OP
Underwater photography course recommendations
- Thread starter Unaware6905
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PatW
Contributor
You have a decent set up.
For one on one coaching, it really cannot be done underwater. So it is on land and looking at photos.
For underwater photography, one of the really important things is buoyancy control. Depending on the subject, a photo can be made or broken by being slightly out of place.
You also want fins that allow for you to back up easily. I have a buddy (underwater photographer also) who dives with those big old rigid cave diver fins. I use force fins. Scuba Pro Nova Wings are good too.
I shoot manual and RAW. RAW is almost essential because you will need to correct white balance in post processing and Lightroom is good for that. As I approach a subject, I do a test shot for exposure and I check the histogram. The thing is that most of the time you need to get close. Five feet is extreme range. Generally, the closer you get the better.
Also, learning how to approach fish is a big thing. Species vary. Some are easy to shoot (think squirrel fish) and others don’t like you getting close (parrot fish). But the thing that helps, is watching a fish and figuring out where they are going and getting there first. Hopefully, if you sit still, the fish will just approach you giving you a decent chance at a head on shot.
The Reef Photo course is good. The time I took it years ago, it was mainly Lightroom processing. The diving and shooting was the Blue Heron Bridge and that is macro shooting primarily.
Backscatter has various shoot outs. They like diving in the Caymans. As far as I understand, those are 2 morning dives with afternoon classes.
Also, you don’t need a pro for instruction. You are not going to get pro level in one course. It takes time. A local photographer can probably help you quite a bit. They don’t have to be world class. They just need to be a decent instructor who has got a decent skill set and can get you up a couple of levels.
You can also probably do some of this on line. You can tell them how you took the photo. You can send the unedited photo. You can send them your edited photo and even that level of instruction might be quite valuable.
For one on one coaching, it really cannot be done underwater. So it is on land and looking at photos.
For underwater photography, one of the really important things is buoyancy control. Depending on the subject, a photo can be made or broken by being slightly out of place.
You also want fins that allow for you to back up easily. I have a buddy (underwater photographer also) who dives with those big old rigid cave diver fins. I use force fins. Scuba Pro Nova Wings are good too.
I shoot manual and RAW. RAW is almost essential because you will need to correct white balance in post processing and Lightroom is good for that. As I approach a subject, I do a test shot for exposure and I check the histogram. The thing is that most of the time you need to get close. Five feet is extreme range. Generally, the closer you get the better.
Also, learning how to approach fish is a big thing. Species vary. Some are easy to shoot (think squirrel fish) and others don’t like you getting close (parrot fish). But the thing that helps, is watching a fish and figuring out where they are going and getting there first. Hopefully, if you sit still, the fish will just approach you giving you a decent chance at a head on shot.
The Reef Photo course is good. The time I took it years ago, it was mainly Lightroom processing. The diving and shooting was the Blue Heron Bridge and that is macro shooting primarily.
Backscatter has various shoot outs. They like diving in the Caymans. As far as I understand, those are 2 morning dives with afternoon classes.
Also, you don’t need a pro for instruction. You are not going to get pro level in one course. It takes time. A local photographer can probably help you quite a bit. They don’t have to be world class. They just need to be a decent instructor who has got a decent skill set and can get you up a couple of levels.
You can also probably do some of this on line. You can tell them how you took the photo. You can send the unedited photo. You can send them your edited photo and even that level of instruction might be quite valuable.
OP
Unaware6905
Registered
Thank you so for taking so much time to write such a detailed response. Your advice is well taken. The more I view the photos from my last dive trip, the less disappointed I actually am. However, I have to do a good bit on post-processing. I suppose that really is my main question. For those experienced in underwater photography, how much do you expect to have to do in post? I have added one of my recent photos as an example of where I am.
PatW
Contributor
That is a pretty decent photo. You need to get lower. You generally want to shoot at eye level to your subject (not always).
And the amount of post work you do “depends”. Generally, you will always have to do some white balance. And depending on the exposure histogram - you will probably want to fool with one or more of the white, blacks, highlights or shadows.
And it goes on and on.
Sometimes I have photos that look like nothing until I do extensive post processing. This is especially true of say a peacock flounder on the sand. The histogram will be really narrow and usually far to the right. I will need to crank up blacks, shadows and so on to get some tonal range. And often I will need to go to the HSL panel to bring out specific colors. And most photos need some sharpening.
And you can go to the masking panel with good effect. Such as in the above panel, set your white balance and crop to get th photo right then go to the masking panel and choose “subject”. - with lunch the AI will figure out you want the turtle and get it pretty well. Then you can do adjustments that only affect the turtle. If you want you can do a new mask and choose subject, then invert (everything but the subject) and then you can adjust the background.
And often you can do another mask just for the eye and adjust there to emphasize that critical part.
Often the back ground is farther from the strobes than the subject. I will do a mask for the background and modify the white balance because it will be green and blue and I might want it to look more “natural”.
Underwater photos take far more post than most other photos. But if you look at videos for Lightroom for wildlife or landscape photographers, they sometimes do quite a bit of post.
And people can get carried away and go way too far. I will often edit. And come back a week later and find I pushed it too far and I will tone it down some.
And the amount of post work you do “depends”. Generally, you will always have to do some white balance. And depending on the exposure histogram - you will probably want to fool with one or more of the white, blacks, highlights or shadows.
And it goes on and on.
Sometimes I have photos that look like nothing until I do extensive post processing. This is especially true of say a peacock flounder on the sand. The histogram will be really narrow and usually far to the right. I will need to crank up blacks, shadows and so on to get some tonal range. And often I will need to go to the HSL panel to bring out specific colors. And most photos need some sharpening.
And you can go to the masking panel with good effect. Such as in the above panel, set your white balance and crop to get th photo right then go to the masking panel and choose “subject”. - with lunch the AI will figure out you want the turtle and get it pretty well. Then you can do adjustments that only affect the turtle. If you want you can do a new mask and choose subject, then invert (everything but the subject) and then you can adjust the background.
And often you can do another mask just for the eye and adjust there to emphasize that critical part.
Often the back ground is farther from the strobes than the subject. I will do a mask for the background and modify the white balance because it will be green and blue and I might want it to look more “natural”.
Underwater photos take far more post than most other photos. But if you look at videos for Lightroom for wildlife or landscape photographers, they sometimes do quite a bit of post.
And people can get carried away and go way too far. I will often edit. And come back a week later and find I pushed it too far and I will tone it down some.
Trilobite
Contributor
Good to hear you are feeling better about it. I have the same camera and housing you do. Much more experienced above water, but thought I would chime in.
1. I worked on the small jpeg you attached with just lightroom and a sharpening plug-in. Nothing complicated. Result attached. Not a miraculous transformation, but I think it's better.
2. I agree more time pp on uw shots; need for white balance and adjustment for water quality. But I don't get too sophisticated.
3. You mentioned out of focus shots. If these are when trying to shoot fish etc. moving against a busy background, I don't think there is a lot you can do about that. My focus success rate with those is about 50%. (Similar to what I get above water with birds in flight.) It's a limitation of autofocus systems. The more recent autofocus AI might help some, but I expect even those are going to have difficulty when multiple critters are in the frame.
Attachments
Depending on where you are, I highly recommend Mark Thomas in Columbus, Ohio. He was one of my UW photo instructors.
He is not a scuba instructor, so you must have your skills down before taking one of his classes.
He is a full-time photographer and has shot for Nat Geo, Discovery, History Channel, etc.
Another is Dave Haas who is a member of this forum.
Dave leads trips all over the world and he was the guy who got me started. He used to be an Ikelite dealer and is still shooting pics. He's in the Maldives right now on a trip he put together.
He is not a scuba instructor, so you must have your skills down before taking one of his classes.
He is a full-time photographer and has shot for Nat Geo, Discovery, History Channel, etc.
Another is Dave Haas who is a member of this forum.
Dave leads trips all over the world and he was the guy who got me started. He used to be an Ikelite dealer and is still shooting pics. He's in the Maldives right now on a trip he put together.
My 2 cents:
The recommended books are great, but no substitute for time shooting underwater. Another instructor to consider is Cathy Church at Sunset House, Grand Cayman.
I would repeat and summarize the above comments on technique as: get low, get close, get as much light as you can on the subject. Get the eyes in focus. It also takes a lot of experience to understand when a fish might circle back or not be spooked. Also, don't obsess about equipment. The great photos you have seen from a decade ago were shot on 12 megapixel cameras.
Post processing is usually significant due to the fact that you are shooting in the water column and often have a lot of particles floating around, as well as uneven light. The crystal clear magazine photos are almost never right out of the camera.
Enjoy the hobby. Don't get bummed comparing yourself to others. If you get a handful of images you really like, that's a great trip!
The recommended books are great, but no substitute for time shooting underwater. Another instructor to consider is Cathy Church at Sunset House, Grand Cayman.
I would repeat and summarize the above comments on technique as: get low, get close, get as much light as you can on the subject. Get the eyes in focus. It also takes a lot of experience to understand when a fish might circle back or not be spooked. Also, don't obsess about equipment. The great photos you have seen from a decade ago were shot on 12 megapixel cameras.
Post processing is usually significant due to the fact that you are shooting in the water column and often have a lot of particles floating around, as well as uneven light. The crystal clear magazine photos are almost never right out of the camera.
Enjoy the hobby. Don't get bummed comparing yourself to others. If you get a handful of images you really like, that's a great trip!
Only on FB now as he's only running trips and not really teaching formal classes. He will do workshops now and then if the person is willing to work with his schedule. He's mostly retired from teaching. I listed him because he can be persuaded to occasionally offer private training. No idea why this is coming up in German. FB is weird
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