Tec Instructor Recommendation - Ontario Canada

[jstrang]

Good to know. Plan right now is to get more deep water experience with a side mount config over the next year and then look to do the course then. Not to mention we just got drysuits so I need to master that well.

Sounds like a good plan! We all tend to be biased that they way we do/did things is the best way.

At the end of the day if you want to be a better diver it is probably most important that you dive a lot. A drysuit and comfort in the local Great Lakes will certainly make it easier to dive here around Ontario.

Good luck with your training and diving.

 

[kensuf]

The doesn't mean you can't learn from an instructor close by, but doing AN/DP in open water doesn't prepare you for doing deco in a cave. There's an important distinction that has real world consequences if done incorrectly. That type of experience is something you want to tap into. That's just one example, but there are plenty of others. In the same vein, going to a cave instructor isn't going to prepare you the same way for doing a deep wreck in the Atlantic. While I'm a firm believer that cave-trained divers make better wreck divers, there are unique challenges in wreck diving that cave training do not prepare you for.

It's important that your training goals mirror your non-training goals. I find having an instructor who is doing the dives you want to do is highly beneficial in helping achieve your goals.

I'm probably quoting this out of context, but I think the exact opposite is true. Deco in a cave is pretty much dead nuts simple for the majority of cave diving versus deco in open water. Most people find it significantly easier to drop off the deco bottle at the beginning of the dive, pick it up on the way out, and hang out on a log (or rock shelf) at 20' than carrying the bottle the entire time and performing deco while drifting along managing a lift bag/SMB in blue water.

When I teach AN/DP I make my students practice blue water deco's (even if Hudson isn't really blue) for this reason.

 

[JohnnyC]

I'm probably quoting this out of context, but I think the exact opposite is true. Deco in a cave is pretty much dead nuts simple for the majority of cave diving versus deco in open water. Most people find it significantly easier to drop off the deco bottle at the beginning of the dive, pick it up on the way out, and hang out on a log (or rock shelf) at 20' than carrying the bottle the entire time and performing deco while drifting along managing a lift bag/SMB in blue water.

When I teach AN/DP I make my students practice blue water deco's (even if Hudson isn't really blue) for this reason.

Slightly out of context, but your insight is always beneficial. The cave deco thing is just one example.

Cave diving does have the potential for some unique deco situations that aren't covered in a normal AN/DP course. A diver wanting to go in that direction would be better served taking the course with an instructor that has experience with those unique situations who is able to impart their wisdom onto the subject. With a cave dictating your profile, there are some considerations that won't even be on the radar of an open water technical instructor, because by-and-large open water deco is always the same framework. The same can't always be said for a cave, hence courses like "Technical Cave Diver" dealing directly with cave deco.

Anyway, just one example where there's greater benefit going with an instructor who is more familiar with all aspects of the diving you want to do.

 

[rjack321]

Anyway, just one example where there's greater benefit going with an instructor who is more familiar with all aspects of the diving you want to do.

Over the years I have found that the buddies who've done courses with more than one instructor turn out to be the most versatile. The start to finish divers with one shop/instructor tend (as you might expect) to not be that worldly. I know I've had at least a half dozen different "tech" instructors (deco, cave, CCR classes). Some were better than others but I got something out of all of them.

 

[abnfrog]

I agree I tell my students take course from other instructors ..then compare all the facets of each ,for the most part it DOES make them a better diver an informed student is my best friend ....that is why I tell my dive masters also work with as many other instructors as you can

 

[Doppler]

... but doing AN/DP in open water doesn't prepare you for doing deco in a cave.

I am genuinely interested in your thoughts concerning why "doing [staged decompression] in open water doesn't prepare you for doing deco in a cave."

I teach both, and while I would agree that becoming a decompression diver is vastly different to becoming a cave diver, the actual practical application of the techniques that will help to keep one "safe" are precisely the same regardless of the application.

And to clarify -- because I am not sure your post made this clear -- a cave-diving course (RAID Cave 2, TDI Full Cave, etc.) requires the candidate to be certified as a decompression diver... of whatever stripe.

 

[rjack321]

I am genuinely interested in your thoughts concerning why "doing [staged decompression] in open water doesn't prepare you for doing deco in a cave."

I teach both, and while I would agree that becoming a decompression diver is vastly different to becoming a cave diver, the actual practical application of the techniques that will help to keep one "safe" are precisely the same regardless of the application.

What I suspect @JohnnyC is getting at for instance:
In OW, when diving a single deco many divers bring EAN50 and you can basically do a direct or near direct ascent to that when you decide to leave.
Using EAN50 for most novice/entry level cave deco dives would be very rare

In OW you can chose your deco depth
Usually but not always in a cave, sometimes you're forced deeper or even to skip over a depth, ie do enough time at 40ft so you don't have to do the horrible 30ft stop and can go right to 20ft.

 

[abnfrog]

I agree with steve , I am not a cave instructor but deco is deco (with the added cave /overhead issues ) ..........I thought you were not a tdi instructor any more steve ? what cave certs are you doing ?...

 

[Doppler]

I agree with steve , I am not a cave instructor but deco is deco (with the added cave /overhead issues ) ..........I thought you were not a tdi instructor any more steve ? what cave certs are you doing ?...

I've been teaching cave through RAID for the past three years or so. And you are correct, I'm no longer associated with TDI. Earlier this summer, I stepped into Paul Toomer's old job as Director Diver Training for Raid International as he accepted the position of President for the company.

 

[abnfrog]

cool............., you should contact raid tell them to upgrade their website , they have a facility that has been closed down for years still on there , and other info not up to date ...