ScubaPro D400 Being Phased Out

[luvdiving]

It's an updated version of the D400.
User adjustment knobs added to some internal improvements to make even easier breathing than the D400.
The biggest improvement is for the service technicians. It's easier to take apart and assemble.

 

[pos-tech]

Its internal parts are more like the 600 than the 400
thay just kept the old "cool" look

 

[Alan Krell]

Nothing beats the original Pilot! Sorry, it may have been complex and hard to service, but what a first class second stage. Kind of like a Ferrari Formula one car. Good for one race and then it needs an over haul... in this case, two seasons or less of diving and then back into the tech shop.... a small price to pay I reckon.. any one else out there with thoughts on the Pilot?

Alan

 

[rmannix]

No Pilot but used AIR1 for years, still have 2. Found parts kits, overhauled and stored with spring removed to preserve the new seats.
Great breather but all water when head-first.

These days I prefer something with an exhaust tee (when not 2-hosing) as I always have a camera.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I have a couple Air 1's and a Pilot to Air 1 conversion kit sitting around, but don't have any Pilot's sitting around.

SP has stopped suporting the Air 1, but at least it uses the same poppets a the D400, so as long as you manage to not poke a hole in the diaphragm they are still going to be usable.

Personally, I think they breathe too wet for my tastes and I liked the diaphragm being moved to the other side (as well as the diaphragm being easier to install) on the D300/D350/D400 series.

I own a pair of D300's a couple D350's and about a half dozen D400's. In my opinion the D350 and D400 were the best second stages ever made. They achieved superb performance without the finicky and hard to tune traits of the Pilot.

I'll agree the X650 is easier for the average not-too-bright tech to service and tune than the D400. But I would have preferred SP do a better job of tuning up their techs rather than discontinue the D400. Stupid move.

The X650 looks like the D400 with it's angled diaphragm, but it does not share the coaxial exhaust valve and the engineers missed the point completely regarding case geometry fault. You could tune a D400 for stable, freeflow free operation at about .5 to .6 inches of water. With the X650, at anything less than about 1.5 inches of water, you get slight freeflow out the exhaust valve. So the breathing performance of the X650 is on par with the D400, but only if can tolerate the slow dribble of air out the exhaust valve between inhalations. If adjusted to prevent the slight freeflow in most swimming posistions, it's performance is similar to the G250, S600, etc, just a bit smoother due to the more linear air flow. out the air barrel.

The X650 looks like a D400 and is, compared to most other regs on the market, a superb regulator - but it is no D400.

 

[halocline]

It's funny, I just saw a new old stock D400 on ebay and was tempted primarily because of DA's rave reviews. It ended up going for about $140, a little too rich for my tastes as I'm happy with my G250 and balanced adjustable. A little hijack; does anyone know if it's possible to get a seacure type 1 on the old metal case balanced adjustable? The metal flange for the mouthpiece is a different shape, and I can't tell if the rigid plastic part in the seacure will prevent me from getting it to fit. Anyone with knowledge of this?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

The market for used or new old stock regs tends to limit the price to about 1/2 the retail price of a new and currently produced reg. Much higher than that and people will just buy a new one from an on-line source. (And $140 is right in that range for a new old stock D400, so it's not over priced, it is just not a super deal.)

It's usually cheaper to buy a D400 attached to a first stage and then sell the first stage to recover most of the cost as people often pay more for a high performance first stage than it is really worth. For example, you can get a used Mk 20 D400 for around $175 and then still get $100-$125 out of a used Mk 20 first stage alone. I bought a new old stock Mk 20 D400 last spring from a shop for $310 and then sold the still new Mk 20 alone for $210 leaving me with a $100 NOS D400.

I try not to pay more than about $75 for a D400 in good unserviced condition and usually won't pay more than about $125 for one in new old stock condition. But I need to stop saying nice things about the D400, as it seems to eliminate any good deals on e-bay. I have had to watch more than one otherwise not heavily bid D400 go for what it is worth, or more than it is worth in an auction when a board member decided they had to have one. We had one member here who bought most of the D400's that showed up on e-bay for 3-4 months. They can be addictive.

 

[bradshsi]

They can be addictive.

I'll second that sentiment. I ended up with a D350 second stage (mainly by luck rather than judgement). After getting it serviced and resisting the shops attempts to sell me X650 "because the D350 is really old...", I discovered how good it really was in the water.

Now I'd like to get a second one for my dive buddy.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I bought an extemely nice MK 25 D400 the other day. Mostly for the D400, but also so I could attach the un-needed Mk 25 first stage to an only been dove 3 times X650 that I bought for evaluaton purposes and want to sell. The X650 is great but it is just not in the same class as the D400.

Keep resisting all attempts to "upgrade" your D350 to an X650, S600, G250HP, etc. Of course, if it a later model D350 with the D400 case, you can upgrade it to D400 status pretty inexpensively.

 

[Wayward Son]

Reading all this, I'm really appreciating the screaming deal a friend just made me on one of his Mk10/D400 sets

It should be here this week, I'm looking forward to diving it.