Replacing lead weights with US nickel coins

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Since we have alternatives like cupronickel coins that work just as well, why accept any unnecessary lead exposure?

Well the short answer is, you can't go down to your local dive shop and buy cupronickel weights. Only so many hours in the day, and people have to pick their battles. Lead exposure via SCUBA weights is a risk small enough to ignore. Just wash your hands after handling and before eating, and the risk is nil.

With that said, next time I have 100 nickels, I'm curious to see if I could cast a cupronickel weight. Seemingly would need a steel mold, don't know if a standard aluminum one would take the temperature. Be an interesting project.
 
For divers, the risk isn't theoretical. Regular handling of lead weights leads to hand-to-mouth transfer and equipment contamination. Dive operators who handle hundreds of weights daily face even higher exposure risks.
Still waiting on the quantification and evidence that move the needle from "is a risk" to "is a harmful (or even deadly) risk" at those levels of exposure.

Elimination of all risks is rarely a good thing.

If it were, we would not get on planes. Or go underwater (particularly in the presence of sharks!). Or drive cars. Or kiss girls. The list is virtually endless.

It is the risk/mediation/cost/benefit analysis that is telling.

And as to cupronickel being totally "safe" and non-contributory to harm, I wonder if there is any risk in the mining and refining of those elements and processing them into alloyable compounds and making small disks out of it or the amount of energy consumed and other poisons blown into the air or washed down streams. No such thing as a free lunch.
 
Well the short answer is, you can't go down to your local dive shop and buy cupronickel weights. Only so many hours in the day, and people have to pick their battles. Lead exposure via SCUBA weights is a risk small enough to ignore. Just wash your hands after handling and before eating, and the risk is nil.

With that said, next time I have 100 nickels, I'm curious to see if I could cast a cupronickel weight. Seemingly would need a steel mold, don't know if a standard aluminum one would take the temperature. Be an interesting project.
I wonder what the feds would have to say about that?
 
[...]
The thing that I'm still struggling with is that this corrosion rate suggests that lead has an extraordinarily low corrosion rate, at or below that of stainless. But that does not comport with my experience with uncoated lead weights and, say, my stainless steel regulator. The dive weight is bangled to all hell and has obvious corrosion marks, while the regulator looks like brand new.
Comparing lead to stainless steel is difficult I guess. You would first have to define which stainless steel we use for comparison. Is it austenitic, ferritic, martensitic, duplex, or so on. Each of these categories further has several subcategories of stainless steel. A common choice would be 316L stainless steel, which belongs to the austenitic group. And incidentally 316L seems to have fairly similar corrosion characteristics in seawater as lead does.

I wonder, do these corrosion rates only tell half the story of a just a lead object in water. What about mechanical action?
[...]
This is completely true and touches upon an important point. It may be that the weight you perceive as corroded are merely severely deformed, showing white powdery lead oxide. Lead deforms so easily, you can even scratch it with your fingernails.

Given this picture, an abraded, manipulated weight like lead will be constantly deforming. This means that the passivation layer will be constantly cracking and flaking off when, say the weight rubs against a belt, sack, or wet suit. This case would be much worse for shot, as it will behave as a ball mill.
The scientific studies, also the ones I mentioned are useless in some very real sense for real world scenarios. Oftentimes they assume un-stirred, stagnant water, which is obviously not the case. Moving water would effect the formation of passivization layers and the resulting corrosion rates significantly. However, they also assume the lead is immersed for 24 hours, which is also clearly not the case.

Coins are better in that the underlying cupronickel is as hard as the hardest passive surface on lead, and the passive surface is even harder.

Stainless is even better as it is hard and its passive layer is very hard, so there is very little deformation, so the passive layer stays intact.

What do you think about this?
I think I would leave the argument of corrosion of lead aside. If you look at lead weights that get recovered after nearly a decade of immersion in saltwater on old diving hats or similar, they still look great. I remember seeing a picture of a lead anchor from the first century BC, that still looked decent. If I can dig that picture up I add it here later.

However, what I do would mention is that while lead doesn't really lose any weight over time to corrosion, it still forms oxides. And these oxides can flake off and find their way into a person or animal fairly easily via ingestion. They may not be enough to make a dent in the leads mass, they may be enough to become a problem in a living organism. Touch the lead with your hand, then eat a banana on the boat -> You likely ingested a little lead.

The whole situation is far more complex than what we can solve via back of the hand calculations. The truth will likely lie somewhere in between "Lead is completely impervious to saltwater" and "Lead corrodes rapidly". Lead will be fairly unaffected by the water, but mechanical action and abrasion will take a toll on it, if ever so slight.
I agree that the ocean faces a ton of challenges, many of which we have zero power to change. BUT, the good news is that replacing lead in our dive kit IS something we can do now. Coins made from marine-grade alloys like cupronickel are similarly priced to lead, last longer, and eliminate heavy metal exposure completely. Unlike other ocean challenges, this is one we can solve immediately at little to no extra cost.
This should be a more widespread opinion. Just because we can't change every problem at once, that doesn't mean that we can't start by changing the little things, especially when doing so is relatively easy.


[...]Lead exposure via SCUBA weights is a risk small enough to ignore. Just wash your hands after handling and before eating, and the risk is nil.
This is certainly true to some extend, but unfortunately it doesn't end there. People all too often cast their own lead weights and in poorer countries this is routinely done without any precautions whatsoever. Not using it in the first place would negate the possibility and stop the problem in its tracks.

With that said, next time I have 100 nickels, I'm curious to see if I could cast a cupronickel weight. Seemingly would need a steel mold, don't know if a standard aluminum one would take the temperature. Be an interesting project.
Unfortunately that won't work. Lead is so easy to work with, melting already at 330°C or so. Aluminium withstands 660°C but Cupronickel needs more than 1100°C to melt.


[...]
Blanket hysteria of "OMG! Pb! Eeeek!" is over the top dramatics. If you work with a lot of it every day, yeah, it may be a concern. (I once worked at an indoor range and had a colleague that also smelted and cast lead bullets on a commercial basis. He had annual checks of lead concentration in his blood. Never crossed into a problematic concentration.) Slight, occasional contact? Just not so much of a problem.
[...]
I think no one here is advocating for the immediate dismissal of lead, or even suggesting that it is an immediate danger and threat and the most pressing issue. However, it is undeniable that lead is rather devious poison for living organisms. It is a poison that accumulates in organisms and only really leads to complications once a certain threshold is passed. There was good reason to ban leaded fuels and thankfully the world has stopped using them completely, with Nigeria using its last stockpile in 2021.

Your friend likely had precautions in place, as it should be. But these precautions are not universally in place, as I mentioned above especially in poorer places. If a better or safer alternative exists, I would suggest using it. Just because something can be made safe, that doesn't mean its a smart thing to do, especially if alternatives exists.

You have a good point in pointing out that cupronickel itself may have environmental issues. I would go as far as saying that Copper and Nickel mining are horrendous for the environment as well, there is no doubt about that. But how these compare to lead and the mining of lead, I have honestly no idea.

@Mobulai
I sincerely wish that XenForo would support proper LaTeX, this would make writing math formulas so much nice and easier to read. It does not as far as I'm aware, but it does support certain tags, like:
[sub]XXXX[/sub] for subscript and [sup]XXXX[/sup] for superscript
 
Well the short answer is, you can't go down to your local dive shop and buy cupronickel weights. Only so many hours in the day, and people have to pick their battles. Lead exposure via SCUBA weights is a risk small enough to ignore. Just wash your hands after handling and before eating, and the risk is nil.
Actually, you can start using non-toxic weights today--U.S. nickels are readily available at any local bank! :)

As for hand washing - while that helps, lead particles still contaminate dive gear and transfer to skin during use. Why accept *any* lead exposure when there's an accessible, affordable alternative?
 
You can do whatever you want with your nickels so long as you don’t alter them and then try to pass them off as nickels.

For hard weights I use coated weights but I also use soft weights and these are not ideal, the shot in them will form an oxidizing coat but it rubs right off from shot to shot contact and the residue will start to show itself if you pay attention.

For most of us the exposure is minimal but keep in mind lead is not good for you at all, trying to stuff off the hazard by citing sharks or fire in the BBQ is a bit silly, fire is great until it’s in your bed with you.

I think there could be a future place for cast Monel weights and maybe some soft weights made with pellets but they will prove costly. For now lead is king for this.
 
I once worked at an indoor range and had a colleague that also smelted and cast lead bullets on a commercial basis. He had annual checks of lead concentration in his blood. Never crossed into a problematic concentration.
I briefly owned a small bullet casting shop. I had two employees who spent their days in a 1200 square foot (110 square meter) hand inspecting bullets or running the luber/sizer machine while 2-4 casting machines (a pool of molten lead that gets deposited into a wheel of molds at the top and opened and dropped into a bucket at the bottom) were constantly running in the background requiring regular top ups with lead alloy ingots.

We had no special protective equipment. It was Southern California so we kept the loading door that pretty much covered the front wall of the office open and used fans to keep relatively cool. Smelting stopped when it got over 90 degrees. But no respirators, masks or even gloves. Only hand washing before breaks and only eating or drinking in the shop office after hand washing.

One of the employers had been doing this for 25 years, the other for 3. Both got annual checks for lead concentration and had no problems.

The reason for this is that solid lead is incredibly stable. It doesn't easily separate into dust or airborne fragments. Unlike water where you get vapor at basically all temperature, lead fumes are only emitted once it gets to over 100C over the temperature you use for casting.

Lead is not absorbed through the skin. It becomes a problem when you ingest it directly which is why it was removed from paint (kids would eat paint chips since lead is sweet) and potable water piping and waterfowl hunting shot (waterfowl and bottom feeding fish would ingest the pellets) or breathe it in via synthetic airborne compounds which is why tetraethyl lead was removed from gasoline.

But contamination from handling of solid elemental or alloyed lead is a trivial problem that can be avoided by simple hand washing after handling.
 
What about zinc?
I have a lot of boat zincs laying around. I know there are lead zinc blends in things like filler rods for auto body work doing antique restos etc. where they still do seam fills with lead/zinc mixtures.
Tire weights are also a mixture.
What about lead use in commercial fishing? Everything from nets to crab line has lead weights, weight balls used for salmon trolling. What about all the sinkers used by recreational fishing and how much of that gets lost?
How many weighbelts have you dumped? I have never had to dump a belt nor have I accidentally dropped a belt.
How much naturally occurring lead contamination happens on Earth, IDK?
I think mercury is probably a bigger problem.
What about boat bottoms world wide? What about some of the deadliest anti fouling compounds used by the military on ship bottoms?
In many countries you can get viles of pure arsenic that you can pour into your gallons of bottom paint for your boat. I know a guy who gets the bottoms done on his boat in Mexico just for this.
Exposing your weightbelt in the ocean for a few hours every once in a while is not going to have any measurable impact at all.

There is a lot of scrap lead around that is easy to mold into weights. It has already been mined and and refined, it just needs to be reformed and put into use.
What does it take to make nickels and what is the environmental impact from mining to end product just to make dive weights out of them? How does this affect an already shorted coin supply I hear about. Is this really a responsible option?
How many divers are in the water world wide at any given time wearing lead as compared to all the other ills of environmental contamination happening world wide 24/7?

I think this thread is bordering on absurd.
 
Why not use gold, or tungsten.
Those would work, but are expensive. Platinum would actually be even better and less costly than gold. Tungsten can be had for a lower price (although the best price I can find is ~$100/lb here, but I hear lower prices are possible), but is hard to source and even harder to shape.

Coins are easily obtained at any bank and are "recyclable" for 100% face value at any bank and some shops (within reason :) )
 
Those would work, but are expensive. Platinum would actually be even better and less costly than gold. Tungsten can be had for a lower price (although the best price I can find is ~$100/lb here, but I hear lower prices are possible), but is hard to source and even harder to shape.

Coins are easily obtained at any bank and are "recyclable" for 100% face value at any bank and some shops (within reason :) )
Let's kill two birds with one stone: depleted uranium
-70% denser than lead
-companies pay you money if you take it from them
 

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