Staying in Sharm

[simonspear]

Hi all

I've not posted on SB for some time now, but wanted to ask some opinions/advice etc on Sharm for those who have been staying/living there recently. We are thinking of taking a year out and spending some time in Egypt and using it as a base to explore a little further afield. We have somewhere to stay in Nabq and we are not looking to work, although I'll want to get our children into school (Sharm British Int School looks fairly promising for that). We will be over in April for a 2 week recce, but probably not looking to move until late 13/early 14.

Our main aim is to get in some diving and relax a little. Both myself and my wife Zoe are DM's and she is particularly interested in doing her IDC and I'll probably join her for the training. We are both experienced travelers and experienced divers and we have dived quite a bit in Egypt in the past. I was in the Sinai as far back as the late 80's so I saw Dahab and Sharm when they were just desert and a couple of shacks!

Ok so here are some questions!

1. Anywhere you can shore dive just hiring tanks and weights? I'm a cameraman and always find it better to be away from the crowds when I'm filming. Obviously that's not possible in Egypt on the busy day boat sites, but I was wondering if there were any possibilities for this shore diving? Any way we can register with CDWS and go do our own thing?

2. Although we are not looking for work, it might be nice for Zoe especially to occasionally do some guiding or training after she has completed her instructors. Any chance of that happening on an adhoc basis with the current economic climate in Sharm?

3. Any general tips on staying/living in sharm or a good resource on where to find some would be really appreciated.

4. With DM/Instructors certs are there any concessions on diving costs if we are not actively working? (keeping in mind that we'll be doing a lot of diving over at least 6 months and probably at least a year).

I'm sure there were lots more questions when I sat down to write this, but my mind has gone blank. I'll add more as/when I remember! Thanks for your help everyone.

Cheers, Simon

 

[String]

1. Anywhere you can shore dive just hiring tanks and weights?

Some hotels and house reefs will allow you to do that. Best to email a few centres in advance (the bigger name ones). You *might* get lucky and be allowed off a boat but maybe not

I'm a cameraman and always find it better to be away from the crowds when I'm filming. Obviously that's not possible in Egypt on the busy day boat sites, but I was wondering if there were any possibilities for this shore diving? Any way we can register with CDWS and go do our own thing?

Pretty much no. Forget the CDWS, they say they're in charge, the Egyptian Diving & Life saving federation say they're not. The government doesn't "know". They spend a lot of money advertising but in reality are worthless and so inherently corrupt forget it. You cant register as a guide without a letter of appointment, work permit and so on.

*HOWEVER* nowhere does egyptian law state you must have an in-water guide. The DM has to be on site to provide a brief, logistics and first aid support nothing more so you are quite entitled to dive as an independent pair (or solo IF you have the required cert and redundancy gas etc) so a good centre will let you go unguided off the beach and a good boat guide will let you dive as a pair off the boat without having to play follow the leader.
Avoid any centre that tells you that there must be a guide in the water - this simply isn't correct.

2. Although we are not looking for work, it might be nice for Zoe especially to occasionally do some guiding or training after she has completed her instructors. Any chance of that happening on an adhoc basis with the current economic climate in Sharm?

Unlikely to be honest. Sharm in particular the boat permissions need the staff licences on the paperwork and so on so you cant just turn up and guide like you can elsewhere really. They do also occasionally do boat and shore centre work permit blitzes.

3. Any general tips on staying/living in sharm or a good resource on where to find some would be really appreciated.

Sharm is a big place so need to be more specific where you're staying or renting. The obvious things like the main tourist bars/restaurants in na'ama are expensive, other places aren't etc but nothing specific. Sharm isn't the cheapest place to survive.

4. With DM/Instructors certs are there any concessions on diving costs if we are not actively working? (keeping in mind that we'll be doing a lot of diving over at least 6 months and probably at least a year).

For that time period maybe yes. You might get 10% (everyone gets if asked) initially.

Best bet is to find a centre, "befriend it" and just dive through there and get to know them. After a while you might be helping out or get comp'd diving and so on. Pick a decent centre though as there are lots of cowboy ones out there (CDWS membership and stickers mean nothing as to the quality of the outfit).

Are you actually hell-set on Sharm or willing to consider Dahab? It's quieter, mainly shore diving so independent diving for photography is far easier to manage, cost of living is cheaper and so on. Everything there is a little more "unofficial".

 

[Crowley]

I agree with a lot of String's comments - speaking as somebody who has been here 4 years and just left, here are my own thoughts:

1. Anywhere you can shore dive just hiring tanks and weights? I'm a cameraman and always find it better to be away from the crowds when I'm filming. Obviously that's not possible in Egypt on the busy day boat sites, but I was wondering if there were any possibilities for this shore diving? Any way we can register with CDWS and go do our own thing?

Yes and No. Most of Sharm, unlike Dahab, is inaccessible from Shore, unless you are diving with dive centre that has a base in a hotel on the shore. You will need to approach the centre for permission to do this. You can access Ras Mohamed National park by car and dive from the shore, but most centres will not simply allow you to rent tanks and tootle off with them on your own. As String says, you will need to befriend a dive centre, prove that you can dive independently without a guide, look after their tanks, etc. It's possible, but you're going to have to jump through some hoops and make a lot of friends to do it. Dahab is much more accessible from the shore, as per String's advice.

2. Although we are not looking for work, it might be nice for Zoe especially to occasionally do some guiding or training after she has completed her instructors. Any chance of that happening on an adhoc basis with the current economic climate in Sharm?

Very, very little, I'm afraid. To guide on a boat you need a CDWS card. To get a CDWS card you need a work permit. To get a work permit you need sponsorship from a dive centre. It is possible to get work permits individually, but I believe it's very expensive. The centre where your partner does her IDC may allow her to continue on as a "trainee" should they need some shore diving guides or instructors, but priority will of course be given to regular staff. Having said that, a lot of staff are leaving, and if business picks up, there may be some opportunity. Bear in mind also that it us unlikely that a dive centre is going to accept a member of staff who wants to only work on the odd occasion when they are available - priority will always go to the people who are available full-time for work. Languages, however, are invaluable, and if you speak German, Russian, Italian, Dutch, Spanish, French, Polish or Japanese, the dive centre might keep that person under consideration.

3. Any general tips on staying/living in sharm or a good resource on where to find some would be really appreciated.

Feel free to ask me anything you like in PM - also there are several Sharm Facebook pages you might find useful. I have to say I am biased a bit because I got a bit fed up with Sharm (as have a lot of people); the cost of living is steadily increasing, a lot of my friends left, I became very unhappy here, etc. No real problems with the dive centre I worked for, but overall, I did not want to stay in Sharm.

4. With DM/Instructors certs are there any concessions on diving costs if we are not actively working? (keeping in mind that we'll be doing a lot of diving over at least 6 months and probably at least a year).

Maybe - but only if you stick with the same centre, all the time. As per String's post - 10% would be the norm, and maybe some free house-reef diving, if the centre has a house-reef, that is. The normal procedure would be to offer a discount for repeat business, which usually means you pay full-price for the first holiday, then 10% next time you visit. If you're staying here and diving regularly, most dive centres would probably offer you some sort of deal.

I'm sure there were lots more questions when I sat down to write this, but my mind has gone blank. I'll add more as/when I remember! Thanks for your help everyone.

Cheers, Simon

As I say - feel free to ask questions, and good luck!

Cheers

C.

 

[simonspear]

Hi String & Crowley

Thanks for the responses. We're not 100% set on Sharm and if it was just the two of us we'd probably jump for Dahab, but with a family we need at least some infrastructure that other resorts possibly don't have. I still need to go back to the UK for a few days each month so being near the airport is a huge plus and I've heard Sharm is pretty secure right now where the rest of the Sinai is a little bit more wild west at the moment. There is still plenty of time to plan and even change our plans entirely if we need to and there are lots of options out there.

There is a good chance that I'm going to be running some filming courses, so I do need a dive centre to partner up with on that for on and offshore facilities. Just trying to get a feel for things right now so basically find a decent operator, get to know them and see where that leads. Thanks for the advice!

Cheers, Simon

(If anyone knows of a company that would be open to negotiations then please feel free to PM me if you don't feel comfortable posting in public).

 

[String]

We're not 100% set on Sharm and if it was just the two of us we'd probably jump for Dahab, but with a family we need at least some infrastructure that other resorts possibly don't have.

What sort of infrastructure are you after? Dahab isn't exactly the middle of nowhere. It's got most things you need to survive (unless you class nightclubs as critical infrastructure). There are English schools, supermarkets, bars, restaurants and so on. Yes if you want some specific imported goods its a trip to sharm on the other hand its not far. Dahab is exactly 50 mins from Sharm airport so not exactly a long way (and you can be 20-30 mins if you're living in some areas of sharm to get there). You can rent cars, use the bus and so on or get a taxi for about 150LE to the airport for several people. Quite a few ex pat families with kids live there.

With the filming you may well run into the CDWS/lack of a work permit problem especially in Sharm. Quite simply to get on a boat it'll need a guide with the paperwork. There is a maximum ratio now so don't think you can sneak in as a customer on the manifest if its a busy time. Shore diving its easier especially as a lot of the sites dont have checkpoints or require permissions to be checked. As with anything there is always a risk, its relatively low but they do have the occasional 2-3 day clamp down before getting bored again. (And obviously 100% of the police are easily bribed but these days they stand an equal chance of beating you). If i was running courses (i do some photography ones) for me shore diving and an easily accessible house reef of a shallow depth is pretty much my top choice as it allows people to get in/out when needed and stay as long as they want without worrying about boat schedules (which for good reason are very strict in sharm).

Security wise the resorts of Sharm, Dahab, Taba are all as secure as each other. Some lapses in all of them (the odd kidnapping, the occasional drive by shooting as per sharm etc) but generally the resorts and the main road connecting them are classed as safe so provided you don't stray from that i wouldnt let security or not be a deciding factor.

I do know of several existing photographers and videographers around the area who might not take too kindly to someone else arriving with no permits running unofficial courses so you might want to be a little bit careful there.

Good luck anyway, like Crowley above i've just left after 4 years there and know a large number of colleagues who have done the same. *IF* business picks up there might be job opportunities but depending when you think of moving remember winter is the dead period, months of very little work between december and easter.

 

[simonspear]

Hi String

Thanks for the info.

I knew Dahab had changed but got to admit that I hadn't realised that it had changed as much as you describe. The last time I was there I watched a herd of Donkeys destroy about half of the beachfront, so I obviously have rose coloured spectacles on! 50mins from the airport you say? Wow I remember it taking a few hours. We are over in April so we are going to head up to Dahab for a look.

Like I said we're not looking to work more just looking for something to do to keep occupied a little, but I'd be surprised if there could be any complications with the courses I'm thinking of. They'd hardly be PADI specialities and there are lots of countries where I could run them quite happily if it is a problem in Egypt. Still thanks for the heads up.

I know what you mean about places and people changing as it's a fact of expat life to a certain extent. People move on, where you have been happy doesn't feel the same anymore, you need/want/feel like a change. Happens over and over again and it is best just to move on when it gets to that point. Hope you find somewhere else that works for you!

Cheers, Simon

 

[String]

The Dahab "beachfront" you know probably doesn't exist any more. Its pretty much 100% restuarants now ranging from eel garden right the way down to Islands (so 2-3 miles). Pretty much no beach left anywhere in town although past there Lagoona is an excellent place to sit and relax to kill a day. That said, there've been land grabs and two opportunist bedouin partitioning the beach there as well now...

Pretty much if you're running courses and making money off them you need a work permit (which as Crowley described is either hard to get or just really expensive. My last sponsored one cost me near £800 and the individual one is 4-5x that).

To put it bluntly Egypt fell apart after the revolution and now the corruption is worse than ever, a complete lack of law and order means things are getting trashed, attitudes to foreigners and many other things have changed. There is a MASSIVE drop off in tourist numbers and well established centres are closing. The place was FAR better off from a tourism and economy point of view before the revolution.

50 mins to Sharm airport is pretty much all the time. I used to make the run regularly. I lived in Dahab for 3 years then Nuweiba for 1 year after that but also had to do some work, meetings and so on in sharm.

Either way, good luck finding places.

 

[Hi_PPO2]

Hi Simon,

I have lived in Dahab for 12 years and like the Guys above have said times are not what they were but it is still a fantastic place to live ..

As far as it being lawless that is just not true..

I live here with my wife and 6 year old daughter and if I thought that there was the remotest possibility that they were in any danger here I would be on the first plane out of here.

Regarding finding work, there is not as much around as there used to be but if you are willing to put in the effort you can always find it and to be completely honest if you are planning to make your fortune then the diving industry is not the place to be ...How ever if its about life style then Dahab is a fantastic place to be.
I have a small dive centre on the beach Dahab Hotels|Dahab Diving if you have any questions regarding Dahab or how things work here PM me and I am more than happy to answer them.

Cheers,

Paul.