Potential problems with Divemaster class

[aceupmysleeve777]

lets get this straight. You paid for a dm course and they want you to work for them at no pay filling tanks,cleaning vans etc..that is NOT part of required DM skills..If they gave you the course for free with the understanding that you work a few hours for them that may be something else. Do they have you covered under their workmans compensation insurance? You get hurt there working you are screwed.
DM intern is to assist with class academics/confined water and ow training dives, and learning to supervise divers and divers in training.. There are a required number of courses and ow dives that you are required to assist with,not just till they feel that it is ok..Anything else amount to slave labor. On top of that they have the nerve to charge you to simply go diving...RUN do not walk away from that situation. Is this going on in the United States??
As to gear ownership, at this level,even before ,usually at advance ow you really should have owned your own gear. I would ask why would someone want be a DM and not have made the commitment to own a complete set of gear ??.

Hopefully he posts again with some more info. Of course everything he's being asked to do is within reason with the class, but it can also be abused. I'm just thinking maybe he needs more dives to have the amount needed to finish the class, he must be doing boat dives and needing to rent gear which the store I work at would also charge a DM since by that time they should have all their own gear and boat dives aren't included in our stores prices. So $180 isn't off the chart if he's needing gear and boat diving. But we'll see.

 

[Mr Carcharodon]

Is there any other occupation where "Pro" means not only that you will not be paid but that you will you have to pay someone to work? And on top of it all you will have to do menial tasks unrelated to your goal. To put this in perspective Los Angles County used to run instructor courses for $1200 and you would be done in three months. Of course they are a non-profit which might just have something to do with it. TSandM offered good advice go talk to your instructor, and get out of Dodge. Of course your really good shop will tell you the pot of gold is just over the horizon. Yeah there just might be a "potential" issue.

 

[japan-diver]

Sounds to me as you are getting taken advantage of. Hey we want you to work for free- (last I checked washing out vans was not part of the DM class) and pay for your dives also. This is not acceptable. We have many intern candidates that work and train with us to get their DM cert- if you are working you are paid either with cash money or free boat dives. Washing vans is not part of the DM class or internship- carrying a few tanks around the shop is part of diving. Sounds like the shop is liking the free worker and trying to get as much as possible out of you for the dives.

 

[EastCoastWreckDiver]

Thanks everyone so much for replying, I honestly thought I was alone without any help in this situation. I like the work I am doing, being a DM and doing some labor is just part of the job, I enjoy helping others and I look forward to doing it on a professioinal level. I do not rent any equipment btw, I own my own gear including a few pieces of extra gear providing that students have forgotton/broken that peice of equipment and I can be there to assist them in their time of need. Boat diving is approximately $140 for a day charter plus $20 bucks per nitrox 100's, usually a day charter consist of 2 dives so thats 140 plus 40 for two tanks. This has become so expensive for me because of the cost of living at the beach and the fact that I am paying for my own dives. There is another DM candidate who actually works for the shop and he is almost done with his DM class and its only been a little over a month. It looks like for me its going to take close to 3 an a half months, but he has more diving expierence than me so this is a factor. I am not complaining about doing work because as a dive professional I expect to work everday with long hours, but I dont want to feel like I am being taken advantage of. Please dont get me wrong, I am not being a slave everyday for this dive shop, I show up about 3-4 days per week for about 7-9 hours per day, this is not including DM classwork but assisting with other classes. I know that my diveshop is one of the best on the east coast and my instructor...well he is 100% for the dive shop so I am not going to get friendship from him, just a professional view of the class. I feel alone in this class and everyone who works for the shop is like a zombie in the fact that everyone there only incourages me to pay for more dives, the one person to give me actual advice is no longer talking to me so I really dont know if the dive shop has heard of them giving advice and shut them off from me completely. How can you suspect your dive shop of being unfair when the awards and comments you have heard from so many others are so positive? The reason I am wanting to complete the DM class asap is because I am going to be going for my IDC out of state and I want to complete it before my start date. I am not just rushing the class because I want to get done. If anyone needs more info from me just let me know and I will be glad to give it to you.

---------- Post Merged at 10:36 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 10:30 PM ----------

Also the class cost was $1100 paid in full before I started the class, I get free shore dives when assisting OW classes but this is not when they go on their first boat charter, I can pay for the charter and assist with the class or not go at all, still 2, 20 min dives for an OW class isnt such a bad deal if I am doing it 2x a month, I have no trouble getting the dives to pass my DM class, I can go to a quarry anyday and get my dives in to pass the course.

 

[Ordie]

Your instincts are correct. You are being taken advantage of. If you are on the boat assisting with a class you should not have to pay to DM a class. Is the instructor paying for his boat dives with the class. Do the other DMs have to pay for the their boat dives. Tell your instructor that you need him to sit down with you and lay out exactly what is required to fulfill the class requirements. Make him show you these requirements in the instructor manual. Rinsing out vans is NOT part of being a DM. Your class fee of $1100.00 should have covered everything required for your certification. Do not pay this shop another dime.

 

[supergaijin]

+1 to get out- and get some money back if you can.

Stand back and look at the situation. The fact is that you're paying over a thousand dollars to learn how to fill tanks, clean things and do a bit of DM theory?

There used to be a program years ago where DMs were trained basically for free in return for doing the work you've described and more- basically all the really grotty jobs, got givena hard time, hazed etc. but they were diving for free and learning things over time ie. 3-6 months and often ended up working either part-time (for money) or were offered work in another shop (again for money). It sounds like a teen movie cliche but they did happen. Emphasise the past tense.

You have paid money to do the same thing, but for bugger all in return.

Although it's hard to do, tell them where to shove one of their $20 Nitrox tanks. Hopefully you can get some money back. Without threatening try to drop the fact that "you're disappointed things didn't go as well as you thought, seeing that Scubaboard recommended the shop" etc. Basically let them know you're active on diving forums without threatening to do a smear campaign. May work, may not. But in your present situation- there is something to lose- and it's worth more than money.

 

[japan-diver]

You are getting screwed -I do not care what the review are- you paid $1100 for a DM course alone- and still have to pay for charter fees to help with classes is ridiculous. Being at the shop 3-4 days a week and paying for charters on top of that- you are being taken advantage of.

 

[Kitty_Kat]

Another for getting out of there. There's a line between paying your dues as a new (potential) DM and getting taken advantage of. I spent ~ 3 months as a DM intern working pool sessions 3 times a week and ocean dives both days every weekend, but I was never asked to pay for anything. There were four of us that went through the class together; three of us worked as interns way above and beyond the requirements of our "class", but that was our choice, one person just met the requirements of 2 classes. We all received our certs at the same time. Those of us that continued to work did not do it because it was something that the shop was making us do in order to get certified. We were there because we wanted to be (and obviously because we were the ones who wanted to get hired), but all of the instructors we worked with were very conscious of our situation. We never had to pay for air. If there was any problem with our gear, a rental replacement was always provided at no cost while we got it fixed. If we were assisting with a boat dive, it was provided to us at least at 50% off and sometimes completely free (I now know the instructors were covering it out of their pockets in these cases). Most of the instructors wouldn't allow us to pay for our own food after dives as a thank you and were always very appreciative for helping out on our time. And my class (done less than a year ago in the US) was less than half the cost of yours. You're getting ripped off.

I could understand your situation if you were living at some sort of a full time training facility where you were working in return for the course cost, but it doesn't sound like that's the case.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I'm going to jump on the dog pile and also say that you are getting screwed.
I've heard of DM's being strung out on doing the intern dives and that can go on and on because once instructors get a DM in the class they don't want to let them go especially if no new ones are coming in.
But everytime I did any DMing the tanks were free and there was never a charge to go on charters, the shop payed for that. We didn't have nitrox, but if there was a charge it wouldn't have been any $20!
Then you mentioned they made you buy gear?
Did they make you buy the gear they sell so students would see you in it?
I hope it was deeply discounted if that's the case. That's not unusual for shops to want all their staff outfitted in what they sell but usually manufacturers will have bonus plans where staff get outrageous deals on the latest stuff so they are walking diving models for their gear.
I would also consider contacting the certifying agency if things get really ugly and see what they say.
Explain to them what's going on and see what they recommend or course of action you should take. They may even contact the shop and tell them what they're doing ain't cool.
I just think they're a greedy shop and they think they found a sucker.

Best of luck to you.

 

[RonFrank]

I know that my diveshop is one of the best on the east coast

How do you know this? There are a ton of shops on the east coast. Why is this one of the best?

In any event unless you are pleasure Diving you are getting screwed. $20 for Nitrox, that's very expensive as most places charge a customer $15 including a tank rental. DM's get free air including Nitrox. You may want to consider doing this somewhere like Florida where things are cheaper and they do not need to be financing their shop via there DM candidates. Cleaning their Van.... really?