runsongas
Contributor
were both adjusted to the same ip and cracking pressure? i only feel a small difference between my hog/dr/zeagle/apeks regs after adjusting them to the same ip and cracking.
SM regs: XTX50 vs Dive Rite vs ??
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When I buy something new, I don't expect to need to run to another shop so they can adjust it.
So no, I received my toys, took them for a dive, and they clearly were outmatched by the Apeks reg I have (which also was factory tuned). Whether DR/DGX should have done in, or should have told me to do it, is not really my problem after that. Actually when DGX says "Assembled, tested and shipped to you ready-to-dive", then I really expect to be able to just hop in and dive.
So no, I received my toys, took them for a dive, and they clearly were outmatched by the Apeks reg I have (which also was factory tuned). Whether DR/DGX should have done in, or should have told me to do it, is not really my problem after that. Actually when DGX says "Assembled, tested and shipped to you ready-to-dive", then I really expect to be able to just hop in and dive.
runsongas
Contributor
clearly they were ready to dive because you did just that. if you are going to fault the performance of the dive rites, you have to compare them on an even playing field. factory tuning is variable and can not always be relied on.
Well no, the "even playing field" is how the average customer can use it, which is exactly what I did. Buy it, go dive. If the normal steps of use were "buy it, go have some other shop tune it (or do it yourself), then go diving", sure. But that's not how it goes, a reg is not something that has to be tuned to a specific person. If you buy a harness, of course you have to adjust it because it adjusts to your body, a reg doesn't do that, a reg has a given IP and a given cracking pressure, which can and should be set at the factory. The customer is simply expected to put that thing in his mouth and breathe, at least on this side of the world, and in Oz they had the same view on it.
not to stray too far off topic but......it is a valid point that when people compare regs and have an obvious preference due to its performance, it can often be attributed to the fact that the regs were not set properly. or at least not set for "optimum" performance.
i myself have purchased many regs from online dealers and simply used them straight out of the box. usually with no problem. but that is not always the case. my scubapro mk25/s600 for example are noted as one of the premier regs out there. but one of the two regs i purchased last year breathed totally different then the other.
so to the OP......i believe you mentioned you were buying from your local dive shop ? my advise to anyone is to make sure you have your shop bench test the new regs to ensure the first and second stages are adjusted to factory specs. that is one of the advantages of buying from a LDS.
btw patoux01......some divers do actually have their own preferred reg settings. for example, when diving in very cold water i know some divers that "detune" the first stages a bit. and when it comes to setting up your alternate second stage, some like it set the same as the primary, while others prefer it set a bit stiffer. now if you have an adjustable second stage the diver can do that easily enough themselves. but not all regs have that option. especially most alternate regs used in single tank diving.
i myself have purchased many regs from online dealers and simply used them straight out of the box. usually with no problem. but that is not always the case. my scubapro mk25/s600 for example are noted as one of the premier regs out there. but one of the two regs i purchased last year breathed totally different then the other.
so to the OP......i believe you mentioned you were buying from your local dive shop ? my advise to anyone is to make sure you have your shop bench test the new regs to ensure the first and second stages are adjusted to factory specs. that is one of the advantages of buying from a LDS.
btw patoux01......some divers do actually have their own preferred reg settings. for example, when diving in very cold water i know some divers that "detune" the first stages a bit. and when it comes to setting up your alternate second stage, some like it set the same as the primary, while others prefer it set a bit stiffer. now if you have an adjustable second stage the diver can do that easily enough themselves. but not all regs have that option. especially most alternate regs used in single tank diving.
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@Johanan most all sealed diaphragm first stages are overbalanced. I don't believe it has much if any of a benefit if the regulator is tuned properly and it just puts the reg at higher risk of freeflow when you go real deep with them.
@Patoux01 regs absolutely have to be tuned to a specific person and there is a lot of thought that goes into how a manufacturer will tune their regulators. You may want them to be tuned light, but that puts them at high risk of freeflow. Many divers can accept that, many more won't. If you bought your XTX's locally and they tuned it before sale, that is not necessarily a fair comparison when evaluating performance of the two regulators.
@Patoux01 regs absolutely have to be tuned to a specific person and there is a lot of thought that goes into how a manufacturer will tune their regulators. You may want them to be tuned light, but that puts them at high risk of freeflow. Many divers can accept that, many more won't. If you bought your XTX's locally and they tuned it before sale, that is not necessarily a fair comparison when evaluating performance of the two regulators.
This is a good thread, covering several topics and very good advice overall.
I have had a change to dive the above regs and agree individual tuning makes all the difference when comparing. I like mine detuned a bit, so they are all pretty much the same on performance. Ive even thought when servicing my hogs there are bits that were machined and finished better than apeks. I haven't had to service dr, so can't comment on the insides.
SM is indeed very individual as well and can be mission specific. I've tried many configurations, most have worked, some better than others. And now have settled on the way I was trained in Mexico. It all made sense, had solid reasoning behind it, and worked exceptionally well in that environment and in my own, great lakes and quarry.
I have been diving apeks for over 20 years because I have access and know how to service them. That has determined my choice as much as the ruggedness of them. So get something you can get good service locally and you won't go wrong. And if you want to service your own, DR, hog and deep6 are good choices.
If you can get good service on apeks, just get another one. And save your legend for singles. If you need redundancy on a dive just run SM.
If I was running caves everyday I would definitely get a d3 or deep 6 for the rotating turret on my long hose. Reasoning is if you are constantly handing off your long hose, it's an extra step to rotate the apeks back around to donate . But otherwise I'll stick with apeks.
I have had a change to dive the above regs and agree individual tuning makes all the difference when comparing. I like mine detuned a bit, so they are all pretty much the same on performance. Ive even thought when servicing my hogs there are bits that were machined and finished better than apeks. I haven't had to service dr, so can't comment on the insides.
SM is indeed very individual as well and can be mission specific. I've tried many configurations, most have worked, some better than others. And now have settled on the way I was trained in Mexico. It all made sense, had solid reasoning behind it, and worked exceptionally well in that environment and in my own, great lakes and quarry.
I have been diving apeks for over 20 years because I have access and know how to service them. That has determined my choice as much as the ruggedness of them. So get something you can get good service locally and you won't go wrong. And if you want to service your own, DR, hog and deep6 are good choices.
If you can get good service on apeks, just get another one. And save your legend for singles. If you need redundancy on a dive just run SM.
If I was running caves everyday I would definitely get a d3 or deep 6 for the rotating turret on my long hose. Reasoning is if you are constantly handing off your long hose, it's an extra step to rotate the apeks back around to donate . But otherwise I'll stick with apeks.
OP
That's what I think I'm going to do - get another XTX50. I would end up getting another reg set for pony as I want to have that for when I dive single tank BM. Still will work out cheaper.
ams511
Contributor
The XTX came in a sealed (blister) box, the DR came in "tested and ready to dive". Neither have freeflowed since I have them, but then again, I've only managed a freeflow once and it was almost on purpose.
To me, a "sidemount" reg would do just fine on a pony. There's just a spare inflator hose, which I often carry anyway because of the switches between dry and wetsuit, no big deal. On the pony I'd want the SPG and a 2nd stage, which are present on any reg of your sidemount rig. So technically there's no need for yet another reg after a 2nd xtx50.
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