Thoughts on PADI speciality courses

[Teamcasa]

For me, specialty classes, regardless of the agency, have their place. There are some people who just love taking classes, collecting cards, badges and the accolades from the accomplishment. Then there are some don’t have any desire for the classes, don’t dive in hazardous places and just love to dive.

So many certifications have become more like a merit badge for scouts than any real course. Spare me the “it’s the Instructor” speech. I know that a terrific instructor can make even the most humdrum certification be quite fun and educational but that’s a different thread.

I also believe that there is a place and indeed a requirement for some types of diving where a class should be mandatory. Initial open water diving, all commercial diving categories, cave/cavern, wreck, salvage, (real) deep/deco and specialty gas diving come to mind.

Then again, some of the classes could indeed be just a study at home, test and pass or fail and dive with the instructor only if needed. (Like Nitrox.) Some could be just a sign off after an instructor witnesses you satisfactorily performing the doing the skills. (Like Boat diving, DPV, drysuit, video/photography and some others.)

I have no issue with people who have a predilection for classes and certifications, I just think it should be put into the proper perspective. Some people just don’t need or want it.

Either way, Kudos to you Rhone Man, nice write up and congratulations on your classes.

 

[ScubaSteve]

........So many certifications have become more like a merit badge for scouts........

100% in Agreement

When I found out that with PADI you could get your AOW certification with just 5 specialty courses and that 1/5 (one fifth) of those could be the underwater naturalist, I lost respect and began thinking this way. For arguments sake, let's say the following: OW rec limits are 60' and AOW rec limits are 120'; and having the knowledge learned on fish identification in the Naturalist course will make you a safer diver at 120'???? Although the quality of instruction can very, I think it is imperative that what an agency require for further certification be responsible and well thought out. I am of the opinion that this scenario was not well thought out or responsible. This is of course, just one man's opinion.

At least with the NAUI certification that I took I had: Deep, S&R, Nav, Night and PPB.....all good "courses" designed to make you a safer diver.

 

[Rhone Man]

There are some people who just love taking classes, collecting cards, badges and the accolades from the accomplishment.

Guilty as charged. It's a personality flaw.

 

[ScubaSteve]

Guilty as charged. It's a personality flaw.

But at least you are learning and betting yourself. That with a good dose of common sense and intelligence can go a long way.

 

[NudeDiver]

Would you be comfortable diving with a random buddy on nitrox who just read about it in a book?

I'm not really comfortable diving with a random buddy no matter what books they read.

I'm not anti-class either. Hell, I've got over 350 university semester credits under my belt. That's a lot of classes. I just like to GET SOMETHING OUT OF CLASSES when I take them. I took classes like CHEM 660 (graduate course in Chemical Oceanography) just for fun - but I still got a lot out of it. I don't claim to "know it all" either - the truth is, I know very little. About anything. I'm just saying - as noted in the two class writeups above - I didn't get much out of those classes except a smaller bank account and a c-card.

A buddy of mine, who did the OW course with me, in a drysuit, and has some 15-20 drysuit dives, recently had to take a drysuit cert course because now the rental shop requires it to rent a drysuit. Didn't matter that he did his initial 4 dives in a drysuit, and the OW class included an extra pool session JUST for drysuit training. Didn't matter that he already had X number of drysuit dives. They knew all of this. They had even rented him a drysuit in the past - on their own boat. But they changed their policy to require the drysuit cert.

OK - so, he took the class. So, according to my buddy, they didn't require a pool session and they didn't require any of the exercises on the two dives. Essentially, they had him just pay money for a c-card over some perceived liability concern about renting him a drysuit. Now that's just phucked up. This is a respectable shop too. Very knowledgable, very advanced divers. Makes me thing that if PADI were to come out with something, "Underwater Flashlight Diver" shops may start requiring the cert before they will allow you to rent a flash light. Wouldn't surprise me at all.

In any event - like an adviser once told me - "you don't have to take a class to learn something."

 

[k ellis]

Well for my 2 cents I think taking the courses are great for people who have an objective and some courses are more precious then others. Like for wreck diving as an example some people want to wreck dive and feel they need a certification. I think they should take in to consideration first if they plan to look at wrecks from afar (10 feet away or more) or if they want to actually enter the wreck. If all they want to do is swim the outsides and look then the wreck would not be a beneifit.

As I stated earlier some courses though are not really as relevant to the dives as some cases of self time and patience are. Like peak performance buoyancy. Your paying alot of money for something a simple dive to say 15 feet with a good dive buddy to assist you can master in time on your own. You allready learn how to do it in Open Water.

Another thing is I have dove in Caverns with groups and I have dove deeper then the recommended 60 feet recommended for open water with groups and not once did anyone ask for more then a C-Card and my nitrox card. So really I think its the persons choice and the courses are great if you plan to solo dive or dive with another diver thats not a dive master.

 

[Damselfish]

100% in Agreement

When I found out that with PADI you could get your AOW certification with just 5 specialty courses and that 1/5 (one fifth) of those could be the underwater naturalist, I lost respect and began thinking this way. For arguments sake, let's say the following: OW rec limits are 60' and AOW rec limits are 120'; and having the knowledge learned on fish identification in the Naturalist course will make you a safer diver at 120'???? Although the quality of instruction can very, I think it is imperative that what an agency require for further certification be responsible and well thought out. I am of the opinion that this scenario was not well thought out or responsible. This is of course, just one man's opinion.

At least with the NAUI certification that I took I had: Deep, S&R, Nav, Night and PPB.....all good "courses" designed to make you a safer diver.

Not quite accurate, though it's sort of worse than you describe. You need 5 specialty dives for AOW, not 5 specialty courses. And while Deep and Nav are 2 required dives, well, the other 3/5 could be variations on UW Naturalist.

It's Master Diver that requires 5 specialty courses - but they could all be variations of UW Naturalist if you work at it.

Nothing wrong with taking specialty courses as long as the student realizes what they're getting, or not. If someone enjoys them, great. (OW and Master diver, IMO both need more meaty requirements and restrictions.)

 

[ScubaSteve]

..........Nothing wrong with taking specialty courses as long as the student realizes what they're getting, or not. If someone enjoys them, great. (OW and Master diver, IMO both need more meaty requirements and restrictions.)

I agree....I am all for furthering training etc.. HOWEVER, if I find myself paired up with an AOW diver, I would rather them be able to control their buoyance rather than being able to identiy the fish they passed as they sank past it at 140'. I definitely respect people wanting increase their knowledge, but learning about fish does nothing really to make that person a safer diver and I question allowing it to count towards an AOW certification. IMHO

 

[jviehe]

100% in Agreement

When I found out that with PADI you could get your AOW certification with just 5 specialty courses and that 1/5 (one fifth) of those could be the underwater naturalist, I lost respect and began thinking this way. For arguments sake, let's say the following: OW rec limits are 60' and AOW rec limits are 120'; and having the knowledge learned on fish identification in the Naturalist course will make you a safer diver at 120'???? Although the quality of instruction can very, I think it is imperative that what an agency require for further certification be responsible and well thought out. I am of the opinion that this scenario was not well thought out or responsible. This is of course, just one man's opinion.

At least with the NAUI certification that I took I had: Deep, S&R, Nav, Night and PPB.....all good "courses" designed to make you a safer diver.

The AOW cert requires 5 Adventure dives, not specialities, one of which is the deep adventure dive (the other is nav, and 3 of your choice). You are just ill informed on the PADI AOW course, which is meant as an experience course for new divers. It does not, nor is it advertised to make you an expert diver. And its not the topic here either.

 

[jviehe]

I agree....I am all for furthering training etc.. HOWEVER, if I find myself paired up with an AOW diver, I would rather them be able to control their buoyance rather than being able to identiy the fish they passed as they sank past it at 140'. I definitely respect people wanting increase their knowledge, but learning about fish does nothing really to make that person a safer diver and I question allowing it to count towards an AOW certification. IMHO

AOW has little to do with bouyancy, as that should have been mastered at the OW level. If you did some research, youd see that the most common adventure dive offered during AOW is PPB, but it is not required. Dive shops decide which courses to offer, not PADI (other than Deep and Nav).