The cost of excellence

[sea2summit]

Some great stuff being put out. You are pretty much in the heart of GUE/DIR land so you should have no shortage of mentors/instructors. Might checkout thedecostop.com, lots of good technical stuff there and lots of opinions on DIR/GUE and technical diving in general.

 

[FLDVR]

Lydon, Brian has pointed you in the right direction
I think that the only missing advice is to have someone else on your same level to at least enter Fundies with.

Its always been the school of thought that if you come to the class so well prepared you will miss out on some of the nuances that Dir training has to offer.

I walked into fundies in my OWD semi Dir rig and promptly switched to doubles first day. I had plenty of time to refine skills with some of our South Florida Dir members and also plenty of time with my buddy, and plenty of time in my swimming pool.
Long story short is get into the class then dive dive dive....

Henry

 

[TSandM]

Yes. I really think the biggest problem with Fundies is that, in the five years since I took it, it really has become to a great extent an exam, rather than a class. This is a product of the fact that many people take it, not for the skills, but for the access to higher classes, and they can't afford not to pass the first time through.

I really think the way to take the class is to take it in a single tank, when you are still a little bit wobbly. Get the instruction and take it off to your regular diving and build your skill. You can do a recreational reevaluation any time within six months, and a technical upgrade at any time at all. So, unless access to an instructor is a real logistics issue, doing the class as a CLASS -- a place to learn new things, rather than demonstrate ones you have already mastered -- is the way to get the most value out of your opportunity, in my opinion.

 

[lmurtha1]

I see what you are saying, so basically its become a label to obtain higher degrees of training? If that is the case, then wouldn't it be more beneficial to obtain the training prior to pass the class the first time, especially when one is trying to obtain higher training in the GUE program?

In my case, I just want to become a more proficient dir diver and this class can offer that. That being said, to get into the GUE tech 1 & 2 classes, it takes time and skill to master before hand correct? Like some PADI tech classes, you can progress directly into the next level as long as you pass the previous with little out of instruction diving. Some people just go straight through non-stop just to earn the level.

So what do you guys think? Do people take GUE classes to become better divers or because they want the prestige of being under their wing? I would assume both. Either way, Ive put my foot down and am carving my path now!

One more question, how important is computer redundancy at deep depth? My LDS said their techies wear 2 of the same dive computers (vr3, liquivision, or shearwaters)? I just wear a Bottom timer. Do any of you use multiple gas computers when diving even though they are not technically DIR? why do they use them?

Thanks again for all your help

Lydon

 

[kathydee]

Lydon,

I'd suggest diving with some local divers that dive within the framework of DIR: teamwork, situational and buddy awareness, and solid dive skills.
This local group can help you get to where you want to be: SFL-DIR : SFL-DIR

Lydon,

It's great to see you posting here ! This is a good suggestion.

 

[nadwidny]

Yes. I really think the biggest problem with Fundies is that, in the five years since I took it, it really has become to a great extent an exam,...

It always was an exam, even when it wasn't.

 

[TSandM]

I think people take the classes because they like what they hear or read about GUE's approach to diving, or because they have had a chance to dive with some GUE-trained people and liked what they saw.


Your point about getting the training to pass the class the first time around is why GUE came up with the Primer. So you now take a class to prepare you to take the class that prepared you for the technical classes . . . Go figure.

Regarding computer redundancy, gauges are a team resource. If yours goes down, you manage the ascent on the gauges from the rest of your team. A lot of things in DIR diving are like that. The decisions about what gear is needed are often based on the fundamental idea that the team WILL stay together, which is why situational awareness and TEAM are probably the most heavily emphasized things in DIR training.

 

[TSandM]

It always was an exam, even when it wasn't.

Well, if that's the case, it was an exam my classmates and I barely got started on!

 

[AndyNZ]

Yes. I really think the biggest problem with Fundies is that, in the five years since I took it, it really has become to a great extent an exam, rather than a class. This is a product of the fact that many people take it, not for the skills, but for the access to higher classes, and they can't afford not to pass the first time through.

I see what you are saying, so basically its become a label to obtain higher degrees of training? If that is the case, then wouldn't it be more beneficial to obtain the training prior to pass the class the first time, especially when one is trying to obtain higher training in the GUE program?

Fundies is definitely becoming a bit of a "problem". The attitude that you "have to pass" does come from the community - most, if not all, GUE instructors are trying to dampen that down a bit and get the message across that it is a class where you learn stuff - not where you have to show that you can do it.

But how do 60 or instructors fight the rising tide of the internet? All King Canute analogies are entirely appropriate!

We have a situation where divers desperately need to do Fundies to improve some fairly fundamental gaps in their diving skills and attitude... they all want to do it, but don't consider themselves "ready" for it. To the point where at least one of them is considering doing TDI Decompression Procedures to learn more about diving twin tanks and deco theory so that they are "ready for Fundies".

WTF?

This attitude is completely ar$e backwards, Fundies is a great opportunity to learn what you need to learn. Personally, I think the mentoring aspects of the DIR community are best focused after Fundies.

One other comment, private tuition to prepare for Fundies is a bit of an oxymoron - how do you prepare for team-oriented diving on your own???

 

[mikemill]

Fundies is definitely becoming a bit of a "problem". The attitude that you "have to pass" does come from the community - most, if not all, GUE instructors are trying to dampen that down a bit and get the message across that it is a class where you learn stuff - not where you have to show that you can do it.

But how do 60 or instructors fight the rising tide of the internet? All King Canute analogies are entirely appropriate!

We have a situation where divers desperately need to do Fundies to improve some fairly fundamental gaps in their diving skills and attitude... they all want to do it, but don't consider themselves "ready" for it. To the point where at least one of them is considering doing TDI Decompression Procedures to learn more about diving twin tanks and deco theory so that they are "ready for Fundies".

WTF?

This attitude is completely ar$e backwards, Fundies is a great opportunity to learn what you need to learn. Personally, I think the mentoring aspects of the DIR community are best focused after Fundies.

One other comment, private tuition to prepare for Fundies is a bit of an oxymoron - how do you prepare for team-oriented diving on your own???

Well the class itself is a little intimidating in regards to length and cost. If you don't have a local instructor you are looking at doing it 5 days back to back at a cost of $700 + cost of getting the instructor out there. I can easily see how people get focused on the pass and not on the learning. I don't know about anyone else but taking the majority of personal vacation a year to take a class like that just ain't gonna fly.

For me, I'd favor doing in smaller chucks. For one thing I'm not sure I could do 5 days of back to back cold water diving. Hell after Essentials I was exhausted and that was only 3 days. Luckily there are instructors local enough that I don't have to do it back to back.