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So, Will Shearwater offer Gas Integration

Discussion in 'Shearwater Research' started by guyharrisonphoto, Nov 14, 2014.

  1. Seya

    Seya DIR Practitioner

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    Your right that's why you have redundant back ups
    And a solid dive plan
    Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk
     
  2. kr2y5

    kr2y5 Solo Diver

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    What you write is very much true, complexity generally makes things less robust, and should be avoided like a plague. On the other hand, the same can be said about adding a compass to the Petrel, and nobody is reacting quite as hysterically to it as the anti-AI crowd is reacting to the mere thought of embedding another sensor...
     
    scubadada and Omisson like this.
  3. kelemvor

    kelemvor Big Fleshy Monster ScubaBoard Supporter

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    Probably irrelevant to the discussion but as a card carrying geek I feel the need to point out that computers forge computer chips, not humans. Humans do design them as far as I know. Keep one eye open just in case I'm wrong about that last part.

    ---------- Post added November 18th, 2014 at 09:07 PM ----------

    Seems like a lot of conjecture without detailed internal logging. Which, btw there is absolutely NO reason any dive computer should not be capable of maintaining detailed operation and audit logging of its-self. Solid state storage is so tiny and cheap a DC could probably output detailed debug logs to a reasonably dense 2mm flash wafer for a year with room to spare. Things like real time readings from all sensors, error states of the chips, etc. All those are very reasonable to log.

    But, such detailed operational logging is not really a "sales" point. So far it's not been required as the result of any laws our judgements. Therefore it doesn't exist. If I'm wrong and it does exist, there should be no doubt about the accuracy of your assertion.
     
  4. Dr. Lecter

    Dr. Lecter Solo Diver

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    I dive with two Shearwaters, one of which is wired into my CCR, plus another pO2 monitor wired into a separate set of cells. I use all of them, and trust none of them.
     
  5. kelemvor

    kelemvor Big Fleshy Monster ScubaBoard Supporter

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    Why not wire the other petrel into the second monitor?
     
  6. Dr. Lecter

    Dr. Lecter Solo Diver

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    My backup deco and backup pO2 systems remain fully redundant this way. It sacrifices some deco accuracy since it's a fixed set point, but I'm not concerned about that. And if somehow both my Shearwaters are somehow compromised (by something like a bad firmware bug) I can still fly the unit home on tables, an analog gauge I carry, my watch, and the revodream.
     
  7. pensacolaracer

    pensacolaracer Solo Diver

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    Unless you've done some reconfiguring, you can't wire **** into your petrel even if you wanted to.... Last time I saw it, it was a stand alone. :)
     
  8. Dr. Lecter

    Dr. Lecter Solo Diver

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    When I need to buy an EXT, I know who to talk to :D
     
    Seya likes this.
  9. tbone1004

    tbone1004 ScubaBoard Supporter ScubaBoard Supporter

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    divecan was asked about.
    CAN bus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    works just like that. Each function has its own module that then sends the data out to the main controller and any monitor. For AI they would simply have a digital pressure gauge somewhere in the head, then that would output to the controller or monitor. Same as the O2 controllers, instead of one little analog wire going out for each output, it has a core group of cables that send the data digitally out to the controllers. Identical to how airplanes and cars operate now. Much more reliable system and easy to diagnose issues with it. The AI chip would be a nonissue, but it wouldn't require any change to the controller or monitors other than a firmware update to read the data coming out and display it somewhere. Putting a wireless receiver in the computer itself would be identical for wireless AI if they could get it to function properly with bluetooth since the computer already has it. Unfortunately bluetooth is a battery hog and doesn't have a reliable enough range underwater, so it's not going to happen. The development cost to design a proper AI transmitter is a lot more than a lot of people seem to be thinking, it's not quite as simple as it looks and the ceramic pressure sensors aren't cheap to purchase and since Shearwaters target audience would never buy them *CCR and tech divers*, there's no point in them investing in it, regardless of how big the recreational market is. The Predator and Petrel were successful enough to the point that they released the recreational nitrox mode for the Petrel, but I don't think you'll be seeing much if anything else oriented specifically at the recreational market, especially since that would detract from their CCR development.
     
  10. Lorenzoid

    Lorenzoid idling in neutral buoyancy

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    Just because no one can point to an example does not mean it hasn't occurred. Is every instance in which a failure occurred reported on the Internet? Maybe someone didn't interpret a failure for what it was--mistook a failure for a valid reading. Not every failure may present itself on the display in a way that someone clearly knows it's a failure. It's not like when a failure occurs the display necessary goes blank or shows an error reading or whatever. In some cases, yes, but not necessarily in all cases.

    There is no such evidence. What there is is an absence of evidence. From an absence of evidence, we can't draw any conclusion. So it does not seem unreasonable that some of us are concerned that every additional feature can increase the likelihood that something will fail to operate in the intended way at some point.

    Right. The question is just how much effort/expense Shearwater or any other dive computer manufacturer is going to put into such testing. I used to work in the aerospace field, and as you know, the hardware and software involved was priced way way above what could be considered "consumer electronics." The simpler they keep the hardware and software of a dive computer, the more I'm inclined to believe in its robustness, i.e., that it's been thoroughly tested under all possible sets of conditions and is capable of dealing with it all. I realize that at its price point this is a bit much to expect, but I like to believe a Shearwater computer is more like instrumentation than consumer electronics.
     
    rhwestfall likes this.

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