Rec Diving Then vs. Now

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So I call :gans: or the most detailed logbooks and photographic memories in existence


for anyone with one or two courses post twenty years ago and many more
dives to remember, much more than not much at all, with a very general
lack of detail, unless there was an oops or spouse meeting moment where
the courses were harder only because of what we read today and really that the course was coursed because it was the only course and because folks went semi prepared having read diving and coastal and seafaring books until the pages fell out and were otherwise already semi physical many with water competence that the real memory of the course after the boring class basics was to finish the course get out of the classroom and pool as quickly as was humanly possible and go diving and start learning which comes easiest whilst doing the fun bit repetitively.


The courses are the same, the people are the same, society is different.
 
The courses are the same, the people are the same, society is different.

Evidently there was big change in standards made in the early 70's and some people still can't accept it. These people will always think that how it used to be is "better" and many people equate "harder" with "more effective"... That's never going to change. Likewise there are even some (and yes, some on Scubaboard) who believe that opening up diving to the masses was a mistake. These ones will moan about training no matter what you do (or don't do) because they simply don't like their sport getting invaded by "the average" person.

But getting to your point, there *have* been changes made to the standards since I took my initial training in 1984...the courses are not "the same". Some changes were small and some less small. For example, the hover used to be 1 minute and it was reduced to 30 seconds, probably in response to pressure from resorts who were on tight schedules and getting in time trouble with the hover because hovering takes time to learn and it can't be learned at all (let alone badly) if you're in a big hurry to get the course done and you've had your students firmly planted on the bottom for the first 3 modules practicing nothing but underwater-waiting-in-line. Reducing this requirement was a clear case of caving in to commercial pressures and was not in the best interest of students, if you ask me. However, it *did* mean that more people could "learn to dive"..... or put another way, it made turbo-tempo instructors who were more interested in being done on a tight schedule feel better about how they failed to teach buoyancy control. Either way, people were certified and some of them became exceptionally good divers despite lowering the entrance criteria.

Other things have changed as well. The AOW course has been restructured since 1984 to fit in a weekend (probably in response to the needs of resorts as well) and the number of specialties has exploded. Some of this is for the best, some I have my doubts about and may have been done for commercial purposes.... which I don't necessarily see as a bad thing as long as it's also adding value to the student's learning experience.

Personally, although I like giving certain specialties, I don't like giving the AOW course because of the deep diving requirement. I have met few AOW students who I felt were ready for deep diving (...and some who clearly were) and given the entrance criteria I believe that no matter how good of an instructor you are the gap is too big to bridge with 1 dive. However; that's another story altogether and probably says more about me than it does about standards.... nevertheless I say "no" to most requests to run AOW because of this unless the student has some experience, wants it done 1:1 and are willing to do more practice dives than the course dictates, particularly with respect to navigation and deep. With respect to the topic at hand, I believe this has actually improved since 1984 because of the reduction in the depth recommendation from 40 metres to 30 metres.

The big change that happened recently is, of course, removal of buddy breathing. It used to be a necessary skill because not everyone had a (proper) octopus, but the gear (especially the acceptance of the octopus) has changed and improved a lot since the early 80's and one could argue that the skill is no longer necessary because of those improvements. I'm a fence sitter on this issue because one could also argue that options should be left open but I've found ways to put the time that got freed up by taking this out to good use. In the end, i'm confident that I train my students well enough that the chances that they'll ever be in a situation where buddy breathing would be their only way out is exceedingly remote.

So yes, some things have changed, but this notwithstanding I don't feel as though the average OW student was better trained in 1984 than they are today. Differently, in some respects, yes, but not better or worse.

R..
 
Has anybody gone through OW training, say, 20-years ago, then recently attended same training from the same agency? I really like to know how much the current training regimentations had laxed in standards as opposed to back then.

There have been some changes as several people pointed out but the biggest thing affecting quality is true today that was true 20 years ago....

1) A good instructor runs a good course and
2) A bad instructor runs a bad course
3) both of the above can happen within the framework laid out in standards.

Nothing *NOTHING* about this has changed. Anno 2011 there are some exceptional instructors out there and they are running exceptional courses and there are still 5-alarm boobs out there making train wrecks too.

People often think that standards dictate the quality of the course but the delivery of quality does not depend on how long your list of "monkey see, monkey do" items is.... Quality is delivered by carefully seeing to it that every student learned what they needed to learn. Ones who are nervous need time to calm down, for example. There is no standard saying "ensure your student gets in the groove and learns to relax his/her body and mind" but it's absolutely essential for how good your results will be. This is only one of many examples of something that some instructors understand, and some don't. It was like that "back in the day" and it's like that today too. And in 100 years, when we're all dead, it will still be like that.

R..
 
I started diving in the late 60s Android was certified in 1970. When I first started, there were no bc's. I remember my excitement with the may west with a straw inflator!! I remember when the SOS meter came out. My group did technical deco diving for years with NO mishaps. I remember when octopus on regs became the norm. I also remember when a certain cert agency started slicing training that most divers thought incredibly important out of their corriculum and charging extra for it. I didn't Android don't much like it.

I spent a lot of my diving in caves in the 70's. I have seen huge changes there for the better.

Much of the equipment has changed surprisingly little. I love the two computers I dive with. After over thirty years in jet fins, I have changed to very stiff split fins Android LEARNED how to properly use them. I easily keep up with the paddle finners with much less effort, even in vicious currents.

The biggest change in my diving with my dedication to UW photography. Wow, does that not constantly change?
 
It seems we have two different threads running in the same thread:

The OP's thread that started because of another thread; a 15 year layoff from diving leading to a question about differences in training over the past 20 years.

The not paying attention to the OP hijack thread where really old timers try to remember training over 25 years ago.

Come on people, 60's, 70's and 80's training is not the topic here...:shakehead:
 
My above post really pisses me off, BTW. I posted from my new Android devise and EVERY time I type "and" it defaults to android. GRRRR!!!!! I have to figure a way to disable this. Any suggestions? PM me.

Oh, and to halemano......

EXCUSE ME!!!!!!!
and get a life. My post did discuss recent equipment in response to negative info posted earlier.
 
My above post really pisses me off, BTW. I posted from my new Android devise and EVERY time I type "and" it defaults to android. GRRRR!!!!! I have to figure a way to disable this. Any suggestions? PM me.

Oh, and to halemano......

EXCUSE ME!!!!!!!
and get a life. My post did discuss recent equipment in response to negative info posted earlier.

Ahh..... now I get it. I thought you had a "secret friend" :eyebrow: LOL (there should be an "autocomplete" function in your settings somewhere ... turn it off)

R..
 
halemanō;5707339:
It seems we have two different threads running in the same thread:

The OP's thread that started because of another thread; a 15 year layoff from diving leading to a question about differences in training over the past 20 years.

The not paying attention to the OP hijack thread where really old timers try to remember training over 25 years ago.

Come on people, 60's, 70's and 80's training is not the topic here...:shakehead:

Halemano, with my original post I was really hoping to learn how a person's personal approach to recreational diving--i.e., how a person actually conducts his recreational diving--has changed in the last ~20 years. I really didn't intend for a diver to discuss training or equipment, except perhaps to help explain how/why his personal approach has changed over time (if in fact it has). My post #10 is an example of the type of response I was hoping for.

From my post #1:

... What I would like to know is whether and to what degree your approach to rec diving has changed over the last 20, say, years. Please describe ...

And from my post #25:

... I really intended people to write personally about how they themselves approach rec diving now versus when they rec dove ~20 years ago. Though I expected the replies to include some discussion about gear changes, I am really interested in individual approaches--you know, whether a person's individual approach has changed. I was surprised to realize that my individual approach has not changed much, and I wondered if this is common among divers who have been rec diving the last 20 years ...

I keep reading this thread with interest for those posts which address my original intent. I'm learning quite a bit! Much thanks to those whose responses address my original post.

Thanks,

Ronald
 
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When I got first certified in '87, we were toght how to properly plan dives, how to do deco and the word "emergency ascent" did not exist. We learned about physics and medicine, and a certain fitness level was required. Nobody told us that we would "die" when diving deeper that 40m (130ft) and for the highest certification you actually had to do some dives between 40m and 50m (165ft). And of course, just 50 dives somewhere easy and nice didn't cut it for that level. The continuing drop in requiriments both mentaly and physicaly are the biggest negative changes I see.

as i new diver, i am in the group that got very little training. i know this and as i can afford it i am trying to learn as much as i can and get the experience to build up skills. it kind of scares me though that i am alowed to dive with anyone less than a dive master with just the OW certification.
 
@rx7 (from the bottom of the first page)
with profit organizations like padi, new divers (i think) are only taught to dive to 130 fsw because the organizations can then charge them more to learn deco and deeper diving skills. on top of the profit motivation newer divers in gerneral are not quite as serious about diving and do not want to learn all the physiology and deco procedures, they just want to be able to swim right away and not have to do any work before the dive.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/teric/

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