Request for information not covered in any course

[KathyV]

Try it in high choppy seas where even staying at the surface is difficult when hanging on a line out from the boat. You get exhausted pretty quickly. Then try swimming a distance, against current, in gear, under those conditions. After you do that then tell what every diver should be fine with.

The snorkel was a wide bore semi dry and did not fail. It just couldn't be used in the conditions without taking on water continuously.

For the record, it's the know-it-all posts like this that keep me from posting the full account. Most include the phrase "any diver should be able" - as above, go do it and then talk to me. They also say "I don't see how". Of course you don't. I didn't either - till it happened to me. Do you really think I would have done this on purpose? Since you weren't there, since it didn't happen to you, I wouldn't expect you to see how it could happen. But your post implies that it couldn't and that it was ... Well let's leave it there.

Maybe I should post the full account, along with all of my analysis of my bad decisions and what I would do differently. That would bring the "perfect divers" out in droves. It would make it easy to populate my Ignore list. It would also identify those who try to be honestly helpful as opposed to patronizing and condescending, those whose input and opinions I can trust and respect. Might just do it.

Also for the record, one of those people who honestly want to help reached out through PM. They were supportive and reviewed the full account and my thoughts and offered suggestions. More importantly, they identified some things I hadn't thought of and allowed me to identify some additional equipment, that will go on every dive from now on, that would have made this experience far less threatening and far more survivable. Sincere thanks to that person.

It sounds like you got some valuable information that may also help others, I hope that you do decide to share it.

 

[lowviz]

But you see? Op says they knew

Yes, I see.

And that is all @Kharon needed to know. Capn's tend to keep an eye on everyone. Kharon's turn came...

 

[tursiops]

Yes, I see.

And that is all @Kharon needed to know. Capn's tend to keep an eye on everyone. Kharon's turn came...

Three separate issues: 1) did the boat know he was there, 2) did he know if the boat knew, and 3)was he comfortable while waiting. The answers appear to be Yes, Unclear, and No. Some SB focus on how to help with (3) might be useful.

 

[chillyinCanada]

Three separate issues: 1) did the boat know he was there, 2) did he know if the boat knew, and 3)was he comfortable while waiting. The answers appear to be Yes, Unclear, and No. Some SB focus on how to help with (3) might be useful.

I'm still confused about your #1. Op claims they knew but did they really know, in real time? How did they indicate to him that they knew?

If I were Op, (and have been), I'd be somewhat more comfortable if I'm absolutely 100% positive that they know.

 

[scubadada]

Drift diving in SE FL has taught me a lot about being comfortable while waiting. In Boynton Beach, I often dive by myself with a flag. I often start and sometimes finish on the outside of the reef. At times, the current is very brisk and separates groups by a fair distance. Sometimes the current is running different directions on the outside and the inside of the reef, separating divers even more. When divers hook off while hunting or doing photography, that increases the separation distance. When seas are big, seeing the flags is not so easy. When the weather goes bad, the visibility can be quite poor. I don't always see my boat when I surface for pick up. I have waited 5-10 minutes on many occasions and have waited 15-20 minutes on a few occasions. The key is to remain calm, make sure you have good buoyancy at the surface, and can breath comfortably. I do not dive with a snorkel, so that is not an option. I have become a little nervous on a few occasions, not so much for quite a while.

 

[tursiops]

For the OP:

 

[chillyinCanada]

Drift diving in SE FL has taught me a lot about being comfortable while waiting. In Boynton Beach, I often dive by myself with a flag. I often start and sometimes finish on the outside of the reef. At times, the current is very brisk and separates groups by a fair distance. Sometimes the current is running different directions on the outside and the inside of the reef, separating divers even more. Wnen divers hook off while hunting or doing photography, that increases the separation distance. When seas are big, seeing the flags is not so easy. When the weather goes bad, the visibility can be quite poor. I don't always see my boat when I surface for pick up. I have waited 5-10 minutes on many occasions and have waited 15-20 minutes on a few occasions. The key is to remain calm, make sure you have good buoyancy at the surface, and can breath comfortably. I do not dive with a snorkel, so that is not an option. I have become a little nervous on a few occasions, not so much for quite a while.

Same, no snorkel

"Don't fight da sea, bebe" was said to me once on a return to the boat in ripping river like current in Tobago.

That said, long before that I'd been in many a high sea away from the boat. There's no question that it was easier to find some comfort when I knew without question that the captain knew where I was. Then figuring out how to deal with the roughness becomes primary.

 

[Altamira]

I am not trying to hijack the thread or revisiting the often argued back inflate vs jacket debate, but I am wondering if @Kharon was wearing a jacket or bp/w/back inflate in the rough sea? While I dive a back inflate now, I do find that it is not as comfortable or easy to stay stabilized in a rough sea than it was in my old Sherwood Avid bcd. Being knocked around is no fun in either case, but I found myself working a lot harder with my back inflate, and found trying to lay back or stay vertical, lower in the water, like I do in calm water to be a real challenge, and can see where that could add a lot of stress to an already uncomfortable situation.

 

[johndiver999]

Drift diving in SE FL has taught me a lot about being comfortable while waiting. In Boynton Beach, I often dive by myself with a flag. I often start and sometimes finish on the outside of the reef. At times, the current is very brisk and separates groups by a fair distance. Sometimes the current is running different directions on the outside and the inside of the reef, separating divers even more. When divers hook off while hunting or doing photography, that increases the separation distance. When seas are big, seeing the flags is not so easy. When the weather goes bad, the visibility can be quite poor. I don't always see my boat when I surface for pick up. I have waited 5-10 minutes on many occasions and have waited 15-20 minutes on a few occasions. The key is to remain calm, make sure you have good buoyancy at the surface, and can breath comfortably. I do not dive with a snorkel, so that is not an option. I have become a little nervous on a few occasions, not so much for quite a while.

Drifting passively on the surface with an inflated BC is far different than clinging to a rope, in a current and wind and waves and trying to yell and signal for help. The more you inflate the BC, the more drag you have and without a snorkel it is more difficult to maintain a streamlined position on the rope. Climbing, kicking back 6-800 feet on the rope to the boat can be super strenuous, depending on the size of the rope, the size of the seas, the current and the diver.

That is why, when the OP seemed to mentioned that the boat could have abandoned the ascending divers and left them on a mooring, and gone to retrieve him, I raised the issue that this might not be a good option.

Perhaps we could discuss what the protocol (for the diver and boat operator) should be when a diver ends up way down stream on a surface line, appears to be desirous of help, yet the boat is moored/anchored and there are several divers still in the water? It is an entirely foreseeable situation and the whole reason to run a long surface floatline is to handle this exact scenario. What does everyone one do when that happens - assuming no chase dingy??

 

[Brian G]

How would you suggest that question be asked in a sensitive way, given that the OP did not describe what happened?

Kharon clearly stated that dissecting what went wrong was not the goal of the post.

However, I have no intention of subjecting myself to the kind of trashing common at times on this board. While most replies are attempts to be helpful. Too many are not. Sorry, I just don't need that right now.

So trying to elicit information about the situation so that it can be compared against what should have been done is rude. Trying to steer a conversation directly where the OP said they didn't want it to go, is rude.