spurtill
Guest
I've both Apex ATX 200 and ScubaPro MK25 and i'd be inclined to go Scubapro (find it performs better at depth, but that could just be an adjustment issue), but as everyone has said either reg is fantanstic.
Regulator question.
- Thread starter oharag
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When I was considering my last reg purchase, I heard the same thing about the ATX50. I decided that I don't really spend enough time upside down to be concerned with the slightly wet breathing reported in that position. I was also aware of possible bubble interference problems. I went ahead and got the reg and I'm glad I did. I haven't yet noticed it being wet while inverted nor any bubble interference (perhaps I have an odd shaped face). I haven't had a chance to get it into cold water yet but I have used it in some very silty conditions-- we were digging for crystals on a dive stirring up a LOT of silt-- with my last reg, I would have worried about all of that stuff getting into the 1st stage.
All in all, I'm very happy with my ATX50/DS4 and I'm glad I chose that instead of a ScubaPro.
buff
Contributor
The inconsistencies of Divernet reports with regards to objective and subjective statements just shows exactly how close all those regs. are in quality and air delivery.
I like my Cyklon and they make it sound like the thing is used to inflate derrigables with it's "blast" of air-it's a little different but not that big of deal. I like my Apeks but I wouldn't say it's the God's gift to SCUBA.
They are regs. and most are just fine to use. I like my Poseidon's because they are side breathers and that puts less strain on my TMJ afflicted jaw-that and cold water performance make those my first choice but I would use just about any reg. by a well-known manufacturer.
I like my Cyklon and they make it sound like the thing is used to inflate derrigables with it's "blast" of air-it's a little different but not that big of deal. I like my Apeks but I wouldn't say it's the God's gift to SCUBA.
They are regs. and most are just fine to use. I like my Poseidon's because they are side breathers and that puts less strain on my TMJ afflicted jaw-that and cold water performance make those my first choice but I would use just about any reg. by a well-known manufacturer.
Kevin Ripley
Yeah, won't be doing that anytime soon. I'll be diving mostly NJ, Virginia and NC. The environment will be Wreck Diving. Maybe this is cold enough for either reg (DR, Apek or SP) to freeze up. But, I guess the environment could get dirty? Just an afterthought on my part. Who knows if I will not being diving the Artic in the foreseeable future
My philosophy about buying equipment today is where will it take me in the future. My brother regrets buying the equipment he bought (at full LDS retail), and now has to buy new stuff after two years of diving.
No. The shop I took my lessons through is a Dive-Rite and ScubaPro auth dealer. They display SP mostly, and use SP for their classes. My instructor claims he knows the President of DR personally. Who knows if he is blowing smoke up the rear
I do respect my instructors experiences and knowledge though. He seems to be fairly open with his recommendations. He doesn't dislike SP. He likes DR, and even states he may go Apek. And, he also claims to like Oceanic. As for Atomics, he states they are way overpriced. I've read other comments about regs on this board, and on Rodales. Nothing else seems to be coming up on my radar screen. My instructor has stated that Apek makes the DR regs for them. I know Apek does manufacturer regs for other companies as well. Both the Apek and DR sound too familiar (ie. diaphragm 1sts, easy to break down and service 2nds).
My goal here is to buy the most reliable, easy breathing, flexible, competent, least costly reg out there Again, I like the DR policy of providing rebuild kits and instructions to anyone. Also, their free parts policy as well.
Kevin, I will look at Apeks as well given your glowing endorsement. Thanks for your input!
Kevin, if I purchase Apeks through Leisurepro what do I lose? Would an authorized Apek dealer even touch this with a 10 foot pole? I was told that my LDS SP dealer would service my regs. Just at a higher price though ($60 instead of $40).
Also, can you purchase refurb kits for your Apek's, and do the service yourself (like you can with DR)?
buff
I knew I was going to get someone upset My initial question really is not another
JohnnyQuest
Reading the link you provided makes my want to go with Atomics now!!!!!!! I'm confused. The Atomics were very comfortable, easy breathing, never free flowed and had no bubble interference. Which sounds awesome to me! Also, they claim to be easy to disassemble in the field. Too bad they are costly.
Right now I'll focus on the Apek, DR, SP and Atomics.
Yeah, won't be doing that anytime soon. I'll be diving mostly NJ, Virginia and NC. The environment will be Wreck Diving. Maybe this is cold enough for either reg (DR, Apek or SP) to freeze up. But, I guess the environment could get dirty? Just an afterthought on my part. Who knows if I will not being diving the Artic in the foreseeable future
My philosophy about buying equipment today is where will it take me in the future. My brother regrets buying the equipment he bought (at full LDS retail), and now has to buy new stuff after two years of diving.No. The shop I took my lessons through is a Dive-Rite and ScubaPro auth dealer. They display SP mostly, and use SP for their classes. My instructor claims he knows the President of DR personally. Who knows if he is blowing smoke up the rear
I do respect my instructors experiences and knowledge though. He seems to be fairly open with his recommendations. He doesn't dislike SP. He likes DR, and even states he may go Apek. And, he also claims to like Oceanic. As for Atomics, he states they are way overpriced. I've read other comments about regs on this board, and on Rodales. Nothing else seems to be coming up on my radar screen. My instructor has stated that Apek makes the DR regs for them. I know Apek does manufacturer regs for other companies as well. Both the Apek and DR sound too familiar (ie. diaphragm 1sts, easy to break down and service 2nds).My goal here is to buy the most reliable, easy breathing, flexible, competent, least costly reg out there
Again, I like the DR policy of providing rebuild kits and instructions to anyone. Also, their free parts policy as well.Kevin, I will look at Apeks as well given your glowing endorsement. Thanks for your input!
Kevin, if I purchase Apeks through Leisurepro what do I lose? Would an authorized Apek dealer even touch this with a 10 foot pole? I was told that my LDS SP dealer would service my regs. Just at a higher price though ($60 instead of $40).
Also, can you purchase refurb kits for your Apek's, and do the service yourself (like you can with DR)?
buff
I knew I was going to get someone upset
My initial question really is not another
Sure I was interested in the SP vs DR reg issues (ie. diaphragm vs piston, cold vs. not cold, dirty vs. not dirty). Yes, there really are many, many, many fine regs out there. Too many for my liking. That's why I tried narrowing my focus on SP and DR (and maybe Apek thinking that they are the same reg as DR???). I'm trying to use what the industry is proclaiming, what the LDS's are proclaiming, what my brother is proclaiming, what my teacher is proclaiming, and finally what you guys are proclaiming to try to narrow down my options. Thanks for your input
JohnnyQuest
Reading the link you provided makes my want to go with Atomics now!!!!!!! I'm confused. The Atomics were very comfortable, easy breathing, never free flowed and had no bubble interference. Which sounds awesome to me! Also, they claim to be easy to disassemble in the field. Too bad they are costly.
Right now I'll focus on the Apek, DR, SP and Atomics.
nyresq
Contributor
The OPV in the poseidon first stages was built in for the jetstream/odin second stage not the cyklon. It just happens that both use the same first stage. if properly maintained by a knowlegble poseidon tech there should not be any creep. Poseidons are very finiky first stages that take some real learned experience to work on properly.
Thats why I took my Cyklon seconds and put them on oceanic diaphragm first stages. Cyklon second stages can be rebuilt by a third grader with no special tools. They are easy to adjust and once set are bomb proof. the first stages are another story, to hard to work on, pain to adjust
The jetstreams will lock up and get tighter if the IP gets too high. If it continues to climb somthing has to let go, most likely a hose.
The design of the jetstream/odin servo valve, has the valve held closed by the ip pressure on the inside of the second stage. The small rubber "valve" is held tight by the pressure, so the higher the pressure the harder to open it, if the ip slips up to say 250psi, the valve will be damm near impossible to open. so if it keeps going up, something will blow, thats the reason for the OPV built into the first stage.
The cyklon has a rubber pad held against the seat by a spring under tension. when the diver inhales the pad moves back and air flows around it. If the ip in a cyklon starts to increase it will blow off as only spring pressure holds the pad in place. If you have the "cracking pressure" in a cyklon set very low it will hiss if you crank up the ip, or if the ip starts to creep on its own it will freeflow.
this is a classic example of an upstream design vs downstream design in a second stage.
This is why an jetstream/odin should never be used on a first stage other than a poseidon without an OPV or a standard octopus on a different LP port.
Now back to the thread......
Parts for Apeks regs can be had from online dealers overseas if you are a DIY kind of person.
If you buy from a dealer the parts are covered under warranty by many different brands. scubapro and apeks are just two that come to mind. if you buy these same brands from a place like LP then they have no parts warranty but you still should be able to get them serviced by any dealer. you'll just have to pay for parts and it may get expensive. its the same as if you bought them used from another diver, the warranty doesn't transfer with the regs.
Some dealers will get whiney about you not buying them from a "authorized" dealer but this is easy to solve. Just say you bought them used from a friend and want them checked before you dive with them.
If you are a DIY and service your own regs, the parts warranties arent worth the extra price you'll pay from a dealer. The difference may be as much as $200 for a single regulator. parts can be had for a full overhaul for as little as $10. shops will charge double that for the parts so if you plan on having them serviced by a dealer then it may be worth the extrap money to buy from them.
Thats why I took my Cyklon seconds and put them on oceanic diaphragm first stages. Cyklon second stages can be rebuilt by a third grader with no special tools. They are easy to adjust and once set are bomb proof. the first stages are another story, to hard to work on, pain to adjust
The jetstreams will lock up and get tighter if the IP gets too high. If it continues to climb somthing has to let go, most likely a hose.
The design of the jetstream/odin servo valve, has the valve held closed by the ip pressure on the inside of the second stage. The small rubber "valve" is held tight by the pressure, so the higher the pressure the harder to open it, if the ip slips up to say 250psi, the valve will be damm near impossible to open. so if it keeps going up, something will blow, thats the reason for the OPV built into the first stage.
The cyklon has a rubber pad held against the seat by a spring under tension. when the diver inhales the pad moves back and air flows around it. If the ip in a cyklon starts to increase it will blow off as only spring pressure holds the pad in place. If you have the "cracking pressure" in a cyklon set very low it will hiss if you crank up the ip, or if the ip starts to creep on its own it will freeflow.
this is a classic example of an upstream design vs downstream design in a second stage.
This is why an jetstream/odin should never be used on a first stage other than a poseidon without an OPV or a standard octopus on a different LP port.
Now back to the thread......
Parts for Apeks regs can be had from online dealers overseas if you are a DIY kind of person.
If you buy from a dealer the parts are covered under warranty by many different brands. scubapro and apeks are just two that come to mind. if you buy these same brands from a place like LP then they have no parts warranty but you still should be able to get them serviced by any dealer. you'll just have to pay for parts and it may get expensive. its the same as if you bought them used from another diver, the warranty doesn't transfer with the regs.
Some dealers will get whiney about you not buying them from a "authorized" dealer but this is easy to solve. Just say you bought them used from a friend and want them checked before you dive with them.
If you are a DIY and service your own regs, the parts warranties arent worth the extra price you'll pay from a dealer. The difference may be as much as $200 for a single regulator. parts can be had for a full overhaul for as little as $10. shops will charge double that for the parts so if you plan on having them serviced by a dealer then it may be worth the extrap money to buy from them.
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