Sexual Assault: Discussion

[H2Andy]

sue, he doesn't. he can't. sometimes we just need to let it go and hope they never
have to deal with it themselves.

that is not to say that they can't talk about stuff. just wish sometimes they'd
have an inkling of what is at stake.

 

[SueMermaid]

Yep, Andy, you're right about that. I do hope nothing like this happens to someone he loves.

 

[Kennedydive]

People are chiming in to cast doubt on the original poster's story. This is where I have a problem. (And yes, before you go off on me, I know exactly what I am talking about. I was a victim of sexual assault myself).
It will be impossible for me to put into the correct words, so forgive me if it comes out wrong.
It's extremely hard for a woman to
a) Not blame herself for a sexual assault, and to
b) Go public with it so that others might avoid the same fate.

People who do not know the facts doubting and ridiculing her are more harmful than you can ever imagine. Many victims of rape and/or assault never come forward because of fear of this happening. They just take it on the chin and go on like nothing happened because they are ashamed. This is a primal wound. This pain comes out in other, much more destructive ways if it's stuffed. That is wrong. The pain of such an event is very hard to describe to those who don't understand. I have talked to many people to assumed it was no big deal, it was just sex, nobody got hurt, and that I should get over it. Many times I was told that I "asked for it" by not being more careful. Even the police force in my town asked me if I was dressed "provocatively" when I was raped.

Yes, there are stories of women crying wolf to get attention. Those women are pathetic and should be punished severely. These women are in the VAST minority.

We must NEVER assume that a woman is telling half-truths about something like this. You have NO idea how damaging that can be to a person. Think about something like this happening to your daughters and your sisters. God forbid. But how would you feel about people casting doubt on her integrity?

THINK about what you are saying.

I won't speak for others participating in this thread but as for myself all I would like to hear all sides of the story. I wasn't there so I can't make an informed decision on what I've read so far.
As far as what happened to you I sure it is a painful event you went through which no man or woman should have to go through. If it happened to a member of my family the person would never make it to trial.
I did not want to post this information as I'm sure it will make me look bias but at the last place I worked I was a shift supervisor of 15 individuals. One day I was called into the office and told that I was using inappropriate language. Which I was. I lost come very important documents on my computer which delayed a project at least a months work. I had realized my stupidity before I had been called into the office and had already apologized to my co-workers and told them if I ever swore again I'd take the all out to supper. Which I did when one of them caught me slip up 3 days later. The next day after my visit to the office I was told that I was being written up. It came to their attention that not only did my behavior continue but it had got worse and that one of the employees that was working under me had quit because of it. She had stated that she was afraid to go to her car at the end of the shift because of me. On top of that she decided to thro in that I made derogatory remarks about women. After an investigation and interviews with the 7 males and 5 females that worked under my supervision it was determined that the information was fabricated. All the other employees that worked in one cubical vouched for my creditability. I was allowed to keep my job but the letter of complaint remained on my record. After that I was passed over several times for promotion and did not receive any raises due to this blemish. When I asked it to be removed from my record because there was no base to her claim I was told "IF THAT IS HOW SHE INTERPITED IT THAN SHE HAS THE RIGHT TO MAKE A COMPLAINT. WE CAN NOT PROVE OR DISPROVE HOW SOMEONE INTERPETS SOMETHING."
To this day I'm not sure why these complaints were filed against me. My only thoughts are that I had told her that if her performance needed to improve before her three month probation came up. So I've been on the other side of the fence as you and neither side is a good place to be on. I'd just like to hear more info about the case before I make an informed decision.
JK

 

[scubamate]

As an instructor as well, I tend to agree with Chickdiver on this one. I tell students up front when I may have occasion to touch them and where the touch will be. If they indicate that it's okay, then we proceed. If not, then I go to some alternative plan. Don't know what the alternative plan is, because no one has objected.

In my opinion though, in a valid rescue situation, all bets are off. I will do anything in my power to save the life of a victim and in the process if something is grabbed, held or touched, such is life. If they want to state their objections after they've been rescued, they are more than welcome to. I will just be happy just to hear their voice, no matter how shrill it is.

But outside of a rescue situation, then any touching outside of 'normal' attention getting or what have you, is not appropriate - not in the least! If I saw a DM that was working for me touching a student or a guest in a manner that wasn't right, he (or she - let's be fair here) would have some serious explaining to do, followed by a sincere 'I'm sorry' to the individual and probably would not dive with me again. It's just not worth the bad reputation I would receive.

If this stance offends anyone, I'm sorry, but that's how I feel. Have I rescued women? Yes. Were things grabbed? Yes. Was anything said? Yes - heartfelt thanks and tears of gratitude. But I have never, nor will I tolorate anyone taking advantage of a situation on my watch.

Simply my 2 cents worth.

I can and will mirror hoya97's comments. In this type of training, there will be an infrequent accidental touch. If you exaggerate your intentions (of avoiding touching), are careful, and sincerely apologetic if something does happen, it should be an easy task to keep your reputation clean. I've also banned DM's from training. From me they get one warning for such behavior and they're out.

That's my $.02 worth.

 

[mrobinson]

Jason- You feel victimized in the situation you descibed. Without passing judgment to the girl, I can feel for your side of the story too. Now please understand the victim in regards to this tread needs the same compassion.

 

[SueMermaid]

I'd just like to hear more info about the case before I make an informed decision.
JK

Again: This is not for us to make a call on. The details of the assault are absoutely none of our business.
I am sorry for your series of events. But that situation does not qualify you to make a judgement about this case.

 

[pilot fish]

Pilotfish, I am not making ANY judgements. I was not there. I don't know the details.

The details of what happened are none of my business, and none of yours. You just don't get it.

We agree, I was not there and therefore do not know what happened. You were not there and do not know what happened either. We have no difference on this point.

(Post edited per previous warning. Reference TOS violation. R. Davie)

 

[mrobinson]

ok pilotfish- off the topic of this thread..
Anyone in power over another person can be inappropriate in any situation. The case you're describing... imagine if I took you down, unzipped you're wetsuit, penatrated you with my hands since you're are trying to control this bd/breathing/etc. It so easy to do.

 

[Kennedydive]

Jason- You feel victimized in the situation you descibed. Without passing judgment to the girl, I can feel for your side of the story too. Now please understand the victim in regards to this tread needs the same compassion.

As per my orig. post

First off let me say that any assault on anyone is totally unacceptable. In an environment that is less forgiving not only demeans a person but it put their life in jeopardy. My thoughts go out to you and it appears you are a strong individual and you will overcome this awful incident.

 

[mrobinson]

Fine Jason - it's too bad you can't see the contradictions you're making with the statements after your quote!