The Mares & Dacor HUB

[MechDiver]

leadweight once bubbled...


lacks relevance to recreational divers, particularly the warm water crowd.
Some of the technical divers need to stop assuming everyone is just like you.

I am not GUE, therefore I am not, by definition, DIR. However, your comment above is incorrect. Anything that gives the user potential to be a safer, or just better for that matter, diver is "relevant".

Race car drivers used seatbelts, now they are mandatory in most places for "recreational drivers". Airbags are a bad thing?

Technology or leading edge events (can be read "tek diving") create new or better use of safety or other items that normally trickle down to us "normal" people and events. Why should this be different in scuba?

Phil

 

[cyklon_300]

on the 'Best Scuba Tip' thread that might be relevant to this discussion.

My guess is that most of these people are recreational, non-DIR divers.

 

[WreckWriter]

leadweight once bubbled...
Stirring things up? So there is only one way to do things and that is the "right way" as in DIR?.......Some of the technical divers need to stop assuming everyone is just like you.

Yes, stirring things up. Lately your name, and your snide comments, appear in pretty much every thread where someone attempts to suggest a BP/wing, a lose hose, or anything else that might be remotely considered as DIR. All you're doing is trying to start arguments.

You could just as easily present your side of the discussion and leave out the snotty comments, but no, you don't do that.

Why don't you post the links to a couple recent threads where any DIR or GUE diver has made the claims you accuse us of (such as "nothing else will work" or other "scare" tactics)?

We'll be waiting.

WW

 

[Zagnut]

I am a rec diver and do not use back plate /wings setup. I, however have no problem whatsoever with DIR philosophy..even when used rec diving. If people want to call me a stroke, that's cool...no skin off my teeth. If you look into DIR, alot of it makes good sense..even for rec divers. So don't call me anti-DIR for my comments. I use a Zeagle Ranger and love it, but am curious about backplate/wings..maybe someday down the road, would like to have one as a Primary setup and use the Zeagle for back-up...maybe...More research would need to be done on my part. Anyhows

The problem with the DIR setup for the person that started this thread is this. They only dive 25 times a year, and the DIR setup can get a bit pricey. Do the diver's needs require an expensive , state-of-the-art setup (wreck diving, cave diving, diving all the time, etc.), or will just a decent good quality jacket style BC do (just lookin' at pretty fishes in 60' of warm, blue water). It depends on how hard money is to come by for the purchaser, and just what do they require from their gear?

I would say "Go with the Zeagle Ranger!..It's great!" , but I'm biased. That may even be more than this diver needs. There are good quality BCs that are less expensive than my Ranger.

My advice, as has been said on many a previous post would be this: Figure out what your diving needs will be. Not just right now but 5 years from now(you don't want to end up replacing everything because you find yourself getting more and more into the sport, and your old gear no longer serves your needs). If you really love it and think you will only get into the sport more and more, then think about paying a little more and look into the backplate/wing in addition to other types of BC. If you think you will always be just a moderate scuba enthusiast, then maybe look into a cheaper (although reliable and good quality) setup. Is a little more comfort from not getting squeezed by a jacket style BC worth shelling out the extra money for top notch stuff? Do alot of research on pros and cons of all types (jacket style, back inflate, BP/wings), figure out your diving needs and price range and go from there.

 

[MechDiver]

Zagnut once bubbled...

The problem with the DIR setup for the person that started this thread is this. They only dive 25 times a year, and the DIR setup can get a bit pricey. Do the diver's needs require an expensive , state-of-the-art setup (wreck diving, cave diving, diving all the time, etc.), or will just a decent good quality jacket style BC do (just lookin' at pretty fishes in 60' of warm, blue water). It depends on how hard money is to come by for the purchaser, and just what do they require from their gear?

Although your points were well thought out and pretty well on, I don't understand your reasoning on the above.

Why does a backplate/wing mean "expensive, wreck, cave, etc". I have a bp setup like you say, doubles, canister, argon, DIN, you name it. However, I also have a bp/wing setup for single tank diving, single regulator, no deco, no cave (heaven forbid =-) ) and probably not as expensive as your Zeagle.

A bp/wing does not NEED to mean expensive, as a car does not need to mean Mercedes. You put the effort and money into the projected use of the BC.

Good post, (well, mostly)

Phil

 

[ElectricZombie]

Zagnut once bubbled...
They only dive 25 times a year, and the DIR setup can get a bit pricey.

Actually, it's quite the opposite. I spent about $700.00 - $750.00 for a ScubaPro Rec Tech a few years ago. My Halcyon Pioneer setup cost me $505.00 and is a much better setup.

I have the new ScubPro catalog in front of me, and their Classic BC is $698.00.

I would cite the fact that they only dive 25 times a year as a good reason to look into a BP. The BP is a lot simpler to use for someone who does not get a whole lot of practice. It has everything they need and nothing they don't.

 

[leadweight]

WreckWriter once bubbled...


Yes, stirring things up. Lately your name, and your snide comments, appear in pretty much every thread where someone attempts to suggest a BP/wing, a lose hose, or anything else that might be remotely considered as DIR. All you're doing is trying to start arguments.

You could just as easily present your side of the discussion and leave out the snotty comments, but no, you don't do that.

Why don't you post the links to a couple recent threads where any DIR or GUE diver has made the claims you accuse us of (such as "nothing else will work" or other "scare" tactics)?

We'll be waiting.

WW

You can take that combative attitude outside. I have kept it clean, you lower yourself with a personal attack.

People don't just suggest BP's around here. They pile on heavy to the point that any positive discussion of mainstream BC's has become impossible. You also exagerate greatly the extent to which I criticize DIR. This is not about "nothing else will work". It is about alternatives, some of which don't make sense for most divers. As for scare tactics, the vocabulary of DIR speaks for itself. Finally, the name DIR implies that everyone else is wrong and the vocabulary implies that everything not DIR is fatally defective. That is pretty snotty to me.

Why don't you go out and write another book? No one is paying advances for what goes on around here.

Seems that the emperor is naked today.

 

[WreckWriter]

leadweight once bubbled...


You can take that combative attitude outside. I have kept it clean, you lower yourself with a personal attack.

People don't just suggest BP's around here. They pile on heavy to the point that any positive discussion of mainstream BC's has become impossible. You also exagerate greatly the extent to which I criticize DIR. This is not about "nothing else will work". It is about alternatives, some of which don't make sense for most divers. As for scare tactics, the vocabulary of DIR speaks for itself. Finally, the name DIR implies that everyone else is wrong and the vocabulary implies that everything not DIR is fatally defective. That is pretty snotty to me.

Why don't you go out and write another book? No one is paying advances for what goes on around here.

Seems that the emperor is naked today.

You dish it out nicely but you go into full whine when you get called on it. Somehow I'm not surprised.

You have kept it clean? Kept it clean meaning attacking us as a group instead of as individuals? Yea, that's clean.

You're correct in one thing; it's not DIR you criticize, you don't have any points on which to do that. Instead you criticize the members of this board who believe in DIR, not only criticize us but do it on a false basis.

Once again, let's see the links to the posts that prove your point, there are hundreds of them, aren't there?

Maybe then the Emperor will find his clothes.

WW

 

[Uncle Pug]

WW and LW you two just need to learn how to get along... and understand where the other fellow is coming from.

WW... is a diver's diver and has been doing it for a loooong time... he is an accomplished technical diver as well.

LW... got a serious rash trying to figure out a backplate harness... and thus his crusade against them.

There... that should help.

 

[WreckWriter]

Uncle Pug once bubbled...
WW and LW you two just need to learn how to get along... and understand where the other fellow is coming from.

WW... is a diver's diver and has been doing it for a loooong time... he is an accomplished technical diver as well.

LW... got a serious rash trying to figure out a backplate harness... and thus his crusade against them.

There... that should help.

I think you're right Pug. I don't if the rash part is accurate but I know this has gone as far, on my end, as I can let it go, being a properly neutered regular and all.....

Someone else can have this argument.

WW