The "S" Word

[MikeFerrara]

Mike,

as the "stroke" who made the "etlitist" comment I would like to refresh our collective memory as to what I actually posted:



I don't believe that I called you elitist, in fact I don't think I even came close. I don't believe that you indicated that you taught any other kick but the frog, whereas I clearly stated that I taught both in my OW classes. But it's easy to assume martyrdom and CLAIM that I called you an elitist. Sometimes the shoe actually DOES fit.

No you didn't call me an elitist you said "I hope this isn't a call to scuba elitism". I didn't go read it again but that'll be real close. You should however review what was written because I absolutely discussed several kicks as well as trim and a few other points like some suggestions on how to practice. From memory, and please go check on it but I stated that I not only taught the flutter but several different variations of it. BTW, I had to teach the flutter because it's required by standards which I believe I also stated. I guess you got busy or something but after your reference to "scuba elitism" you left the thread. So by all means lets refresh our memory as to what was posted.

From my perspective, every time I have been referred to as a stroke, it has been because I have actively disagreed with a DIR diver about something that is NOT safety related. There was a while where I was happy to describe myself as a stroke, simply to irk those who were more than willing to ascribe that term to me either to my face or behind my back. Uncle Pug politely asked me to stop, and so I did.

Well, I didn't call you a stroke and since I make no claims to being DIR I sure wouldn't call you one because you disagreed with DIR...if I did. As you say though sometimes the shoe fits.

So now, there are a butt load of divers who are willing to go on the offensive with DIR. They are not willing to sit back and allow those vocal few to label them. Instead, they have taken the label and have redefined it as a mark of rebellion against abuse. Notice, I didn't say against DIR, though that often follows. [/QUOTE]

I sure haven't ever gone on the vocal offensive for DIR since I don't make any claims of being DIR. In fact if you search the board you'll see that I've had some lively discussions on the oposite side of folks like UP, yooper, roakey, MHK and others.[/QUOTE]

Does this upset you? It should! Uncle Pug has done a WONDERFUL job of debunking the DIR sterotype, only to have his work destroyed again and again by the vocal few. There are others as well who work hard to stop the abuse by the few so that the movement can grow. But, and again from an outsider's perspective, in order to GET respect, you have to GIVE it. When you use words such as "stroke", or ascribe terms like "The Bungeed Wings of Death", and even like "Spare Death", you end up polarizing our sport and alienating a host of divers.[/QUOTE]

Explain why it should upset me again? All I did was explain a little about different finning techniques and when they are used and why ect ect. All stuff that you can find in NSS-CDS texts, NACD texts, IANTD texts and probably others. If there was any reference to DIR in that thread I missed it.

DIR has a distinctly negative reputation when it comes to abuse. Is this fair? Surely not! However, you have the founder of the movement and a host of GI3 wannabes to thank. Just don't blame the non-DIR folk. They have no way of telling who the vocal few are. They just assume that ALL DIR divers are abusive.

Great but what does all that have to do with me? Did I somehow get labeled DIR because I can explain a few different kicks and something about trim? Did I abuse some one in that thread? And again, I don't recall any reference to DIR in the thread and if there was it sure didn't come from me. Yet the term "scuba elitism" came up. Why is that Pete? I can probably be accused of being a vocal minority at times but certainly not for or having anything to do with DIR.

 

[SDAnderson]

You got that from his post? Okey dokey then.


So after the first half of your post you talk about not demeaning others, then you post this. Interesting.

Stings a little, does it? Within lies the lesson.

 

[JeffG]

Stings a little, does it? Within lies the lesson.

Doesn't sting a bit. The lesson is that it tells me a lot about you.

 

[Diver0001]

Though obviously true, the point isn't that nobody wants to be insulted, even if there is a possibility they deserve it.

You know, I just can't think of a single reason why *anyone* no matter how stupid, ignorant, ill informed, pig-headed or hopeless, could possibly *deserve* and insult.

I'm actually really surprised to hear you, of all people, say something like this. I didn't take you as the disrespectful type.....

R..

 

[mweitz]

Hi, my name is Mark, and I'm a Stroke.

Let's not take all this too seriously now.

 

[Diver0001]

Hi, my name is Mark, and I'm a Stroke.

Let's not take all this too seriously now.

LOL.....

Well....you started this snowball rolling. Don't go getting afraid of it now.... :05:

R..

 

[Meng_Tze]

Hi, my name is Mark, and I'm a Stroke.

Let's not take all this too seriously now.

Hi,
My name is Bob and I know a stroke.....

 

[The Chairman]

Mike,

I won't get into this with you. You completely misrepresented the discussion whether you want to admit it or not. If you are fine with that then by all means keep misrepresenting me. Only the first paragraph (or two) applied directly to you, and the rest was in general. You are NOT the only instructor who teaches more than one finning technique and you are NOT the only instructor who teaches trim.

(Switching to "General Mode")

This is the major problem with elitism. It eventually stops trying to figure out WHAT is the best way and concentrates on proving that their way is the ONLY way. It foments an "Us vs Them" mentality where only "WE" do things the right way. They are incompetent imbeciles and only teach one finning technique, or choose your controversial issue and insert right here! It only leads to the demonizing of anyone who disagrees with you.

For the record, I am NOT anti-DIR. But I don't accept all that they proffer as "fact" either. I am sure that there is a DIR-F course in my future. I am sure that I will learn tons in that class as I have in all the Scuba Classes that I have taken. This discussion is about the use of the "S" word and subsequently about the inherent snobbery or elitism if you will.

 

[SDAnderson]

You know, I just can't think of a single reason why *anyone* no matter how stupid, ignorant, ill informed, pig-headed or hopeless, could possibly *deserve* and insult.

My point, exactly.

Insults usually elicit exactly the kind of responses my jab has. Insults tend to anger and isolate people, which can be a legitimate goal - if you want people to go away and leave you alone, disrespect them. Otherwise, they are most often counter-productive.

I didn't mean to make Jeff mad (sorry, guy, I was trying to make a point, I may have fumbled the ball) and went to some lengths to demonstrate that I was speaking hyperbolically and with tongue firmly planted in cheek (smilies, silly poems, whatever), and yet...look at what the result was. Hopefully, those that casually use a term that they know to be an egregious insult to many others will think twice before they do so in the future - that's about all I can hope for.

And, yes: My name is Steven and I'm a stroke.

 

[damiana]

My curiosity got the better of me. I'm sorry, but I have to ask, what precisely is
the purpose of this topic? Am I seriously reading arguments that attempt to justify using a highly derogatory expression?

Seems to me that embracing the “spirit” of a term like “stroke” is pretty mean-spirited.