yes, it's awesome diving. But it's a leading holiday destination - seemingly, most of Australia's diving population has been there at least once. Ditto the Coolidge, and most of the divers there are on single tanks too. Don't make it right, but let's not hold either destination up as the epitomy of exploration diving.

    In all seriousness, if going OOA has someone ripping the reg out of someone's mouth in a panic, maybe that diver is not ready to do dives that require sidemount, backmount OR z-mount? And if a diver can't swap from a long hose to a bungeed reg and clip off the long hose with one hand while scootering (and back again), why is turning valves off and on again going to be any simpler?

    I can't believe I'm actually going to write something quite so George-esque, but the z-system appears to be an attempted equipment solution to a skills problem, compounded by being an attempt to make something unique. Two 'unsafe diver' crimes in the one package...

    Of course, I have no formal training in sidemount diving, just a little mentoring from ome people who are quite good at it, so the fact that I've managed to successfully and safely conduct many deep and overhead dives with team-mates diving sidemount and/or backmount may just be dumb luck. Perhaps it takes proper training to find the whole thing as staggeringly complicated and difficult as some people seem to want to make it. Or, just maybe, diving is diving and the simpler one keeps one's kit, the simpler diving is.
     
    ianr33, nakatomi, tiki_bill and 2 others like this.
  4. Kevrumbo

    Kevrumbo Banned

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: South Santa Monica Bay/Los Angeles California, USA
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    You & all go on keep opining & discounting what you think I'm experiencing. . . The fact & reality of it all, I'm there exploring the history, doing the dives and having fun. If reading about my diving the Z-system & Scuba expeditions takes away "a whole stretch of your life that you'll never get back" --well mate, you must be hating life very badly indeed. . .

    "A wise man makes his own decisions, an ignorant man follows the public opinion." --Grantland Rice
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2013
  5. GrimSleeper

    GrimSleeper Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: Ozstraya
    468
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    Dived Truk, Kev, loved it, and probably for the same reasons you do. Just as I loved Coron and other wrecks in the Philippines. Just as I love the deep wrecks around Guadalcanal. Just as I love the other wrecks scattered around the Solomons, including a couple of WWII planes I was the first to dive on, and have loved every wreck I've ever dived. I'm checking out possible virgin caves, looking for a couple of WWII wrecks that have been lost for 70 years, diving reefs nobody has ever dived before. Life is very good, I just don't feel a need to go on about it, and certainly don't see how my life being good justifies any equipment choice I might make.

    I'm glad you're having fun too, but the fact that you dive Truk a lot in no way proves or disproves anything about the z-system, so why constantly mention it? The wrecks in Truk Lagoon are fantastic diving whatever your preference for 'system'.

    And really? Quoting a 1920s baseball writer to flame me? Ooh, I am scorched. Why Grantland Rice Sucked
     
    tiki_bill and Doppler like this.
  6. Kevrumbo

    Kevrumbo Banned

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: South Santa Monica Bay/Los Angeles California, USA
    5,659
    1,345
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    Then go out and have fun yourself mate . . . (else lose precious more of "a stretch of your life" here on SB that you won't get back!). . .
     
  7. rddvet

    rddvet DIR Practitioner

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Florida
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    Could you do me a favor and give us a line item break down of exact costs of your trip including gas costs, baggage fees, and all the other lot. Kev has in just about any other thread he has the opportunity to, so I figured that would help with the one-upsmanship game you guys have going on.
     
    GrimSleeper likes this.
  8. GrimSleeper

    GrimSleeper Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: Ozstraya
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    :) I try not to think about it...

    Fair call, though. I was trying to point out that diving somewhere cool doesn't actually say anything about the virtues (or otherwise) of the equipment one uses for that diving, but you're right - it is all starting to look like a pissing contest.

    ---------- Post added September 5th, 2013 at 11:19 AM ----------

    I woke up with a cold this morning, old boy, otherwise I'd be out diving rather than trading barbs with you on the interwebs.

    You're a triumph of subliminal marketing, though. I'll never again be able to think about Truk or Bikini without thinking 'Z-System'.
     
  9. Kevrumbo

    Kevrumbo Banned

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: South Santa Monica Bay/Los Angeles California, USA
    5,659
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    Fair enough, get well soon & good diving! . . .perhaps I will see you on one of Pete Mesley's Expeditions to the Solomons 2015 (I'll probably be the only open circuit diver again just like the Bikini Atoll trip this past July) --diving backmount on USS Aaron Ward & other wrecks, but maybe just being a support diver for those going down Iron Bottom Sound to 120m on USS Atlanta (!).

    Here's some more of my potential "machinations" with the Z-system, for your amusement & as well as the rest of the Rogues Gallery:
    Combined Hybrid Backmount/Sidemount Configuration For Deep Wreck Diving
     
  10. GrimSleeper

    GrimSleeper Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: Ozstraya
    468
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    Ward's a great dive, Atlanta's gonna have to wait 'til I'm comfortable enough to do it CCR - you ain't seen nothing 'til you've seen He prices in the Sols!

    Gotta say, by the time you've assembled the z-backmount-doubles-sidemount-thing, might it not be worth considering just hiring a diving support ship and dropping down there in a bell? :wink:
     
    Texas Torpedo likes this.

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