Should I get PADI-certified?

[glbirch]

I've used my ACUC card for over ten years now at home and abroad, and never had a problem. Figure I'm good for anywhere. (Except maybe Quebec?)

 

[Cudabait]

I am currently CMAS **. There is an agreement between my agency and PADI, and I could get AOW quite easaily with few additional check dives and (a lot of?) $$$. I intend to dive abroad in an unknown future. Is it useful to get also PADi certified?

Hey B,

I hold certs from different agencies. Unless you are planning to go into instruction, I would hang tight with you CMAS cert.

Check this out & compare: www.exler.de/padicmas.htm.

Regards,

 

[Paul Evans]

... The vast majority of operators anywhere in the world will take any card!!!! This is not a troll!!!!!!!, They, like PADI want your money, if you can prove (by a card!!!) you can dive , You will dive.

IMO, stick with CMAS, IF YOU HAVE A GOOD INSTUCTOR.
Sorry i know this is shouting out loud but,

The bottem line is not the agency, but the Quality of instruction that counts, CMAS have higher (IMO) training standards than PADI, Please note i have nothing to gain from this, I was originally and still am (thanks to my instructors) still PADI trained! How far the instructor goes past what PADI teaches is up to them!!, If you get a very good one then, IMO, it does'nt matter which agency you train with.

 

[MikeFerrara]

... The vast majority of operators anywhere in the world will take any card!!!! This is not a troll!!!!!!!, They, like PADI want your money, if you can prove (by a card!!!) you can dive , You will dive.

.

It wouldn't surprise me.

A good freind of mine claims to have been certified back in the 70's through an agency that I've never heard of. He also lost the card many years ago.

he's taken a dive trip every few years all along. They ask and he tells em he's certified but doesn't have a card and he's never been denied access to diving.

A couple years ago he took a class from me and really does have a card now.

 

[Paul Evans]

Sorry but the truth hurts :11:

 

[Damselfish]

Lots of talk about training quality here, but if the issue is whether you might run into someplace unfamiliar with CMAS that won't accept it, the training is irrelevant. If you run into someplace they have no clue what CMAS is, they won't know anything about the training either. Don't know how likely that is though.

 

[Diver0001]

I know that the PADI card is almost useless in France, I was just wondering if I dive abroad. From all the answers, it seems that not.

About what is required for certifications, I do not know if there are differences between the various agencies affiliated to CMAS. To get my 2*, I had
-to swim 500m withe weight suit, weight, fins, mask and snorkel
-to free dive to 5m deep, horizontally 10m then up with the same gear
-to swim 250m on snorkel but withh all scubagear on (full bottle, empty BC, so slightly negatively buoyant)
-to jump in water mask on hand (diving gear on), and have the mask properly put and empty when surfacing
-to be able to dive to 20m beside a line but without touching it, and staying neutral (almost) all way long, then stabilise 1M above the 20m floor
-to be able to go up from 20m deep at proper speed and stop at 3m without depth gauge or computer
-to remove mask and empty it at 20m depth, in 12 C water (my club requires that we pass the exam in cold water, but it is not required by CMAS)
-to be able to come back to surface from 10m without octopus, exhaling all long.
-exchange of signs at 20m depth, followed by proper reaction: I must be able to bring back safely to surface a buddy who has a problem and cannot handle it by himself -if he is still conscient and able to keep a regulator-octopus in mouth. ->management of 2BC at the same time To be able to bring back an unconscient one is next level.
-some orientation
-a lot of theory, on physics, physiology, diving accidents (causes, prevention, symptoms, treatment), deco procedures with tables, gear maintenance, french law on diving.

Some of these are reminders of 1* requirements, only done in harsher conditions, or deeper, or longer

I've seen some of the CMAS materials that they use in Holland and there's nothing in there in terms of theory that I don't recognise. Some of the skills (cesa, for example) are done differnently (for example deeper) than PADI would have you do them and some of the things are a little out dated in relation to modern thinking regarding deep air etc. The most obvious differences aren't really in the content itself but in the order of presentation. There must be differences in content too and I can think of a few minor examples but they're often "comfort" builders (swimming and watermanship requirements) as opposed to diving skills per se.

In terms of quality I can't speak to that. There seems to be huge differences in local practices. The BSAC, NOB and NELOS, to name a few seem to have very different approaches to dealing with their local conditions. Interestingly, the NELOS and NOB have very similar conditions to train in but their divers seem to act very differnently. The Dutch, being very cautious, have very few incidents and the Belgians lose a couple to Darwin every year from things like (but not limited to) diving on alcohol (it's utterly shocking how many Nelos divers I see doing this) and making stupid profiles to get their quota of deep dives in..... Last year a few died when they were washed out to sea in a force-10+ storm. In fact, one could argue based on this quota thing that the CMAS encourages (or even requires) divers to take unnecessary risks to meet their experience requirements for advancement, especially in relation to their deep air requirements. I think that's a valid concern but so is the fact that PADI requires almost no experience for advancement.... There must be a way in the middle somewhere.....

Another thing that I hear a lot of NOB divers complain about is that CMAS/NOB training can take a very long time. 6 months of training isn't particularly unusual to get a 1 star rating in Holland. One person I know has been working for 18 months on his 2-star and he assumes he will advance "this summer some time"...... PADI's "dive now" philosophy is perhaps the other end of the scale in that sense but what I find very surprising is a PADI OW diver doesn't look any different in the water than a (presumably much better prepared) NOB 1 star diver with a similar amount of experience. I also noticed the same thing about BSAC divers. I first dove with a group of BSAC divers (who I had previously assumed had some of the best training on the planet) a couple of years ago in Turkey and just couldn't see the difference. They were ok divers but I was expecting a world of difference and it just wasn't there.... I think part of the problem here might be that the CMAS training takes *so* long that people start thinking that it must be incredibly difficult and so they *make* it difficult for themselves, which blocks them from performing normally.

So.....that's a little long winded but I guess the bottom line comes down to what you hear all the time. Quality instruction is important. Agency isn't.

R..

 

[Bretagne]

About the time taken for training: it depends a lot of where you train. I have used 9 months for my 1* and 18 months for my 2*, but mostly because I live far from any OW possibility, + I had 3 kids at home and could not take week-end out easily (as they are grown kids and not babies, any people who takes care of them when my husband and me are away must be well prepared to act as a taxi - not a lot of volunteers except the grand-parents, but they are not always free). So a lot of the extra time was explicitely used to do things outside the standards, or to be more physically fit. We had time to work on signs and answer to them until it became automatic. I do not regret all this pool time, but I know that it is not necessary.

Come on now. None of the ten or so dive centers I dived with in France has ever even questioned my PADI card or those of my buddies. Is CMAS more respected in France: yes! Is PADI useless in France: absolutely not!

And it is completely illegal (as diving in structures like clubs or dive centers is heavily regulated by law). Nevertheless, I know that you are right, i should have said "almost useless for a french diver", it is well understandable that experienced divers who learned in other countries are not asked ro recertify! IMO, it is the law which is wrong, and not the dive centers. Nevertheless, would you have a serious problem, they could face strong legal difficulties.