Self rescue fins?

[Finaly]

Hello folks.
A scenario for you. A person loses contact with their kayak and paddle miles out to sea. They detach the short bodyboarding fins they have clipped to their buoyancy aid. They slip them over their paddle boots. They do this quickly and easily, because they're using Cressi Swim Short Fins and they've adjusted the straps to fit the boots before leaving shore. They lay on their back and start the long, slow paddle toward land. They radio their position and heading to the relevant authorities. They keep going until they get tired, picked up, or reach land.
Is this in any way viable, or advisable? Your thoughts please. It just seems a person in this situation can not only keep up their spirits and body temperature, but also get themselves nearer to help and possibly even effect their own rescue.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

Well there are many x-factor variables not addressed in your non diving scenario.

There are actually many experienced watermen and waterwomen who would not need fins, or a buoyancy aid, in their local ocean, in that scenario.

Take for instance this recent newspaper blurb here on Maui;

Two swimmers safe after drifting off course, separating from boat escort - Mauinews.com | News, Sports, Jobs, Visitor's Information - The Maui News

LAHAINA - Two men swimming from Maui to Lanai on Sunday became separated from their escort boat in the afternoon but managed to make it to the former Pineapple Isle safely a few hours later, fire officials said.

One of the swimmers, Bruno Amby, said he and his nephew, Clive Cabiles, both experienced divers and watermen in their 50s, began their swim from Mala Wharf in Lahaina around 6 a.m. and drifted off course in a strong current. They planned to swim to Lanai Harbor on the southern portion of the island.

Instead, the swimmers arrived at different places on the eastern side of Lanai, Amby said.

"Oh, man. We made it all right. It wasn't planned that way," Amby said via cellphone Monday morning.

Firefighters were called around 3:50 p.m. after the guide boat reported that it lost sight of one swimmer at 12:15 p.m. and then the other at 1 p.m., officials said.

Firefighter rescue crews from Lanai, Lahaina and Kahului responded to the area, as well as the Coast Guard and the Maui Fire Department Air One helicopter.

Amby said he made it to Lanai around 3:30 p.m., and Cabiles arrived on shore around 5:50 p.m.

Fire officials said they later got word that the men were on Lanai.

That is a straight line distance of ~7 miles, iirc.

 

[flots am]

Hello folks.
A scenario for you. A person loses contact with their kayak and paddle miles out to sea. They detach the short bodyboarding fins they have clipped to their buoyancy aid. They slip them over their paddle boots. They do this quickly and easily, because they're using Cressi Swim Short Fins and they've adjusted the straps to fit the boots before leaving shore. They lay on their back and start the long, slow paddle toward land. They radio their position and heading to the relevant authorities. They keep going until they get tired, picked up, or reach land.
Is this in any way viable, or advisable? Your thoughts please. It just seems a person in this situation can not only keep up their spirits and body temperature, but also get themselves nearer to help and possibly even effect their own rescue.

I don't get it.

Why would you abandon a kayak in order to start swimming? Wouldn't it be closer to swim to your kayak instead of shore?

While I don't kayak, my understanding is that you're "in" it and it's not something you could accidentally lose.

In any case, if you're planning for this, I'd bring along real fins. If you're going to a knife fight, you don't want to start out on purpose with a butter knife.

Also, nothing will keep up your temperature except insulation. If this is anyplace but tropical, you're going to be in rough shape in very short order.

flots.

 

[Finaly]

Thank you Halemano and Flots Am.

It's encouraging to know people are capable of swimming such impressive distances with enough experience/practice and in clement waters. Unfortunately as far as I remember the sea off Britain averages at best only about 15 degrees and probably only at the end of summer. So I was hoping to speed up such a swim, which would only be made in some strange emergency. It's surely good to be prepared for a possible eventuality- especially at sea, where strange and life threatening things do happen.

I'm aware that in general it's best to stay in, then next to your yak, or at least hold onto your paddle for buoyancy, as many people experience difficulty in cold water within a surprisingly short time. I was planning on wearing up to four all-body layers- microfleece, 3mm wetsuit, normal fleece, and outer shell. I was thinking of getting a waterproof, woven 'beanie hat'. The shell jacket has a hood. I thought these might both be useful when doing a back paddle. I was hoping water trapped between four layers would be sufficient insulation. I have to say I would be surprised if enough insulation coupled with constant exertion didn't lead to heat generation. As long as this was carried out at a sustainable rate, would it not be possible to keep cold and fatigue at bay for a considerable time? Maybe I'm being wilfully optimistic- trying to gather courage before my first sea-kayaking forays!

I appreciate this may seem an odd place to enquire about a kayak related matter, but I thought you people would be by far the best to know about fins. My internet research so far has led me to believe short fins are good for long distances, but it seems this is not universally agreed. I may have misunderstood what I read. What is an example of 'real fins'? I'm almost completely new to both kayaking and wild swimming, so I'm interested in your thoughts about any of this.

 

[danvolker]

Thank you Halemano and Flots Am.

It's encouraging to know people are capable of swimming such impressive distances with enough experience/practice and in clement waters. Unfortunately as far as I remember the sea off Britain averages at best only about 15 degrees and probably only at the end of summer. So I was hoping to speed up such a swim, which would only be made in some strange emergency. It's surely good to be prepared for a possible eventuality- especially at sea, where strange and life threatening things do happen.

I'm aware that in general it's best to stay in, then next to your yak, or at least hold onto your paddle for buoyancy, as many people experience difficulty in cold water within a surprisingly short time. I was planning on wearing up to four all-body layers- microfleece, 3mm wetsuit, normal fleece, and outer shell. I was thinking of getting a waterproof, woven 'beanie hat'. The shell jacket has a hood. I thought these might both be useful when doing a back paddle. I was hoping water trapped between four layers would be sufficient insulation. I have to say I would be surprised if enough insulation coupled with constant exertion didn't lead to heat generation. As long as this was carried out at a sustainable rate, would it not be possible to keep cold and fatigue at bay for a considerable time? Maybe I'm being wilfully optimistic- trying to gather courage before my first sea-kayaking forays!

I appreciate this may seem an odd place to enquire about a kayak related matter, but I thought you people would be by far the best to know about fins. My internet research so far has led me to believe short fins are good for long distances, but it seems this is not universally agreed. I may have misunderstood what I read. What is an example of 'real fins'? I'm almost completely new to both kayaking and wild swimming, so I'm interested in your thoughts about any of this.

While I am a proponent of composite blade freediving fins, for the vast majority of people, in your sccenario the fins to choose would be Force Fins....Depending on the muscle fitness of the individial, Force Fins will have an optimal model for you....
HOWEVER...I used to whitewater kayak, and then got a 19 foot racing surfski for ocean paddling, and used to paddle out several miles to the 60 foot reefs with other kayakers..to freedive or scuba.
I can not imagine the scenario you suggest. If I was freediving, and made A COLLOSSALLY foolish choice to not tow the kayak, and it became somehow "lost to me" ( cant imagine how really), then with freedive fins I could swim in to shore...but clearly, this would have been from making very bad choices...a freediver or scuba diver that anchored their kayak, could lose it if a huge current came up suddenly, and the diver was unable to beat the current to return to the anchored kayak....but neither of these are useful for your scenario.

With a surfski of any sit on top ocean kayak, even if you get tipped over by a big wave, you will easily climb back on...and you would really have to try to get separated from it.
If you are using a traditional cockpit type kayak, where it can tip and flood if you fail your roll....first solution is to be using a sit on top instead. With a drysuit if the water is cold.
Since most of these cockpit boats have very large bouyant tubes inside the frong and back of the hull, in case you tip over, the kayaks will not sink...the kayaker/turned swimmer, should hold on to the kayak and wait to be picked up, unless they are very close to shore-- a distance they would regularly swim.
I think if you make the choice to use one of the cockpit boats, and you have a lousy eskimo roll, and the water is so cold that your swimming is compromised--you should invest in one of those emergency handheld devices like spot http://www.findmespot.com/en/

 

[flots am]

It's encouraging to know people are capable of swimming such impressive distances with enough experience/practice and in clement waters.

????

I could do it in the Caribbean, but around GB, you're pretty much screwed unless you're wearing a drysuit or are close to shore.

I'm aware that in general it's best to stay in, then next to your yak, or at least hold onto your paddle for buoyancy, as many people experience difficulty in cold water within a surprisingly short time. I was planning on wearing up to four all-body layers- microfleece, 3mm wetsuit, normal fleece, and outer shell.

The best figures I've seen give you a few of minutes in the water. Even in a drysuit with proper insulation, and while dry, it gets cold pretty quickly.

While hate to rain on your parade, I think all you're going to get out of this plan is hyperthermia and dehydration while paddling, and not much useful help if you lose the boat. Water provides zero insulation, and saturated microfleece is only slightly better, so the only useful thing you would have is the wetsuit.

I appreciate this may seem an odd place to enquire about a kayak related matter, but I thought you people would be by far the best to know about fins. My internet research so far has led me to believe short fins are good for long distances, but it seems this is not universally agreed. I may have misunderstood what I read. What is an example of 'real fins'? I'm almost completely new to both kayaking and wild swimming, so I'm interested in your thoughts about any of this.

Fins are highly debated, but the short story is that bigger fins (more surface area) let you kick slower for the same amount of thrust. If I were lost at sea, I wouln't want the short fins.

That said, I think the best thing you could carry is an EPIRB, so if you have an emergency, you can press the button and wait for pickup, and the best thing you could wear is a drysuit. Since you won't actually be too far off the cost, I assume rescue wouldn't be a big problem.

flots.

 

[Doc Harry]

A personal locator beacon would be much more useful, I think.

 

[Finaly]

Thank you folks. Esp Flots. I particularly value corroboration from an experienced diving source about long blades giving better thrust throughout the entire range of a slower stroke like a back paddle. That was what had occurred to me whilst considering your 1st replies. I imagined lying on my back paddling first with short fins, then with long. The long, slow, steady pace that would be required to stand any real chance in that scenario, seemed to only really be possible with long blades.

Please be assured, I would only ever use this approach as a desperate last measure. I also appreciate the fact that you all seem to think it very unlikely that the scenario would arise. That is good for morale! I can think of scenarios where sticking with a kayak wouldn't be possible, but I admit they're probably not hugely likely.

I agree that carrying good locating equipment is crucial if things go seriously wrong. The sea off Britain may not be warm, but it is one of the busiest shipping areas in the world, so the chances of another vessel effecting a rescue are increased. We also have the fine R.N.L.I. rescue organisation. Better keep donating I suppose!

Thank you all again. If you have a different take on any of this, please feel free to add it.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

I have lost a kayak in inclement seas. It was a series of mishaps.

Not so slow leak in sit on top kayak seat is the root of the problem. After a "few hours" of free dive photography in the 50-70 ft range, nearly a half mile off shore, I actually did not finish the 24 exposure roll of film shakehead because I was spent to nausea. The swell had come up and with water in the hull the kayak was unstable; even more so with my free dive fins on. They make the center of gravity noticeably higher and they catch the wind and the waves that come over the gunnel; so they were strapped to the yak, with my mask. No leash from me to kayak, just from paddle to kayak; not supposed to let go of the paddle. Wearing favorite 8 lb weight belt w/ just a shorty wet suit. Full strobe camera rig unstrapped between legs.

I have lots of water experience, but perhaps this was overconfidence. Then again, no water in the hull and I think I make it.

Anyway, I hear big water behind me when approaching the mid point of the fringe reef channel. Tide here really doesn't matter with bigger swell; current is out cause swell has to get back out. I knew I was too unstable to surf so spun a 180 and tried to bust through. Had no forward momentum so stuck on top, rocked to port and the hull water did too; no return rock. :shocked2:

Camera rig heads to the bottom, had to let go of paddle. Surfaced in the impact zone and started to worry after the second wave. Remembered to drop favorite weight belt. Frog kicked on my back to shore in about 20 minutes; S&R Vehicle just pulling into neighboring condo parking as I hit beach. They did not even get out of the truck. My neighbor, who was hosting his son's 1st B-day party (big deal in Hawaii) would not lend me his kayak to rescue mine until I had a plate of food.

We all ate and watched my yak tumble up and down the reef for 15 or so; by the time I got to it I had one free dive fin and one foot pocket, no mask.

Best part was the hundred and fifty witnesses.

 

[vladimir]

Hello folks.
A scenario for you. A person loses contact with their kayak and paddle miles out to sea....
Is this in any way viable, or advisable? Your thoughts please. It just seems a person in this situation can not only keep up their spirits and body temperature, but also get themselves nearer to help and possibly even effect their own rescue.

Was this prompted by your countryman's self rescue, reported in the Dorset Echo the day before your original post?:

A spokesman for the Maritime and Coastguard Agency said: “In all the time I have been doing this job I have never heard of a missing diver swimming ashore from that far out to sea.

“He is believed to be safe and well but I don’t have any further information at the moment.”

Charter boat skipper Paul Whittall who joined in search said: “It is absolutely amazing. He must have swum at least a mile and a half and I have never come across anything like it. It is great news.”