WeldonDowd
Contributor
Can anyone tell me what skills are reviewed in a refresher coarse, let's say PADI's. Is it book work, pool work, or both. Certainly it's not a complete ow coarse, but which skills or theory do they reintroduce?
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PADI requires:
The fifteen confined water skills are:
I have however taken a scuba review with a shop which didn't have enough call for a Scuba Review program. So they just charged half the price and gave you the full Open Water confined water portion.
- Knowledge review assessment
- Confined water skills assessment
- Optional open water (same as Discover Local Diving)
The fifteen confined water skills are:
- Assemble, adjust, prepare, put on and disassemble scuba equipment.
- Perform a predive safety check.
- Demonstrate appropriate deep-water entry.
- Adjust for proper weighting float at eye level at the surface with no or minimal air in the BCD, while holding a normal breath.
- Alternately breathe from snorkel and regulator without lifting the face from the water.
- Descend using the five-point method.
- Recover and clear a regulator at depth.
- Remove, replace and clear the mask.
- Respond to air depletion by signaling out of air, and securing and breathing from an alternate air source supplied by a buddy. Continue for at least one minute while swimming.
- Ascend properly using an alternate air source and establish positive buoyancy at the surface.
- Breathe effectively from a free-flowing regulator for at least 30 seconds.
- Become neutrally buoyant underwater by pivoting on fin tips (or other point of contact, if appropriate), using both oral and low-pressure BCD inflation.
- Ascend using the five-point method.
- Remove, replace, adjust and secure the weight system at the surface in water too deep in which to stand, with minimal assistance (PADI Scuba Divers remove only).
- Simulate a controlled emergency swimming ascent by swimming horizontally for at least 9 metres/30 feet while emitting a continuous sound.
I have however taken a scuba review with a shop which didn't have enough call for a Scuba Review program. So they just charged half the price and gave you the full Open Water confined water portion.
A proper refresher should be tailored to the student. It should cover all the skills, a good review of classroom material, and if necessary and possible I like to do a couple OW dives. It all depends on the student and how long they have been out of the water, who trained them initially, and what they are going to do with the refresher. A diver out of the water for a year who trained in a less than comprehensive program is going to get a lot more than one of my students who has been out for 6 months. A refresher by the book is not always the best choice.
In an ideal world Jim is right.
Shops in my area assume a refresher course costs less than a full OW course. They charge for the minimum requirements and give you the minimum requirements.
I did maybe 10 dives after certification then didn't dive for almost 2 years. I needed more than a PADI Scuba Review. I took the full OW class again. A lot of it came back to me as I took the course a second time but it was good to go over the material completely. The instructor gave me the same attention he gave any other student so I saw no reason I shouldn't pay the same price as the other students. Heck, it was cheaper than my first certification. Essentially, I decided what I needed and paid a little extra for it.
Shops in my area assume a refresher course costs less than a full OW course. They charge for the minimum requirements and give you the minimum requirements.
I did maybe 10 dives after certification then didn't dive for almost 2 years. I needed more than a PADI Scuba Review. I took the full OW class again. A lot of it came back to me as I took the course a second time but it was good to go over the material completely. The instructor gave me the same attention he gave any other student so I saw no reason I shouldn't pay the same price as the other students. Heck, it was cheaper than my first certification. Essentially, I decided what I needed and paid a little extra for it.
Ow Review: Cost $100
Full Class: Cost $500 includes matterials and all fees
Time: 4-6 hours home study 45-60 minutes class 1-2 hours pool
OW/AOW Review: Cost $150
4-6 hours home study 45-60 minutes class 2-4 hours lake training facility
AOW Review: $100
Full Class: $250
2-4 hours lake training facility
*navigation review may be done free during any of our AOW lake days which include the search and recovery dive as well as a navigation dive for AOW which we offer bimonthly.
Open Water:
Student spends a day or two prior to refresher rereading OW manual and watching dvd. Once the student arrives we do a 30 minute oral review of knowledge. They take OW Final Exam. Review exam. Look for A 90% or do further review, and retest after water skills.
Skill review.
Gear assembly. Asseble gear together student showing me, correct any mistakes.
BWRAF buddy check. Student goes first me second.
Deep water entry. Giant stride possitivly bouyant to pool
Snorkel to Shallow ledge on pool 5 foot (underwater switch of reg to snorkel)
discuss skills for next set. mask flood clear, reg recovery, follow the leader swim
checking bouyancy
descend to knees and do skills. I demonstrate student repeats.
if skills are ok decend to deep end of pool *15 foot* do a swim I lead they follow 2-3 laps then switch and do 2-3 laps stopping and holding location *hover skill* surface watching depth gauge.
If skills were not ok surface discuss and repeat until skills are adequete
Discuss skills and boyancy, descuss next skill set. fin pivot, gear removal *place a rubber band on tank valve to simulate an entanglment and have them remove the band*, no mask swim, ooa doner could be executed anytime during this skill set.
During skill set if student is not paying attention is when OOA will happen other wise at end of dive.
discuss previous skills and go over the next dive. ooa reciever, cramp removal, smb deployment with reel from bottom.
go over skills and discuss next set CESA, weight removal and replacement, deep water exit. pool is 15 feet deep and 25 feet long student does cesa diaganally ending at deep later. Upon surfacing remove weight and replace * would drop in real situation if necsesary. exit water removing fins keeping mask on reg in. Head to seat and remove gear.
Go over all skills asking student if any skills they felt needed more attention, if so go back to pool and redo reviews.
AOW:
same as ow except pool work will be done in lake. average vis in lake 15-25 feet depth ranges 10-30 feet
Set 100 foot line to get kick cycle count. time count.
do out and back of 50, 100, and 150 foot lengths.
do triangle, and square 150 foot sides right and left turns.
Relay course with slates to next point based on heading and distance. Relay set up with 9 points lengths of 50-300 foot right and left turns points include items such as boats, anchors, scuba tanks, pile of golf balls *mock rock pile* center point with a bouy *anchored boat/mooring ball*
During dive students will work as a team. Locate all items and document what item was there apon completing the dive
Do skills with lift bag. Lift Tank, lower tank, hover tank, lift anchor, lower anchor.
Map Lake along with relay points.
Full Class: Cost $500 includes matterials and all fees
Time: 4-6 hours home study 45-60 minutes class 1-2 hours pool
OW/AOW Review: Cost $150
4-6 hours home study 45-60 minutes class 2-4 hours lake training facility
AOW Review: $100
Full Class: $250
2-4 hours lake training facility
*navigation review may be done free during any of our AOW lake days which include the search and recovery dive as well as a navigation dive for AOW which we offer bimonthly.
Open Water:
Student spends a day or two prior to refresher rereading OW manual and watching dvd. Once the student arrives we do a 30 minute oral review of knowledge. They take OW Final Exam. Review exam. Look for A 90% or do further review, and retest after water skills.
Skill review.
Gear assembly. Asseble gear together student showing me, correct any mistakes.
BWRAF buddy check. Student goes first me second.
Deep water entry. Giant stride possitivly bouyant to pool
Snorkel to Shallow ledge on pool 5 foot (underwater switch of reg to snorkel)
discuss skills for next set. mask flood clear, reg recovery, follow the leader swim
checking bouyancy
descend to knees and do skills. I demonstrate student repeats.
if skills are ok decend to deep end of pool *15 foot* do a swim I lead they follow 2-3 laps then switch and do 2-3 laps stopping and holding location *hover skill* surface watching depth gauge.
If skills were not ok surface discuss and repeat until skills are adequete
Discuss skills and boyancy, descuss next skill set. fin pivot, gear removal *place a rubber band on tank valve to simulate an entanglment and have them remove the band*, no mask swim, ooa doner could be executed anytime during this skill set.
During skill set if student is not paying attention is when OOA will happen other wise at end of dive.
discuss previous skills and go over the next dive. ooa reciever, cramp removal, smb deployment with reel from bottom.
go over skills and discuss next set CESA, weight removal and replacement, deep water exit. pool is 15 feet deep and 25 feet long student does cesa diaganally ending at deep later. Upon surfacing remove weight and replace * would drop in real situation if necsesary. exit water removing fins keeping mask on reg in. Head to seat and remove gear.
Go over all skills asking student if any skills they felt needed more attention, if so go back to pool and redo reviews.
AOW:
same as ow except pool work will be done in lake. average vis in lake 15-25 feet depth ranges 10-30 feet
Set 100 foot line to get kick cycle count. time count.
do out and back of 50, 100, and 150 foot lengths.
do triangle, and square 150 foot sides right and left turns.
Relay course with slates to next point based on heading and distance. Relay set up with 9 points lengths of 50-300 foot right and left turns points include items such as boats, anchors, scuba tanks, pile of golf balls *mock rock pile* center point with a bouy *anchored boat/mooring ball*
During dive students will work as a team. Locate all items and document what item was there apon completing the dive
Do skills with lift bag. Lift Tank, lower tank, hover tank, lift anchor, lower anchor.
Map Lake along with relay points.
The Chairman
Chairman of the Board
What do you really need to relearn in an AOW? Everything? Probably not. Do you need an actual cert? Probably not. I recommend that most people simply go to the next level and do an AOW with an instructor with FULL disclosure upfront. My AOW consists of heading to a pool for work on trim, buoyancy and habits. Then at least 3 dives with very different goals During those dives, you're going to have to demonstrate exceptional buddy skills, adequate gas planning, navigational and situational awareness skills. In addition, you're going to learn some skills not required by the agencies like shooting a sausage with a reel.
Missed out the other 5 skills in a full scuba review...!
16. Hover
17. Swim without a mask
18. Remove and replace weights underwater
19. Remove and replace scuba underwater
20. Remove and replace scuba at the surface
Skills 1 - 15 are for those who have completed the "scuba diver" certification only...
In my view, I agree with Jim - that the refresher can be tailored to individual student's requirements and fortunately, I am given some leeway by my centre in how I can conduct that.
In the case of PADI, it's designed as a review of basic skills and knowledge, rather than re-teaching somebody to dive. If the person is really struggling, I will recommend they repeat the open water course, or stay out of the water altogether, in some cases. I have actually refused to allow people to dive after they have failed to complete essential skills such as removing and replacing their mask.
People who have taken an open water course should have reference material available to keep their theory fresh, although many of course forget it the moment they finish the class. Remediation is required if necessary but it's quite basic stuff - you're not going to go through any in-depth physics.
In my personal experience, most of the people who request a refresher don't really need it, because they are safe and conscientious divers to start with, albeit often inexperienced but they understand their limitations and want to buzz through some skills to remove the cobwebs. Conversely, those who complain when we require them to do a refresher are often the sort of diver who should get on eBay and swap their dive gear for golf clubs.
Cheers
C.
16. Hover
17. Swim without a mask
18. Remove and replace weights underwater
19. Remove and replace scuba underwater
20. Remove and replace scuba at the surface
Skills 1 - 15 are for those who have completed the "scuba diver" certification only...
In my view, I agree with Jim - that the refresher can be tailored to individual student's requirements and fortunately, I am given some leeway by my centre in how I can conduct that.
In the case of PADI, it's designed as a review of basic skills and knowledge, rather than re-teaching somebody to dive. If the person is really struggling, I will recommend they repeat the open water course, or stay out of the water altogether, in some cases. I have actually refused to allow people to dive after they have failed to complete essential skills such as removing and replacing their mask.
People who have taken an open water course should have reference material available to keep their theory fresh, although many of course forget it the moment they finish the class. Remediation is required if necessary but it's quite basic stuff - you're not going to go through any in-depth physics.
In my personal experience, most of the people who request a refresher don't really need it, because they are safe and conscientious divers to start with, albeit often inexperienced but they understand their limitations and want to buzz through some skills to remove the cobwebs. Conversely, those who complain when we require them to do a refresher are often the sort of diver who should get on eBay and swap their dive gear for golf clubs.
Cheers
C.
Good catch. I totally misread that section of the Instructor Manual.
In my view, I agree with Jim - that the refresher can be tailored to individual student's requirements and fortunately, I am given some leeway by my centre in how I can conduct that.
In the case of PADI, it's designed as a review of basic skills and knowledge, rather than re-teaching somebody to dive. If the person is really struggling, I will recommend they repeat the open water course, or stay out of the water altogether, in some cases. I have actually refused to allow people to dive after they have failed to complete essential skills such as removing and replacing their mask.
People who have taken an open water course should have reference material available to keep their theory fresh, although many of course forget it the moment they finish the class. Remediation is required if necessary but it's quite basic stuff - you're not going to go through any in-depth physics.
In my personal experience, most of the people who request a refresher don't really need it, because they are safe and conscientious divers to start with, albeit often inexperienced but they understand their limitations and want to buzz through some skills to remove the cobwebs. Conversely, those who complain when we require them to do a refresher are often the sort of diver who should get on eBay and swap their dive gear for golf clubs.
Cheers
C.
Totally agree with the last paragraph. When I first started diving I went a year without diving, twice. Each time I took a scuba review because the operators in the Caribbean wanted proof I'd (a) been diving within the last 12 months or (b) did a scuba review. I was happy to do it. This way I could put my regulator on and realize I should have put the BCD on first at home during the scuba review rather than looking like a dork at the resort.
Conversely, I went on a cruise two years ago. Some of the people diving with me could have benefited from a scuba review. One had the trimix computer, $10000 in photography equipment, dive flag tattoo, a 3mm shorty, etc. and she was wearing 30 lbs of lead. She'd empty the BCD, hit the coral hard enough to send up a cloud of dust, take some pictures, inflate the BCD and leap off the coral. At most ports we had 20 divers going out on the dive excursion. At one port the dive operator required EVERYONE to demonstrate mask clearing and regulator recovery before they'd take you out. Only four of us went diving at that port. None of us had any issue with demonstrating our skills.
I like the fact you refuse to let people dive after they failed to complete essential skills.
Can't remove and replace a mask in confined water? What are they going to do if it happens at 30 metres? It is not simply their failure as their attitude afterwards - I actually spent two tanks on one particular lady trying to rectify and remedy the problem but she didn't think it was an essential skill. I don't just toss people out because they can't do it first time - I will dedicate my time to trying to fix the problem if I can, but a point blank refusal? No way no sir am I going to allow that person in the water with a group of other divers for whom I am partially responsible. I have this lil issue with paperwork and court cases, don'tcha know.
Some dive centres/instructors will let this slide. I will not.
Cheers
C.
The place which required people to do the mask and regulator skills did so because it was a shore dive to a marine park. The swim out was underneath the channel local fishers used to come and go from the island. During a previous excursion someone had trouble with mask flooding. Rather than stay down and clear it, they went to the surface and got hit by a fishing boat. Since then it is required to show you can fix a mask problem under the water or at least get the guide to take you to an area which is safe to surface.
After diving there I realized how important dealing with issues underwater was. Every subsequent dive in the Caribbean I noticed how often a catamaran, glass bottom boat, fishing boat, etc. passed overhead. I've even seen a sailboat slide between two dive boats anchored at a dive site. You cannot assume all boats are going to honour the dive or alpha flags.
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