SueMermaid
Guest
"hottie"? :hehe: Do people still use that expression?
seasick
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Thanks for the info gear!
I think it came back Sue-- i hear the young kids saying it alot and I picked it up. When I first heard it, I thought to myself, didn't gma used to say that! Now i say it without thinking about it. Guess i'm too old to say it huh? hehe
I think it came back Sue-- i hear the young kids saying it alot and I picked it up. When I first heard it, I thought to myself, didn't gma used to say that! Now i say it without thinking about it. Guess i'm too old to say it huh? hehe
Former FLL Now MSP Diver
Contributor
Oh didn't you know. Seasickness meds can cause ummm.... "performance" issues.
Marc
SueMermaid
Guest
I'd rather be apologized to than puked on!
ut:
SueMermaid once bubbled...
Scop patches work for me, but only for a limited amount of time, and/or limited seas. For long hauls or rough water, nothing works. Last time I attempted to dive in NJ, I was sick for 3 days, and lost 7 lbs! :chuck:
Dramamine works about the same, but I have not yet tried doping myself for a day or two in advance, which these good folks suggested I do. I will be sure to try it out and report back!
Hi Sue:
Listen to GearHead... well, about the Relief Band. It might be dangerous to take any other advice!!!
Really, he's right on. The device works and of course has the benefit of being drug-free.
Lot's of places selling them now.
GearHead
Contributor
Aw shoot! Doppler, you caught me giving good advice! Undoubtedly my image is completely blown.
Sue, for the record, anything else I may tell you could either get you killed or make me rich. You've been warned.
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Perhaps this piece from my Jan/Feb '00 "Ask RSD" column in "Rodale's Scuba Diving" will prove informative:
"Sea sickness, which shows wide variation in susceptibility among individuals, is not yet fully understood. It is believed to occur when portions of the brain tasked with maintaining balance receive input from the eyes, inner ear, muscles and joints that is inconsistent and unexpected over an extended period of time.
Prevention is a first step. Avoid fatigue and get adequate rest. Eat modestly, avoiding greasy, fatty, acidic and spicy foods. Don't skip breakfast, but stick to bland foods like toast, rolls and cereal. Go easy on tea and coffee, and very, very easy on alcoholic beverages. When on the boat, don't get overheated--stay under a sunshade, don't put on your protective suit until necessary, and get in the water as soon as possible. Search out a spot low and in the center where motion is minimized, face forward, focus your eyes on a fixed object on the horizon or elsewhere, avoid unnecessary neck movements and stay out of exhaust fumes. Do not go below, read anything or look through binoculars. If you must vomit, do so freely, but not anywhere on the boat, and especially not in the marine toilet.
There are plenty of medications available, and you may wish to discuss this with your physician. Among those reported to be the most effective are meclizine and scopolamine. Prescription strength meclizine commonly comes as Antivert. Scopolamine can be delivered through a transdermal patch, Transderm Scop, orally, and as a gel applied to the wrists. The gel reportedly works faster, but not as long as the patch. Scopolamine is the US Navy's first line sea sickness drug, including for divers, and DAN approves it with a trial run. Occasionally Phenergan is recommended. It can cause very serious drowsiness, however, and is sometimes prescribed in combination with a stimulant to counteract this. The above drugs are prescription only and have reported side effects, most commonly dryness of the mouth and drowsiness. They may also cause blurred vision, dizziness and even confusion in some users, and it is recommended to carefully discuss their use with your physician, give them a trial run prior to use in conjunction with diving, and take them only according to instructions.
Over the counter (OTC) preparations include Bonine, Dramamine (Not recommended due to demonstrated adverse effects on alertness & performance), Dramamine II (Advertised as a "less drowsy" formula. As this implies, be aware that some individuals still do experience some degree of drowsiness.) and Triptone (Same active ingredient as original Dramamine, dimenhydrinate, so draw your own conclusions) . A British drug, Stugeron (cinnarizine), has been mentioned by several sources as an effective treatment (Have seen a recent research piece suggesting impairment in performance at higher doses), but it is not yet available in the US. Those diving in such places as Mexico & the British Virgin Islands can find it. Many report these OTC medications most effective if taken at bedtime the night prior to diving, with a second dose about an hour before diving, although recommended dosage amounts should of course not be exceeded. These medications often cause significant dryness of the mouth. Stay very well hydrated.
Considering more "natural" remedies, ginger is frequently mentioned, which can be taken in powdered, crystallized or root form, or as ginger snaps, ginger ale, or tea. As heartburn with the use of ginger has been reported, also pack an antacid. Others swear by wrist straps, such as 'Sea Bands,' usually wooden or plastic balls on elastic bands which are placed so as to exert pressure on an acupressure point on the inside of the wrist. There are also 'artificial-horizon' glasses. Even aromatherapy has been tried, with a combination of mandarin, peppermint, spearmint and lavender oil being recommended.
In the final analysis, you will need to discover what works best for you with the least risk, side effect, cost and inconvenience. If you take any medications, you should understand their adverse effects and carefully follow directions for use. And remember, there is one safe, sure cure: 'Sleep under a tree all day.' "
Helpful?
DocVikingo
"Sea sickness, which shows wide variation in susceptibility among individuals, is not yet fully understood. It is believed to occur when portions of the brain tasked with maintaining balance receive input from the eyes, inner ear, muscles and joints that is inconsistent and unexpected over an extended period of time.
Prevention is a first step. Avoid fatigue and get adequate rest. Eat modestly, avoiding greasy, fatty, acidic and spicy foods. Don't skip breakfast, but stick to bland foods like toast, rolls and cereal. Go easy on tea and coffee, and very, very easy on alcoholic beverages. When on the boat, don't get overheated--stay under a sunshade, don't put on your protective suit until necessary, and get in the water as soon as possible. Search out a spot low and in the center where motion is minimized, face forward, focus your eyes on a fixed object on the horizon or elsewhere, avoid unnecessary neck movements and stay out of exhaust fumes. Do not go below, read anything or look through binoculars. If you must vomit, do so freely, but not anywhere on the boat, and especially not in the marine toilet.
There are plenty of medications available, and you may wish to discuss this with your physician. Among those reported to be the most effective are meclizine and scopolamine. Prescription strength meclizine commonly comes as Antivert. Scopolamine can be delivered through a transdermal patch, Transderm Scop, orally, and as a gel applied to the wrists. The gel reportedly works faster, but not as long as the patch. Scopolamine is the US Navy's first line sea sickness drug, including for divers, and DAN approves it with a trial run. Occasionally Phenergan is recommended. It can cause very serious drowsiness, however, and is sometimes prescribed in combination with a stimulant to counteract this. The above drugs are prescription only and have reported side effects, most commonly dryness of the mouth and drowsiness. They may also cause blurred vision, dizziness and even confusion in some users, and it is recommended to carefully discuss their use with your physician, give them a trial run prior to use in conjunction with diving, and take them only according to instructions.
Over the counter (OTC) preparations include Bonine, Dramamine (Not recommended due to demonstrated adverse effects on alertness & performance), Dramamine II (Advertised as a "less drowsy" formula. As this implies, be aware that some individuals still do experience some degree of drowsiness.) and Triptone (Same active ingredient as original Dramamine, dimenhydrinate, so draw your own conclusions) . A British drug, Stugeron (cinnarizine), has been mentioned by several sources as an effective treatment (Have seen a recent research piece suggesting impairment in performance at higher doses), but it is not yet available in the US. Those diving in such places as Mexico & the British Virgin Islands can find it. Many report these OTC medications most effective if taken at bedtime the night prior to diving, with a second dose about an hour before diving, although recommended dosage amounts should of course not be exceeded. These medications often cause significant dryness of the mouth. Stay very well hydrated.
Considering more "natural" remedies, ginger is frequently mentioned, which can be taken in powdered, crystallized or root form, or as ginger snaps, ginger ale, or tea. As heartburn with the use of ginger has been reported, also pack an antacid. Others swear by wrist straps, such as 'Sea Bands,' usually wooden or plastic balls on elastic bands which are placed so as to exert pressure on an acupressure point on the inside of the wrist. There are also 'artificial-horizon' glasses. Even aromatherapy has been tried, with a combination of mandarin, peppermint, spearmint and lavender oil being recommended.
In the final analysis, you will need to discover what works best for you with the least risk, side effect, cost and inconvenience. If you take any medications, you should understand their adverse effects and carefully follow directions for use. And remember, there is one safe, sure cure: 'Sleep under a tree all day.' "
Helpful?
DocVikingo
BillP
Senior Member
Howdy Waterlover:
Technically your statement that the "scop patches are a narcotic" is correct, so I hope you don't mind if I expand on that thought.
The term "narcotic" has taken on so many meanings and acquired so many connotations over the years that it is nearly unuseable in a pharmacologic sense when classifying medications. The word originally comes from the Greek narke meaning stupor. Since scopolamine can sometimes cause drowsiness, by that definition scopolamine patches can indeed be "narcotic" for some people if they don't react well to it (but they usually are not and they are often used by divers as DocV mentions above). Of course, using that definition, a glass of warm milk at bedtime is "narcotic" for many people. Milk is not sold by prescription in most places.
When discussing "narcotics" in a pharmacological context, many people generally mean drugs that induce sleepiness, alter mood or behavior, and relieve pain- and often they specifically mean drugs in the opiate family. Scopolamine is not an opiate, it isn't normally used to relieve pain, and in typical seasickness doses for most people it won't alter mood or behavior or induce sleepiness.
When discussing "narcotics" in a legal context, many people mean any drugs that are addictive and alter mood or behavior. Stopping scopolamine can cause symptoms, but it is not generally considered addictive and, as mentioned above, the patches don't normally alter mood or behavior. In the US the Transderm Scop patches are indeed by prescription only, but they are a Product Category IV drug along with antibiotics and other medications with a low abuse potential. (For comparison, opiates are usually Category III or II drugs with special restrictions on how prescriptions are written and how the medications are dispensed. ) Scopolamine is sold over-the-counter in some countries (eg I believe Canada and Australia have OTC Scopolamine).
So bottom line, yeah divers do need to be aware that in some people scopolamine can cause sleepiness and might add to the "narcotic" properties of nitrogen if they're one of the people who do get sleepy, but in most divers scopolamine is a safe and effective medication for seasickness (and as DocV points out- is the "drug of choice" for some divers). Personally, I wouldn't paint scopolamine with the broad brush of the term "narcotic".
HTH,
Bill
The above information is intended for discussion purposes only and is not meant as medical advice for any individual.
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