Shark Attack - Fact

[adurso]

mRNA, one other thing, if it will put your mind at ease, my wife used to like to touch them, before we became more enlightened.....she used to scare the crap out of the poor things

and she never got bit, they wanted no parts of the touchy feely lady

 

[vladimir]

Well, thanks a lot guys for your replies.

Valdimir, you're right about statistics and we can't teach and give a lesson about every danger in our life. But I want you to have a look in this forum about a thread called "shark attack killed a diver".

They were saying the lady saw a big fish then she jump-off the boat to get closer which causes the attack.

Now, if we follow what you were saying by not teaching these stuff or if we consider it as a waste of time "for the instructor", I can't really see a waste of time in that but some of you could. However, if that lady was educated about this issue and about the danger of this big fish, would that have saved her life?

We can't say "she was stupid" no she was not. she wasn't educated about this type of marine animal. We can's assume everyone knows that playing with sharks is something dangerous unless we educate people about it.

Cheers

Sometimes we have to trust our instincts. I saw a picture yesterday of a woman being mauled by a polar bear in a zoo somewhere. She entered the enclosure and the bear did what predators do. Because so many divers encounter sharks with no bad result, many of us don't accord them the respect they deserve. But I think we all have an instinctive fear of them, and we should pay that some mind.

Is it a "waste of time"? As a math major, I took a Greek mythology course in college. I got an "A," and I still know a lot on the subject, particularly on the Ancient Greek's concept of the afterlife. Was it a waste of time? I certainly learned something, but I could have used my limited time in college to take any number of courses with more practical application. Learning about shark attack, for most people, does not have a practical application and will take time from other, more practical, learning. But if somebody is offering an eleven-week open-water course, maybe they should sneak it in towards the end.

 

[ptyx]

To be blunt:

If you see a shark - you're lucky: enjoy it. Whatever you do, as long as you don't panic or act stupid (aka try to ride the shark) - it won't make much difference and the shark will (unfortunately if you have a camera) go away. Even if you do panic you probably have a higher chance to die of AGE than because the shark attacks you.

If you are actually attacked by a shark, then... mostly you die - and whatever you do won't make much difference either.

That said, as a diver you have less chance of being attacked than being run over by a bus on the way to the boat. And since actually seeing a shark will increase the probability of being attacked about as much as seeing a bus increases the probability of being run over by one... stop worrying and enjoy diving?

(Seriously, why are people worried about sharks - but not about mountain lions and bears and snakes and lightning?)

 

[Diveralan]

AS a general rule sharks are not something most divers need to worry about. Most divers I know look forward to seeing sharks. In most areas you just don't see that many and the ones you do see are not a threat to divers.

I have a friend who is a professional underwater photographer, She has some great pictures of great whites. In order for to get these pictures she flew half way around the world, spent many thousands of dollars on shark encounter dive boats and it still took several days of chumming the water for her to get the pictures. Even in areas that are known for aggressive sharks, you just don't see that many.

Try and find some some diving friends with cameras. Ask to see all of their shark photos and try and get them to show you all of the photos not just the good ones. Most of the pictures will be of the tail end of the shark swimming in the other direction. Think about this. You are larger than many sharks, and you are making a lot of noise in the water breathing out of your regulator and sounding like Darth Vader. They don't want anything to do with you.

When I was in Galapagos and trying to get video of hammerheads I had to get down on the rock, be very still and wait for the shark to come to me, if I moved or even took a breath it would turn away an once.

Sharks are something to look forward to seeing. Don't do something stupid like carrying a stringer with fish on it or grabbing a shark by the tail and you have nothing to worry about.

Happy diving

 

[stadevene]

Personally....I think the woman who jumped into the water is just part of natural selection. Sorry if that's harsh, but it's my view. I don't understand how this woman, knowing it was a shark, would jump in or knowing it was some big fish would not stop to figure out what it was first. It's Darwin at work.

It's no different than where I come from where the tourists think they can pose for pictures with the nice furry bear or go up to the "deer" and try and pet them. They soon find the nice horse like deer, if they get close enough, has quite a kick.

Back on topic, I think if a new diver has a question about a predatory animal, they should seek out the answer. Like Luckydays I believe PADI does mention sharks in the OW course. Saving that do some research, email The Shark Research Institute, I know they have education packages. It was actually a very interesting observation Alex Antonio from SRI made on a Whale Shark trip I was on: There are over 6 billion people on the earth and easily 1 billion people live by the ocean. Of those billion, many millions of them are in the ocean every day, but yet we have a handful of shark attacks every year. Take away the attacks on abalone divers and spear fishermen and the numbers drop more.

Having seen sharks on dives, the majority will not come near you. The chances on an OW training dive where the students are likely in a shallow sandy bottom are incredibly small. I'm sure they have a greater likelihood of killing themselves by hitting their head falling on the boat. Others have given good advice, and from what I recall is straight out of the PADI manual.

Don't worry about the shark, worry about the drive to the dock.

 

[clifftondiver]

no, mRNA, that is NOT what I meant. Education is very valuable, it's what allowed us to leave the jungle. If you reread my post, I stated that instructors have a limited amount of time to present the required information. If shark attacks on divers were a common occurence, I'm sure they would be covered in class. The difference between an undergraduate or masters degree and an open-water scuba class is the amount of exposure students have to the instructor. If instructors had 4-5 years with open-water students I'm sure they'd cover shark attacks.

As it stands, common problems like free-flowing regulators (not an everyday occurence) and out-of-air situations (more common than they should be) are covered. I think if we were to do a study of diving-related deaths, we'd probably find that the majority are due more to poor cardiac health than any hyper-aggressive sea creature.

To sum it up, open water class keeps you from acting like a total dummy in the water, not prepare you for every single danger in the ocean. Besides, if a shark wants to eat you, it'll eat you. We are in their world, not ours.

 

[Walter]

The second problem with dive leaders and mainly with instructors is they don't teach this stuff in the open water course or even in the advance open water course.

I always include it in my beginning class. Most people are afraid of sharks and not to put their fears at ease by explaining how rare shark problems are as well as giving them some tools with which to deal with the unlikely problem is, in my opinion, irresponsible.

He was joking.

I suspect he was serious, but without explaining what it means to not act like prey, it's not terribly helpful. His clarification in a later post was, although I probably wouldn't have included the running with the bulls story at this point...

So what's wrong with answering the question about sharks?

It's very possible his instructor didn't know the answer.

There's a pretty good discussion about this topic already taking place here.


What I said over there is:

Sharks are looking for an easy meal. They don't want to work for it. They evaluate things and place them into 4 groups.

1. This something I can eat.

You don't want to be here. They will approach, sometimes circling, sometimes not. They will make contact, sometimes with a bump, sometimes with a bite. They will increase their speed and will often have jerky movements (they are normally very graceful). Sometimes they will arch their backs, lower their pectoral fins and move their jaws, sometimes not. I've been here, it's not fun. We usually put ourselves here because of poor choices. I know I put myself here because of poor choices I made (several of them).

Poor choices that put you in this category are:
. Swimming rapidly away (acting like prey)
. Surfacing (acting like you're injured and as easy target)
. Swimming with your hands (acting like you're injured and as easy target)

If you see these behaviors it is your job to convince them you do not fit into the "something I can eat" category.

2. I don't know what this is.

If you're a photographer, this is a great place to be. They will come in close for a better look. I've had this experience. As long as they don't put you in the first group, you're fine. They swim slowly and gracefully, they may circle, they may approach directly or they may start to circle then switch to a direct approach. Being vertical in the water can put you in this category. As they approach be ready to push them away with something, a camera, a spear gun, a stick, hands are a last choice, but better than getting bit. Usually, they will put you in the third category before they make contact. You can also try to make them think you belong in the last category by swimming right at them.

3. This is something I can't eat.

They ignore you. This is where divers are usually found. I've experienced this many times. Watch the shark, it is watching you, but pretent to ignore it.

4. This is something that might eat me.

They quickly leave. Swimming towards them will put you in this group. So will growling or making other loud aggressive sounding noises.



Turning loose speared fish is a bad idea.

 

[Johnoly]

...My issue is, if that doesn't happen in his entire life of diving like 25 or 30 yrs that DOES NOT RULE OUT the possibility of a shark attack.

You might want to get NACD certified.

 

[stevejaz]

I only have a few dives but tend to go to locations that have sharks Thus far I've seen, Lemon, Nurse, White tipped reef, and Black tipped Reef, all of which could have cared less that I was there.

As a matter of fact, my wife was a "victim" of the Jaws series. When she was young, she was deathly afraid of sharks, so much so she wouldn't take a bath, only showers...go figure. Anyway, prior to diving, she still had a very deep seated fear and will still flinch when she sees them on TV. She too has seen all the sharks I have diving and while she won't try to chase them down to take a picture, she is pretty at ease as she's seen first hand, they could really care less about us.

Here's a direct copy from PADI's Elearning course as to how to deal with equatic life.

 

[SharkDiver36]

I've had a fair amount of experience diving with sharks in open and confined water, both in a cage and non-cage dives, with a variety of sharks raning from Great Whites, Tiger, Blue, Mako, Brown, Sandtiger to Nurse/Grey sharks.

I also spent nearly everyday for 4 years in the water with sharks at an Aquarium and ran two of the shark dive programs for the public. I do not have a biology degree and my opinion is based on experience and what I've read.

Here is my OPINION based on that experience.

1) I do not believe in the "Mistaken Identity" theory.

Science has always put forth and maintained that shark attacks are because they believe "we" are a mistaken food source - specifically seals for the most part. Scientists have also proclaimed how very, very sensitive a shark is to the sense of smell (blood), vibrations and to varying degrees, electromagnetic "signatures". Every living thing gives off some kind of bioelectrical "signature", I don't believe anyone, even a scientist, would argue this point.

If everything above is true then there is no way possible a person in the water "looks" like a seal. If you compound this with Scuba divers wearing any kind of neoprene or local surfers wearing a body suit it makes even less sense.

2) Sharks are wild and hunt for food

Even diving in an aquarium where the sharks were well fed the sharks DID hunt on rare occassions. Yes, diving in this environment almost ensures that I would never be looked at as a meal, but they did hunt fish. I spent a great deal of time snorkeling on the surface with these aquarium sharks and diving with them. I've accidentally jumped on them, kicked them, surfaced into them underneath, been with them in pitch darkness, came around a corner and bumped into them face-to-face and I'm still here.

In open water it's a bit different. They are wild animals, you don't know when they last ate no different than any other wild animal. There's always a chance that you could run into a shark "on the hunt", no different than running into any other wild animal on the hunt anywhere.

3) Be Smart

I personally feel diving with sharks and putting food in the water is nothing short of pathetically stupid - if you're not in a cage. These open water shark dives where they take a group of divers, kneel on the bottom, and start handing out food to small reef sharks is extremely dangerous and it's only a matter of time before someone get's "tasted". Put me in a cage and fine, otherwise, it's just not a chance I'm willing to accept.

The point another person made about "don't act like food" is true as well. Diving with sharks in open water isn't that bad, for the most part every person on here is correct, they leave the area or at best make a pass to check you out and then leave. Snorkeling with sharks in open water, completely different, especially with certain spieces that use an upward attack angle. Once again, why take the risk? Being on the surface for an extended period of time snorkeling in known areas where there are aggressive spieces such as a Bull, Tiger, White and other's is like playing the lottery where you're the prize; a great meal.

3) Shark Attack File

Go read. Shark attacks are rare, and extremely rare for divers. We basically sound like Darth Vader under water - flat out not a natural food source. Once you read a couple hundred past and present descriptions on encounters you begin to see a pattern. Form your own educated and informed opinion, read the facts and ignore the opinions so to speak.

Attacks are usually broken down by two status's; provoked and unprovoked. Take for example Nurse Sharks. In almost 100% of cases nurse sharks are provoked and in almost 100% of the cases, by divers. Nurse sharks are very docile, typically lay on the bottom and will let you get up kind of close for some great pictures. Because of that and because of some of the shark feedings, like the one in FL, people get a false sense of security and pet them, kiss them (like the idiot in FL did), crowd them, etc... Guess what happens? It doesn't take a rocket scientist to tell you, you're asking to get bit, and they do.

After reading several hundred shark attack files I've formed my own "groupings" as to why attacks happen. MY THEORY makes two assumption's though - 1) All attacks occur because they were hungry and you were there. 2) Shark bites are extremely damaging to our soft human bodies, massive damage with a single bite which often leads to death. It's that simple.

Group 1 - Crowd attacks:
Fairly simple. All the vacationers at the beach and swimming in the water, spalshing around, just having a ton of fun. Shark is out on the hunt, looking for food, someone get's bit/attacked/hit (whatever you want to call it) and all "hell" breaks loose with people screaming and leaving the water. The shark is scared away. The person lives or dies depending on the severity of the bite.

Group 2 - Local Surfers, Bodysurfers, etc..:
Locals who spend a lot of time in the water understand how the body loses it's heat in water. If you can recall from your basic class you lose your body heat 25x faster in water than air. The local surfers know this, they wear neoprene either in the form of a shorty or full suit to stay warm. Shark is on the hunt, comes up to eat/bite/check out (whatever you want to call it), they get a mouth full of surfboard or rubber and - YUK! - shark says it tastes nasty and off they go to find some "real" food. The person lives or dies based on the severity of the bite.

Group 3 - Isolated small groups or individuals:
A couple people jumping off a sailboat in a pretty little cove, a person wonders way, way out to a set of sandbars another 50yds from the main beach line, the sole surfer who wants a quick wave or two and doesn't wear the rubber suit, etc....you get the idea. Shark comes by on the hunt, etc...and guess what...in nearly every case that falls into this category the person is eaten. Not attacked and the shark swims off because we weren't a seal, no mistaken idenity here, shark is hungry, you're alone, no rubber to taste bad, no group of screaming people to scare it off, they get eaten.

Teaching about sharks in a basic class I believe is important but to the extent of the content and how much time an Instructor spends the limited time he/she has can be debated. I spend probably 10 minutes on sharks. It goes like this...
1) Sharks are wild animals. Just like any other animal you run into if you leave it alone, for the most part it will leave you alone.
2) Why the heck would you do anything to provoke it? (See #1) Spearfish, pet, kiss, crowd, startle, etc...a wild animal, much less a shark? Just stupid if you ask me.
3) Sharks in the majority of the time leave the area before you ever see them.
4) If you get to see a shark consider youself lucky (see #3).
5) Be aware of your surroundings and behavior of the shark and type of shark. This doesn't take an expert. Are they feeding? Are they mixing speeds, slow/fast? Are you in the water with one of the 3 very aggressive spieces? Are you doing anything to provoke, startle it? Is the shark taking more than a common interest in you, just one or two 'fly by's' so to speak.
6) Avoid known hunting areas. Um...yea, lets go diving in South Africa off Seal Island during the Seals Breeding cycle (sharks do migrate for this)....yea, umm...thats smart.
7) If you're uncomforable or scared go to the bottom, kneel down and find a spot where you can take away some of your exposure. Put your back against a reef to take some of the 360 degree enviroment you're in.

Bottom line is this: I'm still here. You will be too if you take some common sense approaches to sharks no different than you would to any other wild animal. Would you run up to a cute, cuddly grizzly bear and try to pet it? Then why would you, or anyone else, want to do it with a shark?

All of this is MY OPINION. I am not a marine biologist. I've done a ton of dives and reading on sharks and formed my own opinion. I hope I don't catch a lot of "grief" from the science group over this, but it won't be the last I'm sure.